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Indeed. Two of the larger problems, as a few posters have pointed out in this and other threads, is the college for all mantra and student debt burden. Non-profits have a 4-year grad rate at 57% and for-profits at 16% IIRC. For-profits only add to the problem via riddling people with debt they cannot repay. It's already an issue with traditional schools let alone with folk that can't manage to get accepted to a run of the mill, less expensive, state school. It's just one more player in growing disparity. OTOH, I think for-profits that are priced like CC's or close, offering legit course work for LPNs or vo-techs, could be good for many.
16%!! is insane. It's what happens when you accept anyone. 30k in loans is the average for a for-profit student and they are signing up with a 16% chance of graduating with a degree that isn't viewed well by employers. It's the next bubble.
As it should. Their are plenty of poor tier 3 schools out there they have poor results. The difference is the for profits charge you three times as much for a crappy product.
If public's get cracked down on for profits are really screwed as their statistics are horrific.
Agreed. I don't know if I mentioned my colleague in this thread, but a guy I work with is spending ~60k/yr @ NYU for his kid to major in an art. I mean, c'mon! But, he's paying for it with no fed loans. So, if that's their thing then so be it- as long as it's not left to the tax payers.
Agreed. I don't know if I mentioned my colleague in this thread, but a guy I work with is spending ~60k/yr @ NYU for his kid to major in an art. I mean, c'mon! But, he's paying for it with no fed loans. So, if that's their thing then so be it- as long as it's not left to the tax payers.
You are always going to have a good amount of people who are willing to pay. I have many family members who did it. I have one that is sending three kids out of state at the same time. Another who sent all their kids to expensive liberal arts colleges. If you have the cash spend it how you want at an expensive college even though I'd argue it's a poor value. While tough to compare UF to a place like Colorado College my relatives who are sending their kids to public universities out of state are paying quadruple what it cost me to attend a higher ranked school.
My example and yours have a couple things in common though. Colleges with real entrance requirements and reputations.
16%!! is insane. It's what happens when you accept anyone. 30k in loans is the average for a for-profit student and they are signing up with a 16% chance of graduating with a degree that isn't viewed well by employers. It's the next bubble.
Don't quote me on that. I just found another story that it's 22%. Either way, is dismally low. I'm also seeing in that article that the average debt is upwards of 30k for for-profit grads. I have 30k in student loan debt, debt that was accrued solely to support me so I didn't have to work (uni was free for me), and even tho I earn more than half of that debt, I still find it difficult to chip away at it. I don't know how grads who have the greatest earning potential @ mid-30k/yr deal with it.
Don't quote me on that. I just found another story that it's 22%. Either way, is dismally low. I'm also seeing in that article that the average debt is upwards of 30k for for-profit grads. I have 30k in student loan debt, debt that was accrued solely to support me so I didn't have to work (uni was free for me), and even tho I earn more than half of that debt, I still find it difficult to chip away at it. I don't know how grads who have the greatest earning potential @ mid-30k/yr deal with it.
I looked it up before responding and found various as well. Some below 16 and some above.
It's easy not to grasp what that debt will actually mean once you have to pay it no matter what school one attends. It's especially hard to realize it when you have recruiters telling you about all the job opportunities after you graduate.
I looked it up before responding and found various as well. Some below 16 and some above.
It's easy not to grasp what that debt will actually mean once you have to pay it no matter what school one attends. It's especially hard to realize it when you have recruiters telling you about all the job opportunities after you graduate.
That's the biggest moral issue I have with for-profits. I noted an article addressing one of the biggies. Fed funds used as bonuses for for-profit recruiters or some such thing. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/03/education/03edmc.html
I am looking at getting a AAS in Health Information Technology from a community college. Their HIT program has been accredited by AHIMA. The HIT program has to be accredited by AHIMA in order to sit for the RHIT exam. In order to do well and get a job in health information technology, hiring companies almost always either want you to be able to sit for the exam or have a RHIT. Now, the community college offers their program fully online. Devry also offers the same program online and has also been accredited through AHIMA for this program. If I take the classes through the community college, take the exam, and get an RHIT, does that make it better than if I took the classes through Devry, take the exam, and get an RHIT? Same exam, same certification.
Now, with Devry, it will take me one year and 3 months to get to the point to get my AAS and sit for the exam. Through the community college it will take me almost four years to get my AAS going part time. The programs are pretty much carbon copies of each other. Are you telling me that if I use my GI Bill benefits, pay for school that way, take my classes, get a AAS at Devry, get my RHIT certification, I am still less likely to get a job just because I went to Devry?
