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Parents at a California elementary school took their kids out of class after their annual trip to visit Santa Claus was canceled following a complaint from a Jewish mom.
About 30 students were taken to see St. Nick by their parents who were furious that the Sartorette Elementary School in San Jose canceled their trip.
Good for the parents for taking their own kids themselves. It's great for kids to see Santa but that's something for parents to do because it has nothing to do with school. I think if a kid happens to draw a picture of Santa in school, it's fine. But to actually take a field trip to see Santa falls into the realm of parenting and if a school organizes it, that could leave some kids of different religions, out.
Also, if the parents want the kids to participate in a play about the nativity, let the church do that. I know I loved things like that in church. But we never had that in school because school was for kids of all religions.
It's not the job of the schools to let the kids participate in religion. The school could choose to teach about all religions so that the kids understand and have a knowledge of what other people believe. The schools could teach tolerance of other religions.
It really does get complicated though as to where to draw the line. Personally, I loved singing Christmas carols in school but also I can understand how someone of another religion would have felt awkward. We sang Jewish songs in school too--I didn't feel awkward for some reason--the singing was still fun.
As someone already said, religion is divisive. But most of us do not want to ban religion at all. It would be great if belief in God could bring us all together instead of somehow making kids come up with hurtful remarks to their friends, such as, "You'll go to Hell if you're not of X religion." You have to do this, you have to do that, you have to believe this way.
1. Inappropriate field trip for a public school.
2. Nothing significant to do with the curriculum.
3. Taking kids to see Santa is the job of the parents.
4. Taxpayers should not be paying for that kind of field trip.
This statement I agree with. But thing is this. Christmas is a religious holiday, but also its a very commercial capitalistic holiday which strayed away from its Christian/Pagan dogma in this country. Lots of people do not know that Santa Claus is really Greek named St Nicolas. Also in public schools, they do not mention that they celebrate Christmas due to Christ being in Bethlehem and mainly celebrate new tenants such as gift giving, charity and good well to men. Christmas in the eyes of the public lost plenty of meaning.
TO be honest it would have been best for the school to plan a class trip when school is not in session such as after hours or on the weekend. I know here in NYC, religious activities in public schools for clubs and so on can take place during after hours and on weekends, but not during when school is in session.
Me personally I'm a strong believer in religious tolerance, but also not having religion taught in school. However the mind is very curious. And we has human beings can be very clannish in faction are always curious about others and what they believe. I live in NYC, and this city is very Jewish. Even though I grew up Catholic and lived in a very Catholic neighborhood. Some of my teachers were Jewish. I remember my Kindergarten teacher, she used to put a Menorah in her class and some days we would spin the driddle. I remember watching a tape about who the Ancient Greeks wanted to impose their well and culture on the Jewish people, causing the Jews to rebel from Greek rule which lead to Hannukah and Menorah lasting for 8 days. I was curious at that time. I also remember as a kid going to see Santa on a field trip, and a muslim girl came along. She had no problems seeing Santa.
We need to come to an understanding of the difference between cultural significance vs religious significance. If the class was going the nativity scene at a local church which represents a religious significance of Christmas vs seeing Santa at a mall which is part of commercial capitalism and Western pop culture and is not part of a religious significance.
The sad part is that as a society, we are becoming less tolerant of other people. Everyone is fearing Muslims due to media and Isis. And now the Jews are having their way against Christians because Christmas themes even commercial in light are in their eyes viewed as religiously significant.
In my secular greeting. I want to wish all an Happy Holidays.
Last edited by Bronxguyanese; 12-25-2015 at 12:38 AM..
Also, if the parents want the kids to participate in a play about the nativity, let the church do that. I know I loved things like that in church. But we never had that in school because school was for kids of all religions.
I did in public school. That's probably a sign that I'm older than you. There was never a fuss either. They still actually happen today all over this country until someone objects. Unlike in the past they are much fewer and objections are likely. When those objections are raised cancellation is usually the end result.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese
I remember my Kindergarten teacher, she used to put a Menorah in her class and some days we would spin the driddle
Learned how to play in my daughters class (public school) this holiday season. We also made snowmen, reindeer, colored pictures of old Saint Nick and had a Christmas Tree (Gasp!). They sang Christmas songs. Merry Christmas was said and a few Happy Holidays.
