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Personally, I prefer NoNJ, but that's mostly due to beach access, diners, fellow Italians, and food. Personally, I'm surprised that NoVA earns more. [+] Rate this post positively
jknic, most people are surprised to find out that NoVa earns more due to the "old money" presence in NoNJ towns such as Alpine, Ridgewood, Millburn, Essex Fells, Westfield, Summit and others. However, NoVA simply doesn't have troubled towns such as Paterson, Passaic, Newark, Irvington, Orange and East Orange that NoNJ has. It also does not have as prominent a blue-collar white community. So, while there are more wealthy *towns* in NoNJ, NoVA is on average wealthier simply due to the majority of its residents being part of the upper middle-class white-collar office-going crowd.
The only reason NoVa's "on average" income is higher because it's not as socioeconomically diverse as NNJ (i.e. not nearly as many ghettos to drag the numbers down).
The IRS says NNJ's definitely surpasses NoVa when it comes to rich people.
NNJ
NoVa
So yes, if you wanted to seclude yourself around rich people, NNJ would be a better place to be than NoVa. After all, the poor stay on their side in New Jersey and the wealthy stay on their side, so in the end the entire picture doesn't really matter. NNJ's better neighborhoods strike me as rich (and more glamorous), NoVa's better neighborhoods merely strike me as well-to-do (and conservative).
jknic, most people are surprised to find out that NoVa earns more due to the "old money" presence in NoNJ towns such as Alpine, Ridgewood, Millburn, Essex Fells, Westfield, Summit and others. However, NoVA simply doesn't have troubled towns such as Paterson, Passaic, Newark, Irvington, Orange and East Orange that NoNJ has. It also does not have as prominent a blue-collar white community. So, while there are more wealthy *towns* in NoNJ, NoVA is on average wealthier simply due to the majority of its residents being part of the upper middle-class white-collar office-going crowd.
I agree that NoVa is a bit wealthier overall due to NNJ's old industrial cities. Though, I'd say the wealth present in NNJ can really over power NoVa. There's more millionairs per capita in NJ than anywhere else in the nation (and this is mainly in NNJ)
But here's another measure:
NoNJ= 3.5 Million
NoVA= 2.4 Million
Now subtracting the "ghetto" out of NNJ's population, NNJ's would still exceed NoVA's pop by 600K (roughly)
East Orange/Western Newark/Orange/Paterson etc are small in comparison to NNJ's total population (NNJ has hundreds of towns/cities). NJ overall has lower poverty rates than 46 states (including VA, but only by a hair)
I agree with everything that has been said; however, nothing you guys have said really contradicts anything that I've said. I never claimed that NoVa had more significant clusters of wealth than NoNJ; I merely stated and defending that NoVa residents are on average richer than NoNJ residents. In spite of the wealth in NoNJ, let's compare Virginia's largest county, Fairfax, to New Jersey's largest county, Bergen. I'll preface the data by saying that I'm intimately familiar with both of these counties. Bergen overall has more extremely wealthy communities than Fairfax; however, even though it doesn't really have any "ghettoes", it has many decidedly blue-collar communities (a huge portion of southern Bergen county including Lyndhurst, Carlstadt, Moonachie, Rochelle Park, North Arlington, etc.) that Northern Virginia has far less of. Summary Economic Stats for Fairfax County, Virginia
Per Capita Income: $47,103 Median Household Income: $102.499 Median Family Income: $122,651
Poverty Rate: 5.6% Summary Economic Stats for Bergen County, NJ Per Capita Income: $41,373 Median Household Income: $80,900 Median Family Income: $98,069 Poverty Rate: 6.6%
Now I'm sure at this point you guys are going to say that per capita and median statistics suck. So I'll also provide the distribution of incomes in both Fairfax and Bergen counties.
