Strange death in Waller, Texas - Sandra Bland (RIP)
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The citation was yet to be issued and she was becoming confrontational. The officer lawfully ordered her out. She refused. He removed her.
This was a terry stop and is admissible under law. He did not detain her for an hour in order for dogs to show up. He was detaining her and writing a ticket. At no point was there a delay. Removing a person from a vehicle is lawful
The cop's own superiors have said he handled the situation unprofessionally. The point isn't whether he could order her out of her car, it's whether he should have.
The cops superiors take their orders from the politicians and made those statements to calm the savages down in an attempt to stop the fires and looting that they have seen in other cities from happening in their city.
Generally she is one of the more logical posters on CD but on this topic for some reason she left the reservation.
Oh no - I'm quite logical - even on this topic.
You know who I think were victims of police or "neighborhood watch" brutality?
Freddie Gray
That guy who got pulled over who owed back child support (cop shot him in the back)
Trayvon Martin
Kristiana Coignard
Among others.
And I would say they were victims of police brutality or misconduct of others regardless of their skin color. And please notice that Freddie Gray had an extensive record - but he did not deserve what happened to him in the back of that van. Kristiana Coignard was mentally ill and wielding a knife. The guy who owed back child support shouldn't have run from the police. Trayvon Martin - poor kid. Wrong place, wrong time.
So I'm able to overlook a lot of smoke and mirrors and get to the logical crux of the matter. I don't automatically default in favor of the cops or the "neighborhood watch" OR the victim - I weigh each situation and really do try to be fair in my assessment.
Sandra Bland's life was a hot mess before she got pulled over. She was loaded for bear, and was probably doing some drugs (if her past convictions as well as her subsequent toxicology exam are any evidence). She was belligerent and surly with law enforcement from the get go. And she had an extensive arrest and conviction record - some offenses quite serious in fact. She owed over $7000 in fines for various convictions. She couldn't even scrape together several people who were willing to pay her bail - and I would bet it was because they knew her record of run ins with law enforcement.
My gosh, I've been pulled over for something as trivial as not giving a turn signal (inspection sticker expired by two days) and GOT A TICKET for it - not just a warning - and I didn't assume that I was being pulled over (by a black cop, by the way) because I was white, or a woman, or whatever. Just like Ms Bland, though my infraction was very small, it was an infraction, and I was in the wrong. I didn't argue with the police officer, cop an attitude, or refuse to cooperate. In fact, by the end of the stop, he and I were both laughing - but I still got the ticket. (Actually it was a pretty funny situation all the way around because I stopped next to him at a red light and he looked over at me - then down at my inspection sticker - then back up at me - and I gave him a really cheesy grin, and he gave me one back and then pointed at the parking lot and mouthed "Pull over." When he walked up to my car, he said, "M'am, do you have any idea why I pulled you over?" I said, "Well...yes. But why don't you tell me?" I mean, what if he had pulled me over for something ELSE and then I got a ticket for TWO things? LOL Anyway - maybe he would have just given me a warning if I hadn't been so cheeky, but the ticket just cost me $10 anyway so it was worth the laugh! He walked all the way around my car seeing if he could find anything else, laughing and shaking his head and going, "Hmmmmm, hmmmmm, what could it be...what could it be...!")
Lest anyone say I'm being sanctimonious - hell, I'm one of the few people on this thread who admit freely to being stopped repeatedly over the years by law enforcement -and often being guilty as charged. I'm no angel - I just use common sense when I'm pulled over. Like I've said, it's just not that hard or that illogical a conclusion to jump to: "Be nice to the guy with a gun and a taser."
That makes her posts extremely disgusting, if true. I wonder how her black family members feel.
My black family members know that I don't jump to any conclusions about anyone based on their skin color. I don't make excuses for bad behavior based on skin color either.
In the Rodriguez decision, when the officer finishes all traffic related tasks (which can include questions and ordering someone out of the vehicle), the officer cannot start a completely separate investigation into a completely different potential crime without some reasonable suspicion of that separate crime.
I'm not going to spend the day arguing whether Rodriguez applies, I think it does but there are people who disagree with me. The reason I raise the issue is to illustrate that this is not a 'slam dunk' terry stop.
In the Rodriguez decision, when the officer finishes all traffic related tasks (which can include questions and ordering someone out of the vehicle), the officer cannot start a completely separate investigation into a completely different potential crime without some reasonable suspicion of that separate crime.
I'm not going to spend the day arguing whether Rodriguez applies, I think it does but there are people who disagree with me. The reason I raise the issue is to illustrate that this is not a 'slam dunk' terry stop.
The citation was not yet issued. You can see him writing it, stop writing, put it down, order her out. Clear cut Terry stop.
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