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That's what they say. I've said it. But I wonder if that's actually true? I don't know that it's been true in Atlanta. I don't know if it's true in LA. I don't even know if it's true in DC. Yeah TOD in DC has boomed, but it's been booming away from rail too.
Really!? Can you say Buckhead? Lindbergh? Midtown? Downtown Decatur? .... In LA there is numerous TOD along the LRT and HRT lines, not to mention downtown LA, which has blossomed into a dense, high-rise and walkable CBD in the last 2 decades, due almost entirely to the new Metro rapid transit system.... If you can't see these examples of TOD, you're not looking very hard.
Of course it is true. The degree to which it does this is certainly up for debate, but not whether or not it can have an effect whatsoever. Do you not see a difference between NYC/Chicago vs Atlanta/LA? Even DC as you say is somewhat in the middle and DC's was built relatively later. Certainly there are a multitude of factors at play so it's not like I'm suggesting NYC/Chicago look the way they look now entirely because of their rapid transit, but the growth and development has come in concert.
Exactly. It's the degree that I meant. The post I responded to said that cities could be reshaped. Maybe they can, but I wouldn't say that it's happened in LA or Atlanta yet.
Really!? Can you say Buckhead? Lindbergh? Midtown? Downtown Decatur? .... In LA there is numerous TOD along the LRT and HRT lines, not to mention downtown LA, which has blossomed into a dense, high-rise and walkable CBD in the last 2 decades, due almost entirely to the new Metro rapid transit system.... If you can't see these examples of TOD, you're not looking very hard.
Is that what you took from my post? I never said that I didn't see TOD.
LA has been building like crazy. Sometimes near rail, but often not. DTLA probably would have happened without rail. I live in DTLA and I use public transportation, but the large majority of my neighbors do not.
That's what they say. I've said it. But I wonder if that's actually true? I don't know that it's been true in Atlanta. I don't know if it's true in LA. I don't even know if it's true in DC. Yeah TOD in DC has boomed, but it's been booming away from rail too.
Where exactly has it "boomed away from rail too"? At the jurisdiction level, that is only the case in a single county (Loudoun).
Fairfax County: Tysons, Reston
Arlington: Rosslyn-Ballston
Alexandria: Potomac Yard, Eisenhower, Hoffman Center
District of Columbia: Navy Yard, NoMa, Downtown
Loudoun: Route 50 residential sprawl, Route 28 suburban business parks, and Dulles Toll Road Metrorail extension TOD.
Prince George's County: isn't booming anywhere.
Montgomery County: Clarksburg, but more growth along red line in Bethesda, White Flight, Shady Grove, Silver Spring, etc.
Location: The Greatest city on Earth: City of Atlanta Proper
8,485 posts, read 14,990,056 times
Reputation: 7333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlotte485
It's not about being better than other systems, it's about being better than a car in Atlanta. If it takes more hassle, more time, etc. on MARTA than by vehicle to get to destinations you need to get to in Atlanta, then it doesn't really matter if it's better than mass transit in Austin or anywhere else.
Hmm, well, you're in trouble because driving is always "better" than taking transit EVERYWHERE (this includes NYC or whatever magical land has better transit as you see it.) Why? Well, in a car you can get there on your own schedule and exit exactly where you want. With any transit system, that's not possible.
The point of transit is to move mass amounts of people to a destination. How long that takes really isn't as relevant as if it is possible or not.
There's a lot more I could say, but it would be a bit pointless since you already stated you've never used MARTA so you're only going off of assumptions. I've used transit in every city that has it in the South and Texas, and I can confidently say that MARTA is far better than all of them. Is it perfect? No, but perfect transit only exists in Tokyo.
Hmm, well, you're in trouble because driving is always "better" than taking transit EVERYWHERE (this includes NYC or whatever magical land has better transit as you see it.) Why? Well, in a car you can get there on your own schedule and exit exactly where you want. With any transit system, that's not possible.
The point of transit is to move mass amounts of people to a destination. How long that takes really isn't as relevant as if it is possible or not.
There's a lot more I could say, but it would be a bit pointless since you already stated you've never used MARTA so you're only going off of assumptions. I've used transit in every city that has it in the South and Texas, and I can confidently say that MARTA is far better than all of them. Is it perfect? No, but perfect transit only exists in Tokyo.
Far better? MARTA has done a good job at connecting all the hottest neighborhoods and points of interest. Probably better than any other Southern city, but it doesn't seem much further ahead than Dallas or Miami. Especially when it comes to coverage. Especially considering what ppl consider to be part of "Atlanta".
Far better? MARTA has done a good job at connecting all the hottest neighborhoods and points of interest. Probably better than any other Southern city, but it doesn't seem much further ahead than Dallas or Miami. Especially when it comes to coverage. Especially considering what ppl consider to be part of "Atlanta".
I ranked Miami ahead of Atlanta. For all of DART's coverage less people use it compared to Atlanta. Another thread listed the amount of workers that commute via transit in absolute and percentage. Out of the southern metros it was Miami first followed by Atlanta with Atlanta's numbers nearly doubling that of Dallas's in both cases.
Last edited by Atlanta Scientist; 11-11-2019 at 11:59 AM..
Reason: clarity
Location: The Greatest city on Earth: City of Atlanta Proper
8,485 posts, read 14,990,056 times
Reputation: 7333
Quote:
Originally Posted by polo89
Far better? MARTA has done a good job at connecting all the hottest neighborhoods and points of interest. Probably better than any other Southern city, but it doesn't seem much further ahead than Dallas or Miami. Especially when it comes to coverage. Especially considering what ppl consider to be part of "Atlanta".
Yes, I mean just look at the numbers.
Atlanta average daily transit ridership: 366,000
Miami average daily transit ridership: 255,000
Dallas average daily transit ridership: 224,000
Atlanta averages 110k to 140k more transit riders per day than either city, and that's in a metro that is smaller and doesn't have as much reach as certain metros. I mean, what's the point of it going far if only a few people utilize it?
As I said, the point of transit is to move mass amounts of people. MARTA does a far better job of that than any other Southern transit agency.
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