No, I'm not in the Bible Belt but here in coastal California.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese
The sad part is that as a society, we are becoming less tolerant of other people.
Yes we are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese
And now the Jews are having their way against Christians because Christmas themes even commercial in light are in their eyes viewed as religiously significant.
In my secular greeting. I want to wish all an Happy Holidays.
The day today is the 25th. Merry Christmas! As for the season, Happy Holidays to you as well.
Its funny how the other day, the nation made a big fuss about Islam being taught in a public school. Now today a school district in California is up in arms thanks to a jewish woman who does not want her son to participate in commercial, secular Christmas activities that she views as religious which ruins it for the entire student body. I have to say as a country we are slowly going down the tubes because we prefer to be intolerant of others.
Oh, the violation of the Establishment Clause is only one strike against the trip (although the most significant). That the field trip (funded by taxpayer money) served no educational purpose is another. What part of the curriculum was this trip meant to compliment, and what educational goals was it intended to meet?
You so desperately Want the trip to be a violation of the Establishment Clause, you continue to be naughty by saying it Is a violation.
Santa himself added nothing to the educational value of the trip. It's almost the reverse. A great deal of the walking trip was related to Kindergarten curriculum, except for Santa being the centerpiece.
Last edited by jazzarama; 12-25-2015 at 07:19 AM..
Parents at a California elementary school took their kids out of class after their annual trip to visit Santa Claus was canceled following a complaint from a Jewish mom.
About 30 students were taken to see St. Nick by their parents who were furious that the Sartorette Elementary School in San Jose canceled their trip.
I started a thread on politics and controversy named the "War on Christmas Continues". Other threads in that category tend to support my thread rather than the claims of the skeptics.
As a Roman Catholic some of my earliest memories are of the Christmas Tree and the joy leading up to and including Christmas day. Memories such as these are cherished.
When people such as Thalia assert their social imperatives, they don't realize how deep the attack is on our traditions or how much resentment it creates.
Here's the real beauty. Schools get funding based on attendance.
Cancelling this trip cost the school a huge amount of money because of all the absences that the school has to report.
I think the walkout was brilliant. The voted with their feet and allowed their children to enjoy something fun that should never have been taken away by one malcontent.
But the malcontent doesn't care, after all, for people like that it's all about them. So self centered. She could have opted out herself, but had to take it away from everyone else just because she didn't like it.
Parents should be taking their kids to see Santa on their own damned time. Why is this traditional family activity now being taken over as a school activity? Is the family that dead in the U.S.?
I started a thread on politics and controversy named the "War on Christmas Continues". Other threads in that category tend to support my thread rather than the claims of the skeptics.
As a Roman Catholic some of my earliest memories are of the Christmas Tree and the joy leading up to and including Christmas day. Memories such as these are cherished.
When people such as Thalia assert their social imperatives, they don't realize how deep the attack is on our traditions or how much resentment it creates.
Why do your social traditions should be promoted by a public school to kids of all religions above all other traditions ?
And where do you see an attack on your traditions at all ? Read the original article. She asked the school to make their practices more inclusive. They ended up canceling the trip altogether.
They could offer to spend an adequate amount of time on other religions presented in school. Or to make it a parent sponsored afterschool activity, which would be the right way to handle this. Instead they chose to create a controversy.
How would you feel if your children were attending school in a predominantly Jewish district and the school spent a week lighting Menorah and rolling dreidels but maybe a few hours dedicated to Christmas ? I bet you would have felt even more resentment.
No it wasn't. It was about state sanctioned religion.
Oh, good! Since the Constitution isn't about lawn ornaments, that means I'll be able to use the force of law to compel the guy in my town who has a really obnoxious religious sign on his front yard to take it down!
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and a few Happy Holidays.
