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You seem overly concerned about penises being cut off.
Yeah, it's weird to me, but I see it happen all the time. People get very focused on surgery when trans issues come up, and it's almost always about "lopping off penises", as if all trans people have penises and the be-all, end-all of trans experience is getting them removed.
More recently there's been more news about transgender kids, so if it's not cutting off penises, it's pre-pubescent kids being given hormones (which is exceedingly rare, and when trans teenagers are given hormones, it's always under medical direction with close monitoring).
Or it's trans women ("men", to them) coming into women's restrooms and locker rooms to leer at/molest them--which hasn't happened that I've ever heard about.
It's very rare that anyone who brings up these things wants to talk about, let's say, the list of trans people posted at the beginning of this thread who were murdered this past year.
They very rarely want to talk about the discrimination trans people can face in finding work. That's something that's very concerning to me, because I'm very likely to go into a line of work where I'm going to be around kids a lot. I'm bisexual and trans, and plenty of people will automatically assume those things make me not only mentally unfit to be around kids, but also a pervert and a pedophile.
And of course there can be issues for trans people finding housing, going to school, being served at businesses, serving in the military, getting government services, getting their identification updated, marriage rights, parental rights, getting non-transition related healthcare...
But no, we need to focus on penis chopping, because that's the real issue.
If you think science is religious dogma, then I can't really help you there, friend.
I'm not making any claims about altering DNA. I'd advise you to go back and check out the brain studies I posted earlier, but if that's only "political dogma" to you, I suppose it won't mean much.
Wow--who is dragging religion into this? Although for many of you Leftists, politics *is* your religion, I guess.
You are "not making any claims about altering DNA", but you want to hide behind "SCIENCE!" News flash--DNA *is* hard science.
As for "brain studies", how much of the science there is *Psychology*? Bad thoughts making bad results and all that.....
Last edited by NickB1967; 11-21-2014 at 01:58 PM..
I'd like to say first, to Cephalopede, that it can't be easy or comfortable for you to be discussing these very personal issues with people who are in attack mode. I feel badly that some are being bluntly unkind.
I do have a few questions that perhaps you, or others would consider giving your thoughts on. They are just various questions that I'm wondering about.
How does a TG person know s/he feels like the other gender? I mean, all anyone knows is how they, themselves feel, and it's not like every man feels "male" in exactly the same way. It's kind of like, when I look at the color red, and you look at the color red, we can't possible know if we are seeing it the same way. So maybe what *I* think feeling like a female feels like, is not what other females think it feels like. Does this make sense?
Wouldn't it be more "being yourself" (not YOU specifically, but TG in general) to just be who you are, wear what you want to wear, act how you want to act, and THAT is the real you, without genital surgery or hormone therapies? Aren't those things changing the person into someone they are not?
Since there have been so many comments about penises being chopped off, it got me thinking---is a doctor able to create a cli*oris, or otherwise preserve sexual sensation, for the M to F person?
I hope these questions are accepted in the sincere, respectful manner in which I intend. Thank you.
I'd like to say first, to Cephalopede, that it can't be easy or comfortable for you to be discussing these very personal issues with people who are in attack mode. I feel badly that some are being bluntly unkind.
I do have a few questions that perhaps you, or others would consider giving your thoughts on. They are just various questions that I'm wondering about.
How does a TG person know s/he feels like the other gender? I mean, all anyone knows is how they, themselves feel, and it's not like every man feels "male" in exactly the same way. It's kind of like, when I look at the color red, and you look at the color red, we can't possible know if we are seeing it the same way. So maybe what *I* think feeling like a female feels like, is not what other females think it feels like. Does this make sense?
Wouldn't it be more "being yourself" (not YOU specifically, but TG in general) to just be who you are, wear what you want to wear, act how you want to act, and THAT is the real you, without genital surgery or hormone therapies? Aren't those things changing the person into someone they are not?
Since there have been so many comments about penises being chopped off, it got me thinking---is a doctor able to create a cli*oris, or otherwise preserve sexual sensation, for the M to F person?
I hope these questions are accepted in the sincere, respectful manner in which I intend. Thank you.
Thank you for being respectful. I'm glad to answer questions, but I need to head off to spend some exciting hours in a lab. I'll be back to tackle these this evening, thanks.
Transgender people are mentally ill. It's a sickness. They don't deserve violence towards them for the sickness, but they're sick. Only a sick person would want to mutiliate themselves. Their dna clearly tells what sex they are.
It's the brain, their brain does not match their body and gender of birth. Good topic OP, people who do not like it at all, simple do not troll around.
It's the brain, their brain does not match their body and gender of birth. Good topic OP, people who do not like it at all, simple do not troll around.
But how much of their brains are simply disordered?
No, I am not going to persecute any person with "Gender Identity Disorder" as the DSM used to *sensibly* call it. I actually have compassion for such people. But I am certainly not going to sign off on anyone who decides s/he wants to mutilate his/her natural private parts.
First of all, I don't have to respect your life choices.
Second of all seek psychiatric help.