Fairfax County, VA Household Income Distribution (2nd and 4th columns are numbers and percentages, respectively, of households earning in that income range; 3rd and 5th columns are the associated margins of error) [LEFT]INCOME AND BENEFITS (IN 2009 INFLATION-ADJUSTED DOLLARS)[/LEFT]
[LEFT]Total households[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]371,129[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,704[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]371,129[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT](X)[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]Less than $10,000[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]9,212[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1,390[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]2.5%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.4[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$10,000 to $14,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]5,890[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1,383[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]1.6%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.4[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$15,000 to $24,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]13,053[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1,800[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]3.5%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.5[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$25,000 to $34,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]15,537[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,161[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]4.2%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.6[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$35,000 to $49,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]27,476[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,216[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]7.4%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$50,000 to $74,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]55,638[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,285[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]15.0%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$75,000 to $99,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]52,384[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,461[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]14.1%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$100,000 to $149,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]79,135[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,670[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]21.3%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1.0[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$150,000 to $199,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]49,422[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,230[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]13.3%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$200,000 or more[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]63,382[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,998[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]17.1%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.8[/RIGHT]
Bergen County, NJ Household Income Distribution (2nd and 4th columns are numbers and percentages, respectively, of households earning in that income range; 3rd and 5th columns are the associated margins of error)
[LEFT]INCOME AND BENEFITS (IN 2009 INFLATION-ADJUSTED DOLLARS)[/LEFT]
[LEFT]Total households[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]336,555[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,189[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]336,555[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT](X)[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]Less than $10,000[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]15,709[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,374[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]4.7%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.7[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$10,000 to $14,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]10,819[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1,907[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]3.2%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.6[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$15,000 to $24,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]24,430[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,733[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]7.3%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.8[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$25,000 to $34,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]20,873[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,283[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]6.2%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.7[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$35,000 to $49,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]32,168[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,988[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]9.6%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$50,000 to $74,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]52,568[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,584[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]15.6%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1.1[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$75,000 to $99,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]46,753[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,000[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]13.9%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$100,000 to $149,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]62,827[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,492[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]18.7%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1.0[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$150,000 to $199,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]31,293[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,765[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]9.3%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.8[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$200,000 or more[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]39,115[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,764[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]11.6%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.8[/RIGHT]
My cutting and pasting obviously messed up the format of the original table, so I've provided the two links here for Fairfax and Bergen County data: Fairfax County, Virginia - Selected Economic Characteristics: 2006-2008
AND Bergen County, New Jersey - Selected Economic Characteristics: 2006-2008
Clearly, a higher percentage of Fairfax County households earn over 200k annually than Bergen County households; however, that's not to say that Bergen County doesn't have a higher percentage of millions; I just haven't seen the data to support the claim that Bergen County has a higher percentage of millionaires than Fairfax County.
For the record, I like many aspects of North Jersey more than Northern Virginia. I LOVE North Jersey pizza; I especially love Pizzaland in North Arlington and Reservoir Tavern in Parsippany). I also LOVE North Jersey bagels, particularly Hot Bagels on River Road in Fair Lawn. I love the walkable downtowns surrounded by NJ-Transit (Westfield, Ridgewood, Rutherford, Montclair, Red Bank, etc.) or PATH (Journal Square area of JC, Hoboken, etc.).
However, I also appreciate the lack of a stark divide between rich and poor in Northern Virginia. As NYNY5 stated, there's not much of an underclass in Northern Virginia. The class divide is EXTREMELY pronounced in Essex and Union counties, particularly Essex.
I agree with everything that has been said; however, nothing you guys have said really contradicts anything that I've said. I never claimed that NoVa had more significant clusters of wealth than NoNJ; I merely stated and defending that NoVa residents are on average richer than NoNJ residents. In spite of the wealth in NoNJ, let's compare Virginia's largest county, Fairfax, to New Jersey's largest county, Bergen. I'll preface the data by saying that I'm intimately familiar with both of these counties. Bergen overall has more extremely wealthy communities than Fairfax; however, even though it doesn't really have any "ghettoes", it has many decidedly blue-collar communities (a huge portion of southern Bergen county including Lyndhurst, Carlstadt, Moonachie, Rochelle Park, North Arlington, etc.) that Northern Virginia has far less of. Summary Economic Stats for Fairfax County, Virginia
Per Capita Income: $47,103 Median Household Income: $102.499 Median Family Income: $122,651
Poverty Rate: 5.6% Summary Economic Stats for Bergen County, NJ Per Capita Income: $41,373 Median Household Income: $80,900 Median Family Income: $98,069 Poverty Rate: 6.6%
Now I'm sure at this point you guys are going to say that per capita and median statistics suck. So I'll also provide the distribution of incomes in both Fairfax and Bergen counties.
