What does New York lack despite its size that other Acela metros have? (difference, California)
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Also I feel like Halal Plate is pretty much there in the name, that it’s really not from New York.
As with pretty much everything on that list, it’s either just not unique at all to New York (black and white cookies are sold by Entemanns for gods sake) or just ethnic foods easier to find in New York due to diverse immigrant communities (knishes) or just a local name for something pretty ubiquitous (chopped cheese)
The halal plate in NYC is a specific combo, it's not a generic plate of random food that's halal. It certainly uses ingredients that could be found elsewhere, but it's a pretty specific set of things. I think you mentioned the Rochester garbage plate at some point and that's in a similar vein of a plate of specific things that by themselves are arguably not that unique, but is sold as a singular item.
Something called knish (and bialy) does exist elsewhere, but the knish found in NYC is specific to NYC and the surrounding area, and it certainly isn't easy to find in other parts of the US. There is an Entemanns black and white cookie and Entemann is a NYC-founded company that does mass production of them, but the black and white cookie doesn't seem to be distributed very far as I tried to put in a zipcode of every major city in the northeast corridor with a 20 mile radius and got bupkis except for NYC. Chopped cheese is not ubiquitous--I'm not sure I've seen it anywhere else though perhaps it pops up randomly but it wouldn't be what I call ubiquitous in the other NYC metropolitan areas--what is the local name for chopped cheese where you are? Egg cream also doesn't seem to be found everywhere either. To me, it seems like you're making a case for these items that are pretty roundly applicable to a lot of other regional dishes from elsewhere in the US. What might help is if you listed the items for your local area so there's a better idea by example of what qualifies for you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarketStEl
The egg cream — which contains neither — is something that's unique to New York.
I've seen some people argue that the chopped cheese and the Philadelphia cheesesteak (another local specialty that's gone national) are cousins.
What's a "halal plate"? Clearly, it was created to cater to Muslim dietary needs, but I'd still be interested in knowing what's in it.
I think someone mentioned scrapple upthread. This "mystery meat," made from a mix of cornmeal and various unspecified parts of the pig ("scraps" from the slaughter, hence the name, I believe) and eaten for breakfast, originated in Amish country IIRC but is very much associated with Philadelphia (which is the big city located right next to Amish country). And it hasn't really spread much beyond the region.
There's almost always a white sauce and hot sauce available and often a bbq sauce or an herb-y green sauce and the sauces vary from place to place. The chicken and the rice are usually have a blend of aromatics to them which also varies from place to place. There's a little side salad and sometimes there's a little extra thrown in like a falafel or some grilled onions and peppers.
Last edited by OyCrumbler; 08-17-2023 at 10:19 AM..
Black and White Cookies are literally sold at Walmart, at least all across New England.
If you can buy it at Walmart 300 miles away. I don’t think it’s exclusive to New York.
A Chopped Cheese is just a local name for a steak and cheese.
If we are doing that like 1/3rd of Mass sub shops are local cuisine cause I’ve never seen Steak Bombs, Chicken Kabob Subs, Stir Fry Subs, Super Beefs, Chicken Bombs, etc more than maybe 30 miles from Boston. Hell the North Shore has its own kind of Pizza (Beach) which really isn’t found outside a 25 mile radius of Salisbury beach
New York has way less local cuisine than most east coast towns because it just doesn’t stay local for long.
A egg cream is just a chocolate float? It’s just called something silly.
The halal plate in NYC is a specific combo, it's not a generic plate of random food that's halal. It certainly uses ingredients that could be found elsewhere, but it's a pretty specific set of things. I think you mentioned the Rochester garbage plate at some point and that's in a similar vein of a plate of specific things that by themselves are arguably not that unique, but is sold as a singular item.
Something called knish (and bialy) does exist elsewhere, but the knish found in NYC is specific to NYC and the surrounding area, and it certainly isn't easy to find in other parts of the US. There is an Entemanns black and white cookie and Entemann is a NYC-founded company that does mass production of them, but the black and white cookie doesn't seem to be distributed very far as I tried to put in a zipcode of every major city in the northeast corridor with a 20 mile radius and got bupkis except for NYC. Chopped cheese is not ubiquitous--I'm not sure I've seen it anywhere else though perhaps it pops up randomly but it wouldn't be what I call ubiquitous in the other NYC metropolitan areas--what is the local name for chopped cheese where you are? Egg cream also doesn't seem to be found everywhere either. To me, it seems like you're making a case for these items that are pretty roundly applicable to a lot of other regional dishes from elsewhere in the US. What might help is if you listed the items for your local area so there's a better idea by example of what qualifies for you.
There's almost always a white sauce and hot sauce available and often a bbq sauce or an herb-y green sauce and the sauces vary from place to place. The chicken and the rice are usually have a blend of aromatics to them which also varies from place to place. There's a little side salad and sometimes there's a little extra thrown in like a falafel or some grilled onions and peppers.