I also want to state that this community college is also regionally accredited with the same commission, The Higher Learning Commission.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buttercup215
I am looking at getting a AAS in Health Information Technology from a community college. Their HIT program has been accredited by AHIMA. The HIT program has to be accredited by AHIMA in order to sit for the RHIT exam. In order to do well and get a job in health information technology, hiring companies almost always either want you to be able to sit for the exam or have a RHIT. Now, the community college offers their program fully online. Devry also offers the same program online and has also been accredited through AHIMA for this program. If I take the classes through the community college, take the exam, and get an RHIT, does that make it better than if I took the classes through Devry, take the exam, and get an RHIT? Same exam, same certification.
Now, with Devry, it will take me one year and 3 months to get to the point to get my AAS and sit for the exam. Through the community college it will take me almost four years to get my AAS going part time. The programs are pretty much carbon copies of each other. Are you telling me that if I use my GI Bill benefits, pay for school that way, take my classes, get a AAS at Devry, get my RHIT certification, I am still less likely to get a job just because I went to Devry?
Now, with Devry, it will take me one year and 3 months to get to the point to get my AAS and sit for the exam. Through the community college it will take me almost four years to get my AAS going part time. The programs are pretty much carbon copies of each other. Are you telling me that if I use my GI Bill benefits, pay for school that way, take my classes, get a AAS at Devry, get my RHIT certification, I am still less likely to get a job just because I went to Devry?
Debbie
As you state, you will be taking less course work, there by learning less, via Devry. I don't know if employers will care since associate's degrees are typically associated with specific jobs (guessing lower wage career type jobs). Why should a potential employer care? If a job doesn't require a bachelors, but rather a cert with course requirement to obtain the cert, common sense tells me it shouldn't matter as long as all their credentials are in place.
With the VA a RHIT can start out making at the bottom level about $30,000 a year. Some medical coder's with the same AAS and certification can start out at the VA sometimes at $38,000. It varies depending on where that job is in the US. That's not too bad for just having an associates and it beats minimum wage or not having any education.
I talked to the education counselor on our Coast Guard base, and she agrees that if the area of study is concentrated in a certain certification it is better. I do understand why some people go to these schools. People that are a little bit older in life that have jobs and families and need to better their education to get better paying jobs might not have fours year to spend on a two-year associates degree. It is true that the classes are shorter than a community college, eight weeks versus 16. That is what makes it quicker to obtain a degree faster. I am sure with those shorter terms you aren't getting as much information as a community college. But with this degree and accreditation with the AHIMA accreditation that the school has to have, both schools have to go through the same "hoops" to get that from AHIMA. Their programs have to be of certain standard.
Now, do I go the faster route, pay more money, but be able to take my RHIT exam faster; or do I take fours to do this to achieve the same results?
It's sad because Devry is regionally accredited; and it's accredited with the same commission as this community college. Schools like Devry give themselves bad reps becauce of their misleading information or not telling the whole story to people that don't know better to ask. But people also have to take responsibility for their own education and do research. Will they financially be able to commit to the program and have to money to fund their whole education to the end? Here is one of the kickers. Some people will take that extra grant money and spend it on other things other than their education because they get this money and get to keep what is left over. If they were smart they would save it for their classes and education and not use it for dinner out or that new dress. Then act surprised when they run out of money.
I have my own reason for not committing to them yet. Even though I am getting my funding through the GI Bill, they still want me to sign general term financial agreement. In one paragraph, it says I agree to pay the specified amount on the form. There is no amount on the form, and I haven't even signed up for classes. How can I sign that? That's like buying a car, and they tell you want you have to pay after you sign the loan papers. Another paragraph states that I am taking out credit. It doesn't say who I am taking out credit with. They told me it was the school because the VA doesn't pay until after the class starts.
Again, it is generic and doesn't have specific terms. People have to really research and open their eyes.
These schools get bad reps because some people don't take the time to realize what they are signing or getting their selves into. Then those people bad mouth every where about the school. People don't think about all the loans they have to pay back. I do think they have bad practices about telling people bad information. In the end you are responsible for your own education. I am sure that these schools can turn out very good people. Unfortunately, it's those people that have to suffer because the schools have a bad rap.
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