What does New York lack despite its size that other Acela metros have? (Florida, live)
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No it’s due to the vast number of Expats as well as overall cultural influence from being the Hemispheres most important city for a few centuries.
New Orleans and Miami have a fantastic local cuisine but it’s much much more limited because they’re both smaller and less cultural influence.
With international cuisine we pretty much accept that the size of immigrant groups not objective quality in the main driver of availability. But that isn’t true for regional foods? Because reasons?
Is a Boston Crème Pie better than a Biegnet? No but it’s spread faster and more widely cause Boston is the bigger more important city that sends its people all over the country,
New York has had negative domestic migration since like 1830 it’s not a new internet thing. It’s just a historical fact.
Why do you think Midtown Atlanta, Dallas, Nashville, Houston or Minneapolis exist? Because cities want to emulate New York and intentionally do so. Cleveland built its tallest building and Train Station and subway to “be like New York”.
It’s like pretending English Spread because it’s inherently a better language than Danish. And not because the British Empire was just more important and influential than Denmark.
Popular taste dictates McDonalds has the best bagels in the world as they sell more Mabel’s than anyone else.
Can't speak for or about Miami, but surely there is at least one Cajun/Creole restaurant near you, and the shelves of your local supermarket sport a bunch of products made in, originating from or associated with Louisiana. No, they're not all made in New Orleans, and tbf, Cajun country centers on Lafayette, but I would hardly call Louisiana cuisine "much more limited." Maybe you can't get beignets, but you can get dirty rice mix, and maybe even coffee with chicory.
(Edited to add: And speaking of "less cultural influence," where was jazz born?)
Someone else here pointed out upthread that there are several other cities much smaller than New York whose signature cuisines are nationally known. I grew up in one of them. Size isn't everything, especially when it comes to food. Pizza traveled beyond New York*, but the egg cream didn't.
*And while New York-style pizza is definitely a Thing, hardcore pizza buffs put its American birthplace in New Haven, Conn. And you can get damn good pizza in New Haven. (That's one thing Yalies have over Harvardians.)
Can't speak for or about Miami, but surely there is at least one Cajun/Creole restaurant near you, and the shelves of your local supermarket sport a bunch of products made in, originating from or associated with Louisiana. No, they're not all made in New Orleans, and tbf, Cajun country centers on Lafayette, but I would hardly call Louisiana cuisine "much more limited." Maybe you can't get beignets, but you can get dirty rice mix, and maybe even coffee with chicory.
(Edited to add: And speaking of "less cultural influence," where was jazz born?)
Someone else here pointed out upthread that there are several other cities much smaller than New York whose signature cuisines are nationally known. I grew up in one of them. Size isn't everything, especially when it comes to food. Pizza traveled beyond New York*, but the egg cream didn't.
*And while New York-style pizza is definitely a Thing, hardcore pizza buffs put its American birthplace in New Haven, Conn. And you can get damn good pizza in New Haven. (That's one thing Yalies have over Harvardians.)
Having a creole restaurant within a 15 mile radius is pretty different than like every bakery in the world selling bagels. And the Cheesecake Factory is one of the most well known causal dining places in America. Like it’s an order of magnitude difference.
The gap in access from Jambalaya to NY style Pizza is pretty enormous.
No it’s due to the vast number of Expats as well as overall cultural influence from being the Hemispheres most important city for a few centuries.
New Orleans and Miami have a fantastic local cuisine but it’s much much more limited because they’re both smaller and less cultural influence.
With international cuisine we pretty much accept that the size of immigrant groups not objective quality in the main driver of availability. But that isn’t true for regional foods? Because reasons?
Is a Boston Crème Pie better than a Biegnet? No but it’s spread faster and more widely cause Boston is the bigger more important city that sends its people all over the country,
New York has had negative domestic migration since like 1830 it’s not a new internet thing. It’s just a historical fact.
Why do you think Midtown Atlanta, Dallas, Nashville, Houston or Minneapolis exist? Because cities want to emulate New York and intentionally do so. Cleveland built its tallest building and Train Station and subway to “be like New York”.
It’s like pretending English Spread because it’s inherently a better language than Danish. And not because the British Empire was just more important and influential than Denmark.
Popular taste dictates McDonalds has the best bagels in the world as they sell more Mabel’s than anyone else.
You could say the same thing about London yet why aren't there regional cuisines loved and imitated the world over the way New York's have been for the last 50+ years?
Quite simply, it's because London and England in general weren't known for good local cuisine for basically forever. That's only changed in recent years.
You are wrong. As I said it's about the quality of the cuisine in a specific local region, not all of the other factors you're bringing up to try and minimize that.
No offense but you're showing your age. I've never seen spongebob in my life as it was a kids show that came out right as I was graduating college. And I've definitely never heard of canned bread lol Sounds disgusting.