Fairfax County, VA Household Income Distribution (2nd and 4th columns are numbers and percentages, respectively, of households earning in that income range; 3rd and 5th columns are the associated margins of error) [LEFT]INCOME AND BENEFITS (IN 2009 INFLATION-ADJUSTED DOLLARS)[/LEFT]
[LEFT]Total households[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]371,129[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,704[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]371,129[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT](X)[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]Less than $10,000[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]9,212[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1,390[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]2.5%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.4[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$10,000 to $14,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]5,890[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1,383[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]1.6%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.4[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$15,000 to $24,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]13,053[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1,800[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]3.5%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.5[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$25,000 to $34,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]15,537[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,161[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]4.2%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.6[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$35,000 to $49,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]27,476[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,216[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]7.4%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$50,000 to $74,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]55,638[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,285[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]15.0%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$75,000 to $99,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]52,384[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,461[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]14.1%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$100,000 to $149,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]79,135[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,670[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]21.3%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1.0[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$150,000 to $199,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]49,422[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,230[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]13.3%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$200,000 or more[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]63,382[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,998[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]17.1%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.8[/RIGHT]
Bergen County, NJ Household Income Distribution (2nd and 4th columns are numbers and percentages, respectively, of households earning in that income range; 3rd and 5th columns are the associated margins of error)
[LEFT]INCOME AND BENEFITS (IN 2009 INFLATION-ADJUSTED DOLLARS)[/LEFT]
[LEFT]Total households[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]336,555[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,189[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]336,555[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT](X)[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]Less than $10,000[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]15,709[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,374[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]4.7%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.7[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$10,000 to $14,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]10,819[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1,907[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]3.2%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.6[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$15,000 to $24,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]24,430[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,733[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]7.3%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.8[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$25,000 to $34,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]20,873[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,283[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]6.2%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.7[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$35,000 to $49,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]32,168[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,988[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]9.6%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$50,000 to $74,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]52,568[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,584[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]15.6%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1.1[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$75,000 to $99,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]46,753[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,000[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]13.9%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.9[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$100,000 to $149,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]62,827[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-3,492[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]18.7%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-1.0[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$150,000 to $199,999[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]31,293[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,765[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]9.3%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.8[/RIGHT]
[LEFT]$200,000 or more[/LEFT]
[RIGHT]39,115[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-2,764[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]11.6%[/RIGHT]
[RIGHT]+/-0.8[/RIGHT]
My cutting and pasting obviously messed up the format of the original table, so I've provided the two links here for Fairfax and Bergen County data: Fairfax County, Virginia - Selected Economic Characteristics: 2006-2008
AND Bergen County, New Jersey - Selected Economic Characteristics: 2006-2008
Clearly, a higher percentage of Fairfax County households earn over 200k annually than Bergen County households; however, that's not to say that Bergen County doesn't have a higher percentage of millions; I just haven't seen the data to support the claim that Bergen County has a higher percentage of millionaires than Fairfax County.
For the record, I like many aspects of North Jersey more than Northern Virginia. I LOVE North Jersey pizza; I especially love Pizzaland in North Arlington and Reservoir Tavern in Parsippany). I also LOVE North Jersey bagels, particularly Hot Bagels on River Road in Fair Lawn. I love the walkable downtowns surrounded by NJ-Transit (Westfield, Ridgewood, Rutherford, Montclair, Red Bank, etc.) or PATH (Journal Square area of JC, Hoboken, etc.).
However, I also appreciate the lack of a stark divide between rich and poor in Northern Virginia. As NYNY5 stated, there's not much of an underclass in Northern Virginia. The class divide is EXTREMELY pronounced in Essex and Union counties, particularly Essex.
I know, I've admired you a a poster so far.
I was just simply pointing out that the wealth between the two can go both ways. There really is no "clear" winner or loser- NoNJ has more urban cores, which exudes more poverty, but also even more wealth (into the burbs). NoVA doesn't have any urban cores (not like NoNJ anyway)
Basically, outside of NNJ's major cities (And Hudson Co)- The suburbs of the two regions are top-notch.
I know, I've admired you as a poster so far.
I was just simply pointing out that the wealth between the two can go both ways. There really is no "clear" winner or loser- NoNJ has more urban cores, which exudes more poverty, but also even more wealth (into the burbs). NoVA doesn't have any urban cores (not like NoNJ anyway)
Basically, outside of NNJ's major cities (And Hudson Co)- The suburbs of the two regions are top-notch.
Agreed, he makes a good argument and backs it up well, which lends itself to a civil conversation of comparisons.
NOVA is annoying. the entire NOVA region should be on BRAVO
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