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Old 09-26-2016, 05:36 AM
 
13,496 posts, read 18,256,734 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meo92953 View Post
I agree. When I had back surgery the doctor ordered Oxycodone for my pain, unknowingly to me. Thankfully my body had a reaction & when I mentioned to the nurse that it was a real problem she said people on Oxycodene often had constipation. I blew up, called my doctor a d demanded to be put on something nonnarcotic. The problem was resolved and I was able to easily give that up once I started healing.

So sad how easily it is for people to become addicted because they don't question their doctor's orders.
Your last paragraph puts a good deal of the responsibility right where it belongs.

But it begs the question: Why did you not ask your surgeon referred to in the first paragraph what medications he was giving you. "What are you giving me?" or "What is this?" are always my first questions. The onus was on you as much as him. He should have told you, you should have asked.

As far as "thankfully my body had a reaction," your body should have experienced two with your first dose - a reduction in pain, and the usual signs of mental fogginess that indicate the influence of an opioid...by the time you couldn't poop you should have already realized what you were taking and made the call.

I've had more than a dozen surgeries, most on the spine. Opioids across the board are poop inhibitors, that side effect can be easily and quickly remedied, especially for short term users. But, seems you were correct if your pain was responsive to a non-opioid then it wasn't at the level the doctor anticipated. You were fortunate your post-op pain was relatively minor.
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Old 09-26-2016, 05:39 AM
 
Location: City Data Land
17,154 posts, read 13,023,134 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ABQConvict View Post
Overdoses are caused by unknown potency of an unregulated, black market product.

It is like people being sold methyl alcohol instead of pure ethyl alcohol during prohibition and going blind or dying from drinking a few ounces of whiskey.
True. Legalizing these substances will reduce deaths in many ways. It won't increase them.
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Old 09-26-2016, 05:40 AM
 
13,496 posts, read 18,256,734 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O.A.Bachlow View Post
Heard a report up here in Ontario Canada that there were 600 deaths from black market opiates along with big pharma Oxycodone //// Like I mentioned in my previous post- Criminals in China are sending killer drugs to North America by the ton. The issue might be that our authorities do not care because they see opiate addiction and death as something happening to the white trash class...and they do not care.
So, first it was black "trash" and now it is white trash. Look at is as a delayed recognition of death as an equal opportunity employer.

Historically, heroin only became recognized as a problem when its use spread to the white population.
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Old 09-26-2016, 06:13 AM
 
Location: Texas
44,258 posts, read 64,546,528 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooby Snacks View Post
True. Legalizing these substances will reduce deaths in many ways. It won't increase them.
I dunno.
Deaths aren't the only issue.
Think of all the people who have access to legal drugs who are absolutely worthless to themselves and society bc they're chasing the dragon all over the place.

You can die in more than one way, if you know what I mean.

Legalizing alcohol didn't really cut down on alcohol deaths. But it sent a message to society that it was ok to drink, and people went to town and abused the crap out of it bc "it's ok and legal and if it's legal, what's wrong with doing it?" Even "normal" people abuse it by binge drinking, drinking and driving (what is the old chestnut with that? "EVERYBODY does it"?).
I wouldn't try to stuff that genie back in the bottle, but let's not fool ourselves. You may be aware of the 100,000 preventable deaths a year, 33% of all traffic fatalities...but most people don't realize the 2.5 MILLION YPLL (years potential life lost) or the $250 billion it costs society.

We've proven repeatedly that we're not responsible enough to have free access to all this stuff. It costs the users and society far too much.
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Old 09-26-2016, 06:33 AM
 
Location: Type 0.73 Kardashev
11,110 posts, read 9,866,915 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
I am amused by the opiate problem being such a big deal now that it had moved out of the ghetto and is grabbing the soccer moms. Amused by the attention but not by the devastation.

I suggest that we simply legalize all of these drugs and make them available at non criminal prices. That way people could get reliable drugs at reasonable prices instead of paying ruinous prices for sometimes deadly illegal pills.

Prohibition has never worked at controlling addicting drugs. It never will and only causes more harm that good. Some metabolisms can get hooked on one Percocet. Those folks need help. They do not need being forced into unreliable sources for their drugs.
About ten years ago I slipped on some spring ice and broke a rib. The ER doctor wrote me out a prescription for Percocet but I never filled it, just out of caution. Now, I've never had a problem with addiction (save for a nine-year smoking habit that I kicked in 2002). Still, that prescription went unfilled. And I didn't need it. I managed the pain with ibuprofen. Was there more pain than if I'd used Percocet? Probably. But it certainly wasn't debilitating. I only missed half a day of work. It was more a soreness than a pain. And it soon got better.

Maybe it was nothing but, like I said... I really didn't need the Percocet prescription, and I never asked for it. It was just given to me. Maybe a little too easily.
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Old 09-26-2016, 06:48 AM
 
Location: Central Florida
2,062 posts, read 2,562,408 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
I am amused by the opiate problem being such a big deal now that it had moved out of the ghetto and is grabbing the soccer moms. Amused by the attention but not by the devastation.


I suggest that we simply legalize all of these drugs and make them available at non criminal prices. That way people could get reliable drugs at reasonable prices instead of paying ruinous prices for sometimes deadly illegal pills.


Prohibition has never worked at controlling addicting drugs. It never will and only causes more harm that good. Some metabolisms can get hooked on one Percocet. Those folks need help. They do not need being forced into unreliable sources for their drugs.