It's not as much about being regional as it is about being good. If canned bread was so good don't you think it would've spread beyond a certain region? The obvious answer is Yes. New Orleans is smaller than Boston but some of their regional favorites like Creole, Beignets and Jambalaya are known well outside of their local region. Kansas City BBQ is well known outside out its region. It's because those regional cuisines are damn good and people from all over like them and then from there, those foods blow up. It's not as black and white or simple as well because it's from "said city" it gets overly hyped. That's not how it works especially for foods that people from all over generally love and seek out. I can assure you that canned bread is not one of them lol
Sounds like Btown is just hating on NYC because we have produced so many regional cuisine favorites like bagels, pizza, pastrami, delis that have spread the world over because they are damn good. And these favorites have been going on wayyy before the internet or over capitalization so it's not like they're new.
Quality and taste buds matter.
Well yeah im in my 20s. Most people are under 35 now. Of course I am showing my age! Im young!
But yeah, Boston produced its fair share of foods/cuisine (chocolate chip cookies, clam chowder, cream pie, boston cream pie, whoopie pies, fluff/marshmallow stuff, etc were either invented or popularized in Boston… btown was pointing the foods that hadnt made it out of Boston, like canned bread or chow mein sandwiches. Again, its 12x smaller. It will have 12x less influence. I dont think anyone is arguing that. NYC definitely wins with the food inventions, thats not Boston’s strongsuit… inventions in tech are. Not food. Thats where Boston creams (no pun intended) New York. Food wise, yeah NYC kills it. And
But tbf, btown and all other posters are defending just as much as there is NYC boosting on here. So its a wash. You both are right. Im reading his posts again, its not NYC hating, its just a “????” At saying NYC is the best at everything and noone else matters. Thats what point he was making.
NYC has pioneered a lot of great food, but lets not get carried away. I live here too and have lived in 7 states, you definitely are exaggerating a bit. But thats bound to happen when two sides go back and forth. The talking down and saying “its the best, world class, youre wrong” arguments, on both sides, just make people less likely to believe the argument.
I think we all need a tone change
Last edited by masssachoicetts; 08-18-2023 at 08:09 AM..
You could say the same thing about London yet why aren't there regional cuisines loved and imitated the world over the way New York's have been for the last 50+ years?
Quite simply, it's because London and England in general weren't known for good local cuisine for basically forever. That's only changed in recent years.
You are wrong. As I said it's about the quality of the cuisine in a specific local region, not all of the other factors you're bringing up to try and minimize that.
I mean literally everything your typical American diner food comes from England (eggs, sausage, toast, beans). The typical roast dinner is English. The propensity for Sandwiches was imported from England. Meat pies are popular from Australia to Jamaica because of the English. You’re just being ignorant not making a good point
The basis of American cuisine is English. Why? Because a bunch of English people came here. I’d also like to point out Irish pubs are probably the most popular “ethnic” restaurant in the world and is functionally identical to English food (due to 1,000 years of colonization) but repackaged cause England is less popular than Ireland.
To a greater extent than New York London has globalized its local cuisine to the point where it’s considered to barely exist by people whose horizon stretches back to just WWII
I mean literally everything your typical American diner food comes from England (eggs, sausage, toast, beans). The typical roast dinner is English. The propensity for Sandwiches was imported from England. Meat pies are popular from Australia to Jamaica because of the English. You’re just being ignorant not making a good point
The basis of American cuisine is English. Why? Because a bunch of English people came here. I’d also like to point out Irish pubs are probably the most popular “ethnic” restaurant in the world and is functionally identical to English food (due to 1,000 years of colonization) but repackaged cause England is less popular than Ireland.
To a greater extent than New York London has globalized its local cuisine to the point where it’s considered to barely exist by people whose horizon stretches back to just WWII
London cuisine was absolute ****e forever! You are mixing colonialism with quality/taste buds. Two entirely different things. No tourist who isn't from a former British colonial state is going to ever say "damn I long for those amazing English fill in the blanks"!
Now I know you're just hating on NYC because you've tried to shift the argument unsuccessfully from foods that are loved the world over to foods that are well known because that was all they were exposed to ie former British ruled countries.
No one liked British food unless you had no choice and that's all you knew ie Jamaica, Australia, Canada and the rest. Local NYC cuisines like bagels, pizza, delis are loved the world over. British local foods? Hell No!
I’m suffering from a horrible jet lag but what???????
To quote Talking Heads, stop making sense.
Lol for real. Clearly his exposure to good local foods is highly limited. He really lost me once he tried to claim that McDonald's and former British foods were the best. Smdh. Reach and taste are two entirely different things.
London cuisine was absolute ****e forever! You are mixing colonialism with popularity. Two entirely different things. No tourist who isn't from a former British colonial state is going to ever say "damn I long for those amazing English fill in the blanks"!
Now I know you're just hating on NYC because you've tried to shift the argument unsuccessfully from foods that are loved the world over to foods that are well known because that was all they were exposed to ie former British ruled countries.
No one liked British food unless you had no choice and that's all you knew ie Jamaica, Australia, Canada and the rest. Local NYC cuisines like bagels, pizza, delis are loved the world over. British local foods? Hell No!
You lose.
I am not ethnically English (or British either) at all but do you know what I have for Thanksgiving every year? Effectively the same thing that Victorians had for Christmas dinner.
The point is that influence and power effect the spread of culture not just objective quality so the fact our Thanksgiving dinner is just an English roast dinner despite the fact “it sucks” is a point for me not you.
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