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California is easily winning the 2022 poll as well, for good reason.
Some of the most ambitious mass transit projects have been completed in CA cities since the last poll (BART extension to San Jose, Mid-Coast Trolley in San Diego, Light Rail "K Line" and Regional Connector opening this year in Los Angeles).
I hear "everyone" is moving to these Texas cities....shouldn't they be furiously building out mass transit infrastructure to accommodate this influx? Looks like they're pretty much standing still on that front.
I also hear "everything is bigger in Texas." In 2018, San Francisco completed a 1070 foot skyscraper in a seismic zone on a coastal peninsula. Nothing even close to that since then on Texas's ample, flat expanse, and no 1000 footer in 40 years.
I'm sure Texas has an equivalent to USC, UCLA, UC Berkeley, UCSD, Stanford, UC Irvine, Cal Tech, UC Davis.....just can't think of them off the top of my head!
Not sure what you’re meaning about TX not building mass transit. TX cities are very sprawly and suburban so transit cannot serve them easily (although Los Angeles isn’t much different in this regard)… DFW has plenty of rail coverage both intown and in the burbs. It’s just not used because people prefer to drive. Austin is investing between $7 and $10 Billion in light rail and BRT which is probably the largest investment a city it’s size has ever dedicated toward transit. Houston / DFW has plans on HSR between the two nodes, Houston is also looking to expand light rail out to Katy, although overall their rail expansion seems slower… California probably still has Texas beat in mass transit but by no means is Texas twiddling their thumbs on the matter.
As for tall buildings, I will agree DFW’s skyline is a bit lacking for a city it’s size but that is largely due to building height restrictions given their proximity to Love Field, which is similar to San Diego’s situation. Austin is building their first super tall @ approx 875 feet.
TX is a laggard in post ed compared to California and other states. TX does better in K-12.
Last edited by Need4Camaro; 05-15-2022 at 09:50 AM..
Not sure what you’re meaning about TX not building mass transit. TX cities are very sprawly and suburban so transit cannot serve them easily (although Los Angeles isn’t much different in this regard)… DFW has plenty of rail coverage both intown and in the burbs. It’s just not used because people prefer to drive. Austin is investing between $7 and $10 Billion in light rail and BRT which is probably the largest investment a city it’s size has ever dedicated toward transit. Houston / DFW has plans on HSR between the two nodes, Houston is also looking to expand light rail out to Katy, although overall their rail expansion seems slower… California probably still has Texas beat in mass transit but by no means is Texas twiddling their thumbs on the matter.
As for tall buildings, I will agree DFW’s skyline is a bit lacking for a city it’s size but that is largely due to building height restrictions given their proximity to Love Field, which is similar to San Diego’s situation. Austin is building their first super tall @ approx 875 feet.
TX is a laggard in post ed compared to California and other states. TX does better in K-12.
There is a very big difference between planning to build a light rail system and having actually broken ground and begun the project. Austin is still talk at this point.
If you're a 7 million MSA and you're only "looking" at expanding a 22 mile system, I'd say that qualifies as twiddling your thumbs.
There is a very big difference between planning to build a light rail system and having actually broken ground and begun the project. Austin is still talk at this point.
If you're a 7 million MSA and you're only "looking" at expanding a 22 mile system, I'd say that qualifies as twiddling your thumbs.
Sure anything can happen, but Austin voting approval for the system and the fact that the funding has been approved both locally and federally, along with several other factors (affordable housing, inflation accounted variables, ect) is a major milestone. I don't doubt there will be snags along the process, but getting rail pushed through in just about any American city at this point is a tedious process due to costs and it is not overnight that after funding is approved that ground is broken. Many cities do not make it past the approval process due to costs vs actual impact when it comes to rail expansion, so I still disagree with your claim that Texas is twiddling its thumbs. Rail is not as effective as it is in California, no - but you're making a statement implying that transit is largely ignored in the state which is factually incorrect.
As for Houston - Its rail system is not as robust as DFW's and yes it does leave much to be desired nor does Houston's rail hold a candle to Los Angeles or San Francisco but Houston's rail alone does not speak for the entire state. DFW's rail is far more robust, but is not used to near capacity due to last mile issues and the fact that it is easier to drive, that doesn't necessarily mean that the state is neglecting transit.. ..more so that transit is not optimized.
Sure anything can happen, but Austin voting approval for the system and the fact that the funding has been approved both locally and federally, along with several other factors (affordable housing, inflation accounted variables, ect) is a major milestone. I don't doubt there will be snags along the process, but getting rail pushed through in just about any American city at this point is a tedious process due to costs and it is not overnight that after funding is approved that ground is broken. Many cities do not make it past the approval process due to costs vs actual impact when it comes to rail expansion, so I still disagree with your claim that Texas is twiddling its thumbs. Rail is not as effective as it is in California, no - but you're making a statement implying that transit is largely ignored in the state which is factually incorrect.
As for Houston - Its rail system is not as robust as DFW's and yes it does leave much to be desired nor does Houston's rail hold a candle to Los Angeles or San Francisco but Houston's rail alone does not speak for the entire state. DFW's rail is far more robust, but is not used to near capacity due to last mile issues and the fact that it is easier to drive, that doesn't necessarily mean that the state is neglecting transit.. ..more so that transit is not optimized.
Probably more so that DFW and Houston have different "transit" needs than LA or San Francisco.
I find the obsession with rail as some hallmark of transit excellence to be quite amusing. What good is mass transit if no one uses it?
