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Originally Posted by Jumpindogs Have you considered that many Muslims are afraid to speak out against Islamist terrorism? Because they would then be considered worse than infidels by the radicals and become targets themselves?
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Originally Posted by modernist1 Within your response lies the answer. We have a problem here.
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Originally Posted by seain dublin
I said the same thing a few posts above you. How can that poster not see the irony in what they wrote?
I am assuming you consider this situational irony. "In ironic situations (situational irony), actions often have an effect exactly opposite from what is intended.” from What Is Irony? (With Examples)
The fact that extremist radical Muslims kill their own appears ironic but it is not from their perspective. They consider disagreement with their Jihad a serious heresy and such heretic Muslims deserving of death.
Feel free to consider it ironic but that doesn't negate the reality.
However, I have a problem with this statement. He says, "...stay united in the face of a horror which has neither colour nor religion..."
The name of the organization which perpetrated this horror is "the ISLAMIC State." Islam is a religion. Now, do I think that these radicals represent the majority of those who identify themselves as Muslim? No. But the pesky fact remains that the majority of terrorist attacks against civilians throughout the world are perpetrated by people who claim to be motivated by Islam. They aren't just people with a radical world view who also HAPPEN to be Muslim - they are MOTIVATED by their religious beliefs. Their violence is fueled by their religious beliefs.
That was my first thought when I read the statement, too. OF COURSE this horror is connected to religion. Pathetic statement, though I am sad for the family and everyone else who died or is injured and traumatized.
There is no “radical” Islam. There is just Islam. You go to any Muslim country and try to major in Radical Islamic Studies. You won’t find any. There is only one Islam practiced in the streets. Forced hijab, ban on music, internet, TV, movies, lashings, public executions, colorful clothes, you know the stuff ISIS does and we think of it as extreme. They all do it.
The distinction between “radical” vs. “moderate” Islam is a western invention. In fact, they call the so called moderate Islam as ”American” Islam, which means don’t try teaching us what the real Islam is. We know what it is. It is always funny that the French speaking John Kerry gets into a debate with the Islamic State as to what the real Islam is. As to your question, a peaceful Muslim is a Muslim that is not, well, a Muslim. They may pray or fast and read the Koran here and there but does not feel obliged to actually carry out the duties spelled out in the book. Most non-Arabic speaking Muslims don’t even know what is in the Koran. In fact, reading the Koran in any other language is frowned upon perhaps to keep its content under wraps.
Hope that helps.
Nonsense … The vast majority of Muslims worldwide do NOT support creeps like al Qa'eda and ISIS
There is no “radical” Islam. There is just Islam. You go to any Muslim country and try to major in Radical Islamic Studies. You won’t find any. There is only one Islam practiced in the streets. Forced hijab, ban on music, internet, TV, movies, lashings, public executions, colorful clothes, you know the stuff ISIS does and we think of it as extreme. They all do it.
Wrong. Turkey--no hijabs anywhere. Iran--tons of young people listening to Western pop music and flirting with each other.
I even used to work with a Muslim guy who DRANK BEER.
"I want to express my deepest sympathy to the people of France. As a Muslim American of British and German heritage, I emphatically condemn these evil acts performed in the name of Islam. These terrorists are not Muslims. I wonder if they are even human. I am angry that the name of Islam has been tarnished by these evil people. And I’m infuriated that today, many innocent lives were brutally ended. My heart goes out to the victims and their loved ones. We stand united against terrorism. If you know of anything that I and my community can do to help the French people during this time, please let me know. I want to help. My heart is shattered right now."
"I am terribly saddened by this act against the French people. I pray that Liberty will not be snatched away as these barbarian thugs would have accomplished their tasks. I hope that France will take the fight to the barbarian terrorists and destroy them. I am a Muslim and I condemn this act."
"I wanted to share my condelences with the people of France. As a Muslim I am appalled and heartbroken that any human can commit such a horrible act. My thoughts go out to the people of France."
