Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Sorry. You should still know that school children going to see Santa isn't a violation of the 1st Amendment.
Except that it is, because Santa is not a purely secular figure and Christmas is not a purely secular holiday here in the US (no matter how hard you might try to argue otherwise). This isn't Japan, where almost no one is Christian; here Christianity is actually the majority religion. "In God We Trust" on US coins and "One nation, under God" in the Pledge are violations, too. It doesn't matter that the Supreme Court currently says otherwise; the Court has been wrong before (Dredd Scott and Plessy vs. Ferguson being the two most famous examples). All three are merely proof that we're still very reluctant to actually live up to the Constitutional principle of non-Establishment. But as the US is steadily becoming more religiously diverse, I'm confident the day will eventually come when these final vestiges of Ceremonial Deism will be tossed into the trash heap where they belong.
But it IS there....because you say it shouldn't doesn't change the fact that it is....so we let that happen (which I personally think is great)....LET THE KIDS SEE SANTA!!!!
The white house tree doesn't exclude non-Christian children from any activity. And again, a trip to see Santa isn't in the slightest educational and is not an appropriate school trip if only because of that.
I don't have a beef with anyone who's not militant and respects others.
I just don't want anyone's religious beliefs jammed down the throat of my kids by a governmental institution. Even when it's all in good fun and the person doing it is oblivious to what they are doing.
(You do realize that your screen name is that of a Communist-raised atheist ?)
The white house tree doesn't exclude non-Christian children from any activity.
And that's the point. Having a not overtly religious display such as Christmas tree is fine. There's nothing that kids are expected to do with it. Writing letters to Santa and going to sit on his laps demands active participation.
A melting pot where everyone melts into a generic Christianity? No, a lot of people (including many Christians) definitely don't want that!
I am Jewish. I saw many Santas as a child I most assuredly have not become a "generic" or any other kind of Christian no was I offended by Santa. This is a dumb argument.
I am Jewish. I saw many Santas as a child I most assuredly have not become a "generic" or any other kind of Christian no was I offended by Santa. This is a dumb argument.
I'm Jewish too, and I had no problem with Santa, however my stepfather would never have let me sit on a Santa's lap, so on that trip I would have been standing in the back with a teacher watching the other kids sit on Santas lap. Then I'd have to sing Kyle's song "Just a lonely Jew on Christmas".
I am Jewish. I saw many Santas as a child I most assuredly have not become a "generic" or any other kind of Christian no was I offended by Santa. This is a dumb argument.
Good for you. I am half Jewish, raised in a non-denominational household. I was shunned in the middle school for refusing to take part in an "innocent" holiday play with three wise men and baby Jesus. This definitely put a spotlight on me "not accepting Jesus", "going to Hell", and "being a Jew". I can't remember all the insults from 40 years ago. Perhaps your experience growing up in a heavily Jewish NYC was different from my experience growing up in a very predominantly Christian Midwest.
I was also asked by the mall Santa on at least a few different occasions that I can remember if I loved Jesus, if I was a good boy going to Church every Sunday, and something similar.
To be fair, I also got some flack from idiots on my Jewish side of the family for being a "momzer" because my Jewish mother did not raise me as a practicing Jew. This was just one family though, in general my Jewish relatives had easier time accepting me than my Catholic relatives, mainly because of all that crap with "you're going to Hell if you don't accept Jesus and we can't let this happen". There are still some family members that I avoid the best I can to this day.
It's bad enough having to deal with this in your private life, there's absolutely no reason why a child should be forced to discuss their religious beliefs in a public school in front of other children. Or, worse else, to pretend he's with majority when he really isn't.
I'm Jewish too, and I had no problem with Santa, however my stepfather would never have let me sit on a Santa's lap, so on that trip I would have been standing in the back with a teacher watching the other kids sit on Santas lap. Then I'd have to sing Kyle's song "Just a lonely Jew on Christmas".
Good for you. I am half Jewish, raised in a non-denominational household. I was shunned in the middle school for refusing to take part in an "innocent" holiday play with three wise men and baby Jesus. This definitely put a spotlight on me "not accepting Jesus", "going to Hell", and "being a Jew". I can't remember all the insults from 40 years ago. Perhaps your experience growing up in a heavily Jewish NYC was different from my experience growing up in a very predominantly Christian Midwest.
I was also asked by the mall Santa on at least a few different occasions that I can remember if I loved Jesus, if I was a good boy going to Church every Sunday, and something similar.
To be fair, I also got some flack from idiots on my Jewish side of the family for being a "momzer" because my Jewish mother did not raise me as a practicing Jew. This was just one family though, in general my Jewish relatives had easier time accepting me than my Catholic relatives, mainly because of all that crap with "you're going to Hell if you don't accept Jesus and we can't let this happen". There are still some family members that I avoid the best I can to this day.
It's bad enough having to deal with this in your private life, there's absolutely no reason why a child should be forced to discuss their religious beliefs in a public school in front of other children. Or, worse else, to pretend he's with majority when he really isn't.
My response to both of you takes the form of a joke I was e-mailed:
Once in a school class the teacher was asking everyone what they do for Christmas. After most of the children regaled the class with examples of the carols they sing or the gifts Santa left under the tree, Elliot Cohen (made up name), the Jewish boy, said, "we drive down to our factory in our BMW, look at the empty shelves, and drive to the airport for our trip to Barbados singing: "What a Friend I Have in Jesus."
P.S. - The Canadian who sent that to me called me to make sure I wasn't offended. I explained that the joke was on people who bought gifts for their children that largely went unused.
My response to both of you takes the form of a joke I was e-mailed:
Once in a school class the teacher was asking everyone what they do for Christmas. After most of the children regaled the class with examples of the carols they sing or the gifts Santa left under the tree, Elliot Cohen (made up name), the Jewish boy, said, "we drive down to our factory in our BMW, look at the empty shelves, and drive to the airport for our trip to Barbados singing: "What a Friend I Have in Jesus."
P.S. - The Canadian who sent that to me called me to make sure I wasn't offended. I explained that the joke was on people who bought gifts for their children that largely went unused.
Yep, great for those who own factories and can afford sending their kids to a posh private school. Sucks for the vast majority of people who are middle-class.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