How about we focus on the reasons why they turned to drugs in the first place? What kinds of feelings of stress or despair, are going on that get people addicted to drugs?
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Old 09-26-2016, 06:54 AM
 
Location: Central Florida
2,062 posts, read 2,562,408 times
Reputation: 1940
Quote:
Originally Posted by stan4 View Post
I dunno.
Deaths aren't the only issue.
Think of all the people who have access to legal drugs who are absolutely worthless to themselves and society bc they're chasing the dragon all over the place.

You can die in more than one way, if you know what I mean.

Legalizing alcohol didn't really cut down on alcohol deaths. But it sent a message to society that it was ok to drink, and people went to town and abused the crap out of it bc "it's ok and legal and if it's legal, what's wrong with doing it?" Even "normal" people abuse it by binge drinking, drinking and driving (what is the old chestnut with that? "EVERYBODY does it"?).
I wouldn't try to stuff that genie back in the bottle, but let's not fool ourselves. You may be aware of the 100,000 preventable deaths a year, 33% of all traffic fatalities...but most people don't realize the 2.5 MILLION YPLL (years potential life lost) or the $250 billion it costs society.

We've proven repeatedly that we're not responsible enough to have free access to all this stuff. It costs the users and society far too much.

Very true the only good thing that would come of legalizing these drugs is that people won't be thrown in jail over it, but then again maybe driving under the influence will increase.
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Old 09-26-2016, 06:58 AM
 
1,504 posts, read 855,402 times
Reputation: 1372
We have a welfare system in Canada...a so called safety net...thousands of these dumb poor people are now dead because of opiate over doze...and the government seems to like it that way.....It might be a way to manage those the elite consider useless? Now we also have a huge burdensome aging population.

The government at one time had this supposedly benevolent program called assisted suicide....NOW the word suicide has been removed...They are going to deal with the useless aging population with a new program...It is called assisted death....and the government and some medical people will act as if killing you is doing you a favour.

Imagine of ALL the opiate addicts that died were the sons and daughters of lawyers...You would see a stop to this carnage.
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Old 09-26-2016, 07:08 AM
 
Location: Texas
44,258 posts, read 64,546,528 times
Reputation: 73944
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unsettomati View Post
About ten years ago I slipped on some spring ice and broke a rib. The ER doctor wrote me out a prescription for Percocet but I never filled it, just out of caution. Now, I've never had a problem with addiction (save for a nine-year smoking habit that I kicked in 2002). Still, that prescription went unfilled. And I didn't need it. I managed the pain with ibuprofen. Was there more pain than if I'd used Percocet? Probably. But it certainly wasn't debilitating. I only missed half a day of work. It was more a soreness than a pain. And it soon got better.

Maybe it was nothing but, like I said... I really didn't need the Percocet prescription, and I never asked for it. It was just given to me. Maybe a little too easily.
Yeah.

A. I've been an ER doctor for 14 years. I have never (nor do I know anyone) who has ever written a PERCOCET rx out of the ER. That would have required triplicate scripts.
B. 99% of every rib fracture patient I have ever had (and I've had many - always worked at a trauma center) has not been pain-controlled with over-the-counter meds. We can use weaker narcotics, but some have even had to be admitted. Some are supposed to be admitted bc of protocol.
C. There are a lot of people who will not use NSAIDs (ibuprofen, naproxen) for fractures bc of evidence that it delays bone healing (and acutely increases bleeding when that is relevant).

Two years ago, hydrocodone went Schedule II. Which means ER docs (the overwhelming majority of whom do not have triplicates/special rx pads) would have to buy special rx pads to even prescribe it.

I bought 9 pads of 50 rx apiece. August 2014. I'm not even halfway through the first one. Most of my colleagues didn't bother to buy the pads at all. They're functioning entirely with other medications. I decided to do the pads bc sometimes (like, oh, a femur fracture) there are times for narcotics. But I discovered that most people did ok with the other meds. The people I wound up using the pads for were those who couldn't take the other meds (pregnant patient, real documented allergies, etc). And I see 6000 patients a year at 2 trauma centers.

During all this, we were lambasted and yelled at and all sorts of nonsense if we didn't "address pain quickly and appropriately." Surveys. Questionnaires. CMS and JAHCO requirements. Did you know the government DEMANDS we give a pain medication to any patient who MIGHT have a long bone fracture within a certain number of minutes of arrival? So basically they demand we narc up anyone who MIGHT have a fracture (bc no way are you going to have an xray done and read in 30 minutes) as soon as they hit the door?

I mean, stupid stuff like these protocols and tying compensation to 'satisfaction' scores are a HUGE part of the problem. And you're not talking about a slap on the wrist. You're talking about big fines and even being fired. And they'll send a drug seeker a survey just as fast as they'll send a legitimate patient a survey. And don't get me started on that stupid campaign...'Pain is the fifth vital sign' nonsense.

There are now whole committees dedicated to ferreting out who is a drug-seeking patient and sending them letters that say they will not be given narcotics if they come. There are signs being posted. Tons of time is being spent combating the abuse of narcotics. It's infuriating, bc if they didn't meddle in the first place, a lot of this problem wouldn't exist.
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Old 09-26-2016, 07:10 AM
 
Location: Texas
44,258 posts, read 64,546,528 times
Reputation: 73944
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanguardisle View Post
How about we focus on the reasons why they turned to drugs in the first place? What kinds of feelings of stress or despair, are going on that get people addicted to drugs?
I've been saying this for years.
Why do people have to alter their consciousness at such overwhelming levels (with booze, drugs, etc)?

But it would require people to look at an overwhelming societal problem that would be too messy to fix (and would probably require people to have their civil rights violated to fix).
Easier to play the blame game and let people keel over dead left and right.
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