Not sure what you’re meaning about TX not building mass transit. TX cities are very sprawly and suburban so transit cannot serve them easily (although Los Angeles isn’t much different in this regard)… DFW has plenty of rail coverage both intown and in the burbs. It’s just not used because people prefer to drive. Austin is investing between $7 and $10 Billion in light rail and BRT which is probably the largest investment a city it’s size has ever dedicated toward transit. Houston / DFW has plans on HSR between the two nodes, Houston is also looking to expand light rail out to Katy, although overall their rail expansion seems slower… California probably still has Texas beat in mass transit but by no means is Texas twiddling their thumbs on the matter.
As for tall buildings, I will agree DFW’s skyline is a bit lacking for a city it’s size but that is largely due to building height restrictions given their proximity to Love Field, which is similar to San Diego’s situation. Austin is building their first super tall @ approx 875 feet.
TX is a laggard in post ed compared to California and other states. TX does better in K-12.
Yeah, Texas has one university that can go toe-to-toe with Stanford and UCLA. Its Rice. No other school in Texas really does.
What I do hate about these threads is that people who dont know both areas intimately comment based on things they think they no. Im obviously not talking about you, but when I read so many responses on this thread its clear at least half dont know what they are talking about. When someone says "Texas is desert" or "Texas food is BBQ", that person has never been to Houston.
Thanks to the Roe v Wade draft and finding out Texas (of course) has a trigger law that will ban abortion…I voted for California. I’m not gonna be a part of the mess, even hypothetically.
Pretty much this. I would've put them on par with each other, with an edge to Texas for COL. But quality of life just took a massive nosedive for women. I can't imagine wanting to willingly move to Texas now.
Probably more so that DFW and Houston have different "transit" needs than LA or San Francisco.
I find the obsession with rail as some hallmark of transit excellence to be quite amusing. What good is mass transit if no one uses it?
Much of the US is obsessed with cost cutting, to the point that we're not willing to build rail to go where people actually go. So many light/heavy rail routes are nothing more than preexisting Freight ROWs that were acquired to either bypass the need to build rail, and/or deal with eminent domain and land acquisitions.
Add in the fact that many places took years, even decades to implement Transit Oriented Development to help suffice healthy population growth around transit corridors. Add also, the Koch Brothers showing up when these transit proposals arise, convincing reactionaries and nimby's that they're better off having NOTHING, than having a starter line built to kick off regional transit systems. So we end up with endless car-first development that further facilitates sprawl, limiting the option for transit to even be utilized by said development. Rinse, wash, repeat x 10,000.
LA is the best overall city by far but Texas has more solid cities to choose from. Tie
2. Food. Which state has a better dining/restaurant scene?
Texas to me
3. K-12 Education. Great school districts in both Texas and California, mostly located in the major metro areas.
Texas surprisingly
4. Quality of Life. (Cost of living, commute times, air pollution, public education, weather, health). (Will Texas top California in pollution this decade? Can California slow down wildfires?)
They're very different places. California wins if you have a Texas-sized budget. Texas wins for average Joe
5. Friendliness. Which state has overall friendlier people? (are Texans less friendly today?)
Texas
6. Economic Prospects/Future. Both are fast growing economic powerhouses, which has the “brighter” future?
Texas short term probably California again in the longer term
7. Scenery. (Pacific coast and California mountains vs Texas Hill Country and Big Bend National Park).
CA lol not even close
8. Infrastructure. (Both states are known for their wide freeways and large airports. When factoring in highways, airports, and even mass transit, which state does it better?
Pretty comparable
9. Where would you rather live? Texas or California? (has Texas gone too far right? CA too far left?)
I'm morelikely to live in Texas since it's closer to what I know and cheaper. In an ideal world I think I'd pick Cali though. It's honestly close to a tie overall for me with a slight edge to TX for being more religious and more affordable
Yeah, Texas has one university that can go toe-to-toe with Stanford and UCLA. Its Rice. No other school in Texas really does.
What I do hate about these threads is that people who dont know both areas intimately comment based on things they think they no. Im obviously not talking about you, but when I read so many responses on this thread its clear at least half dont know what they are talking about. When someone says "Texas is desert" or "Texas food is BBQ", that person has never been to Houston.
UT Austin ranks higher than Rice (and for the most part UCLA for that matter) in pretty much any program of consequence. Engineering, CS, MBA programs, Law schools, etc. Berkeley is the 2nd heavy hitter in CA, not UCLA.. (don't get me wrong, UCLA is good as well but definitely a step down from Berkeley and a peer of UT).
UT also has Plan II honors program which is more prestigious than Rice for the liberal arts folks.
Last edited by whereiend; 05-18-2022 at 02:40 PM..
Much of the US is obsessed with cost cutting, to the point that we're not willing to build rail to go where people actually go. So many light/heavy rail routes are nothing more than preexisting Freight ROWs that were acquired to either bypass the need to build rail, and/or deal with eminent domain and land acquisitions.
Add in the fact that many places took years, even decades to implement Transit Oriented Development to help suffice healthy population growth around transit corridors. Add also, the Koch Brothers showing up when these transit proposals arise, convincing reactionaries and nimby's that they're better off having NOTHING, than having a starter line built to kick off regional transit systems. So we end up with endless car-first development that further facilitates sprawl, limiting the option for transit to even be utilized by said development. Rinse, wash, repeat x 10,000.
.....or, in the alternative, it's not some sort of Koch brothers conspiracy and people just aren't willing to pay for transit for whatever reason, despite their bloviating about transit or the lack thereof. And they're getting exactly what they want.
Transit in my city is funded by a 1% sales tax and fares. If you gave me a choice between paying 1% less sales tax and having transit, I would take the former without a second thought.
If people were willing to pay enough for mass transit for it to be solvent, someone would have made a profit providing it. There are like two transit systems on the face of the planet that are actually not bankrupt.
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