Almost every Greek place sells that exact thing, only it’s not called Halal plates because they’re Greek, not Turks.
Baltimore too. More so than Boston and Providence IMO
Annapolis has plenty of colonial history, but I can think of very few colonial (pre-1780) homes or buildings in Baltimore. The Mount Clare Mansion, Old St.Paul's church., the Robert Long house, the star-spangled Flag house.
Also I feel like Halal Plate is pretty much there in the name, that it’s really not from New York.
As with pretty much everything on that list, it’s either just not unique at all to New York (black and white cookies are sold by Entemanns for gods sake) or just ethnic foods easier to find in New York due to diverse immigrant communities (knishes) or just a local name for something pretty ubiquitous (chopped cheese)
It is the white sauce and the chicken the diced tomato/lettuce that makes the Halal Plate special. You will struggle to put them all together in Middle Eastern restaurants elsewhere outside of chains like Halal Guys that specialize in these.
Pastrami sandwiches and bagels are at a similar level of uniqueness as beignets and jambalaya of Louisiana. You can get these in pretty much all large enough cities but they likely won't be anywhere as good.
Chopped cheese, knishes and even hot dog carts with caramelized onions are not widely available elsewhere and can only be found in niche restaurants/vendors so would be at a higher level of uniqueness.
The most 'unique' items are mostly things that no nonlocals would ever want to try, like lutefisk, Midwest fish boil or can of bread. Or things that require fresh ingredients like guavas in south Florida or quahog in RI.
Almost every Greek place sells that exact thing, only it’s not called Halal plates because they’re Greek, not Turks.
A assume the white sauce is Tahini Sauce?
The white sauce is generally not Tahini Sauce. Tahini is usually a toasted sesame based sauce. The white sauce varies from place to place, but generally does not have a sesame base but rather a mayonnaise or sour cream base. It's not usually Turks selling the halal platters, but Egyptians and recently a lot of South Asians with some variation on it. The rice is also usually differently seasoned than Greek rice. Greek places selling meat and rice plates also exist in NYC, but they're generally pretty different in flavor from the halal plates.
What are your examples of Boston area local dishes that are hard to find anywhere else and aren't closely related to anything anywhere else? I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the rubric you're using for what qualifies and what gets disqualified so I think going by examples might be helpful.
Last edited by OyCrumbler; 08-17-2023 at 11:26 AM..
The white sauce is generally not Tahini Sauce. Tahini is usually a toasted sesame based sauce. The white sauce varies from place to place, but generally does not have a sesame base but rather a mayonnaise or sour cream base. It's not usually Turks selling the halal platters, but Egyptians and recently a lot of South Asians with some variation on it. The rice is also usually differently seasoned than Greek rice. Greek places selling meat and rice plates also exist in NYC, but they're generally pretty different in flavor from the halal plates.
What are your examples of Boston area local dishes that are hard to find anywhere else and aren't closely related to anything anywhere else? I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the rubric you're using so I think going by examples might be helpful.
South Shore Bar Style Pizza (The Lynwood in Randolph, Town Spa in Stoughton are examples)
Clam Chowder (havent had good chosder outside CT, RI and MA)
American Chop Suey
And the most obvious one…
A large iced coffee from Dunks served from a middle aged woman who is also smoking a Camel!
South Shore Bar Style Pizza (The Lynwood in Randolph, Town Spa in Stoughton are examples)
Clam Chowder (havent had good chosder outside CT, RI and MA)
American Chop Suey
And the most obvious one… A large iced coffee from Dunks served from a middle aged woman who is also smoking a Camel!
South Shore Bar Style Pizza (The Lynwood in Randolph, Town Spa in Stoughton are examples)
Clam Chowder (havent had good chosder outside CT, RI and MA)
American Chop Suey
And the most obvious one…
A large iced coffee from Dunks served from a middle aged woman who is also smoking a Camel!
If you can find that last one, I owe you $50
Clam Chowder is an example of a properly nationalized dish.
Beach Pizza and that canned Bread are good ones.
Scrapple is one for Philly.
A Chicken Kabob Sub is something with no real comparison elsewhere. Like a Spiedie is almost close but that lacks the veggies.
The white sauce is generally not Tahini Sauce. Tahini is usually a toasted sesame based sauce. The white sauce varies from place to place, but generally does not have a sesame base but rather a mayonnaise or sour cream base. It's not usually Turks selling the halal platters, but Egyptians and recently a lot of South Asians with some variation on it. The rice is also usually differently seasoned than Greek rice. Greek places selling meat and rice plates also exist in NYC, but they're generally pretty different in flavor from the halal plates.
What are your examples of Boston area local dishes that are hard to find anywhere else and aren't closely related to anything anywhere else? I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the rubric you're using for what qualifies and what gets disqualified so I think going by examples might be helpful.
According to this recipe, it’s shawarma with tzatziki sauce that New Yorkers pretend is unique.
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