Third, people with gender disorder are .03% of the population ow which 1 in 12 dies from murder, I am going to go with Cancer day as it claims more life.
But my point is, Don't even doubt for a second that I would take you perverts seriously.
But how much of their brains are simply disordered?
No, I am not going to persecute any person with "Gender Identity Disorder" as the DSM used to *sensibly* call it. I actually have compassion for such people. But I am certainly not going to sign off on anyone who decides s/he wants to mutilate his/her natural private parts.
I don't how much since I am no expert. Look we all have our views, they don't offend me. Of course I won't get involved with them romantically. But we should not be angry and ignorant.
I'd like to say first, to Cephalopede, that it can't be easy or comfortable for you to be discussing these very personal issues with people who are in attack mode. I feel badly that some are being bluntly unkind.
First, again, thanks for the kind words. The bad stuff is never great to run into, but it is expected. Before I moved up here I was very involved with a local trans organization, so I've also had this stuff and worse said to my face. But outreach and education are so, so important...maybe not for some of the people here, but you never know when you're going to encounter another person who might be questioning their gender.
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How does a TG person know s/he feels like the other gender? I mean, all anyone knows is how they, themselves feel, and it's not like every man feels "male" in exactly the same way. It's kind of like, when I look at the color red, and you look at the color red, we can't possible know if we are seeing it the same way. So maybe what *I* think feeling like a female feels like, is not what other females think it feels like. Does this make sense?
A lot of that ties into gender being a social construct, and also being part of a spectrum of expression. What is considered "feminine" in the U.S. might be different than what is considered "feminine" in Mexico, or Nigeria, or Pakistan. How men and women are expected to conduct themselves, what activities we consider manly or womanly (or, let's be honest, 'girly') varies a lot place to place. It can vary within countries, within cultures, within individual social groups or families. It can vary so much because masculinity and femininity are whatever we decide they are. I don't think any two men or any two women experience the same sort of manhood or womanhood, there's just too much variation in life.
But for trans people it often comes down to...
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Wouldn't it be more "being yourself" (not YOU specifically, but TG in general) to just be who you are, wear what you want to wear, act how you want to act, and THAT is the real you, without genital surgery or hormone therapies? Aren't those things changing the person into someone they are not?
This not being enough. A lot of trans people play around with gender expression through clothes, mannerisms, and social groups. Even as a young kid I hated dresses. My friends were pretty evenly split between girls and boys, and the older I got the more male friends I gathered, and in those groups I was always just one of the guys. I always dressed in what we'd consider a pretty masculine way--almost always jeans and t-shirts, which were a few sizes too big. Usually an overshirt. Giant boots. I learned I didn't get messed with as a freshmen in high school because I gave off the vibe I was a big badass butch lesbian. Totally not the case for me, but hey! Kept me out of some trash cans.
At some point in adulthood, I tried to be more feminine in an effort to find comfort in my body. And the more I tried to insist no, look at me, I'm totally a woman, the more it felt like a farce. I have a picture of me in a dress at a New Year's party, and it just looks like a man in a dress to me. That's exactly how I felt, always. So I dropped that and went back to dressing how I was comfortable. But the underlying feeling, like I was trying to fool myself, a feeling that had been there since I was a kid, just never went away.
And that's part of the diagnostic criteria. Gender dysphoria is characterized by:
1. A marked difference between a person's expressed/experienced gender and the gender others would assign them (if I feel like a man, but others would look at me and say I'm obviously a woman)
2. This feeling continues for a long period of time.
If you feel like you want to be more feminine, but you're also totally okay with being a man, then you're probably just a guy who leans a little more toward his feminine side. But you don't meet the diagnostic criteria for having gender dysphoria.
A lot of trans people go through the same thing I did: inching closer and closer to things that might make them look or feel more like the gender they identify with, and finding it still doesn't ease the distress they feel.
Personally, though I'm not a doctor, that's what I recommend to the people who ask me for advice. Ease into things slowly, and when you find a place where you're comfortable, stop. If simply dressing a certain way and maybe going by a masculine/feminine nickname makes you feel right with yourself, that's awesome. But that's not a comfortable spot for everyone.
I'm not saying that my life right now is perfect, or easy, but in general I feel so much more like myself, and so much more comfortable in my own skin, and I really don't know how to express the difference that's made in my life. There's still other things I'd like to have done, and I imagine that will help, too.
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Since there have been so many comments about penises being chopped off, it got me thinking---is a doctor able to create a cli*oris, or otherwise preserve sexual sensation, for the M to F person?
Usually yes from what I recall, but I'm not as familiar with surgeries for male-to-female trans people as I could be. If you're interested in reading up on it, this surgery is called vaginoplasty or neovaginoplasty. I'm having trouble finding articles without pictures, so if you're squeamish about seeing genitals in a medical context or surgery pictures, search with extreme caution.
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I hope these questions are accepted in the sincere, respectful manner in which I intend. Thank you.
You're welcome. Let me know if there's anything else you want to ask, or anything you might want me to clarify.
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Totally not the case for me, but hey! Kept me out of some trash cans.