"Dear Mr. Ambassador:
My family and Muslims throughout the world condemn the horrific act that just occurred in Paris. Islam is the religion of peace and not terrorism. We want to share with you and the people of France our sincere condolences in the horrific tragedy. We stand in solidarity with Paris in this tragedy. We hope that perpetrators are soon found and brought to justice."
Wrong. Turkey--no hijabs anywhere. Iran--tons of young people listening to Western pop music and flirting with each other.
I even used to work with a Muslim guy who DRANK BEER.
The real world of actual human beings is far more varied and interesting that the haters and bigots want to know …
Catholic Christians are NOT hourly distracted by apparitions of The Holy Blessed Virgin Mary and Native Americans stopped taking scalps a long long time ago ...
However, I have a problem with this statement. He says, "...stay united in the face of a horror which has neither colour nor religion..."
The name of the organization which perpetrated this horror is "the ISLAMIC State." Islam is a religion. Now, do I think that these radicals represent the majority of those who identify themselves as Muslim? No. But the pesky fact remains that the majority of terrorist attacks against civilians throughout the world are perpetrated by people who claim to be motivated by Islam. They aren't just people with a radical world view who also HAPPEN to be Muslim - they are MOTIVATED by their religious beliefs. Their violence is fueled by their religious beliefs.
If you want to view Islam as being a religion in the English concept of Christian than you will have to identify every one of us as a separate religion. Islam is a verb, it means the action of submitting to God(swt) to the best of our abilities and knowledge. As we all have different levels of ability and knowledge, no 2 people perform Islam exactly the same.
There are no required central teachings in Islam. If a person desires to be a Muslim and their only knowledge of Islam is their belief that there is only one God, who has no equals, partners nor progeny and only He is to be worshiped. Their intent and sincerity makes them a Muslim and they are equal in Islam to the most knowledgable Islamic scholar.
If a person-believes the following is true:
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112. Surah Al-Ikhlaas or At-Tauhid (The Purity)
In the Name of Allah, The Most Gracious, Most Merciful
1. Say : "He is Allah, (the) One.
2. "Allah-us-Samad (The Self-Sufficient Master, Whom all creatures need, He neither eats nor drinks).
3. "He begets not, nor was He begotten;
4. "And there is none co-equal or comparable unto Him."
They believe 2/3 of the Qur'anic message.
If a person understands that Surah and this Surah:
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1. Surah Al-Fatihah
In the Name of Allah, The Most Gracious, Most Merciful
1. In the Name of Allah, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful.
2. All the praises and thanks be to Allah, the Lord of the 'Alamin (mankind, jinns and all that exists).
3. The Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful.
4. The Only Owner (and the Only Ruling Judge) of the Day of Recompense (i.e. the Day of Resurrection)
5. You (Alone) we worship, and You (Alone) we ask for help (for each and everything).
6. Guide us to the Straight Way
7. The Way of those on whom You have bestowed Your Grace, not (the way) of those who earned Your Anger , nor of those who went astray
They understand the full message of the Qur'an. The remainder of the Qur'an simply explains the Hows and whys.
We do not 'Join" Islam. We have no membership as churches do. It is possible to be a Muslim and never even see a mosque or another Muslim. That actually happens fairly often. Especially among people in non-Islamic nations, who find Islam.
There is no excommunication in Islam, because there is no joining of an institution, organization, church etc. Being Muslim is a personal act and all who do the act of Islam of their own free will and with sincerity are Muslim. No ritual, dues, fees, tithes, oaths, pledges, membership requirements, or formalities involved.
Um, this is totally wrong. TONS of women in Turkey wear hijabs, and the number is growing by the day. Iran is super conservative, and you will be stoned if you don't wear a hijab.
And just because you know some random Muslim dude who drinks beer doesn't mean that radical Islam isn't a problem. That makes no sense on any level. As you probably know, alcohol is illegal in almost every Muslim state, and the consequences for alcohol possession are generally very severe.
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