Kicking friend out (Denver: apartments, lease, eviction)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
A friend I grew up with relocated to the Denver area in September. He was having a hard time finding a place to live, and so my roommate and I decided to let him live with us, in what we thought would be short term living arrangements. We all share a two bedroom apartment, with my friend and I sharing a one bedroom. We all evenly split utilities, and split rent 40% (own room) / 30% / 30% (shared room)
Since both my first roommate and I thought, and were assured that this living arrangement would only last until he found his own apartment, we didn't bother to talk about this with our landlord to add his name to the lease. Now, we are 4 months into our living arrangements, and are unsure what to do. We verbally told my friend in both December and January that he had until the end of March to move out, because he works so much and rarely has free time to apartment hunt. I spoke with him several weeks ago about the status of his apartment hunting, and he said that a friend of his was looking for either houses or apartments, but that they hadn't found anything.
I am hoping that I can get some advice for what to do with this situation. I am not sure if we have to give him a 30 day eviction notice, if we should notify our landlord, or if we can simply kick him out. I'm not really concerned with keeping this friendship, as he has been incredibly disrespectful since moving in, but I would like to be fair about this issue.
Has anyone been through a similar situation? Does anyone know of any resources that I can look at to help us figure this out?
I've been in a similar situation ... but as the landlord in Colorado. It's not as simple as one might think to resolve.
Here's why:
Effectively, you have created another legal tenant with rights of occupancy and possession within your lease by allowing this person to establish residency where you accepted their "share" of the monthly rent and utilities.
The person is no longer a "guest" temporarily visiting you within the legal meaning of a visit once you've allowed them to reside in the premises on the basis of sharing the expenses. No doubt, you've allowed them to move in with their possessions and utilize the place as their primary residence. I wouldn't be surprised if they receive their mail at this address, which is yet another sign of having established residency at the premises.
While your lease most likely has some clauses regarding what is an "allowed visiting guest" (not unusually, typically a matter of a few days), it probably spells out that someone establishing residency as this friend of yours has done was supposed to be in touch with the landlord and signed onto the lease so that they could be held accountable for the lease payment and condition of the premises (very important upon your termination and departure at the end of the lease). The fact that you all didn't do so in compliance with such a stipulation, if it was in the lease, doesn't alter the fact that you allowed this person to establish a legal residency in your home.
Due to the tenant's rights laws in Colorado, to get this person out of your home if they don't willingly peacefully depart will require that you evict them. The process is somewhat time consuming, starting with a formal notice in writing served upon the person of a "notice to quit the premises" within the legal time frame. IIRC, it's a 3-day notice. But if this person refuses to leave, you will then have to go through the whole process which can take up to 90 days before you can obtain an order to vacate and physically remove the person's property from the premises and lock them out under the watchful eye of a sheriff's deputy standing by on a civil peace duty.
You and your official roommate must be very careful about complying with the tenancy that you've created. You cannot lock this person out, you cannot remove their belongings, you cannot do anything to interfere with their now legally established residency in the premises. In fact, if you harm or damage the person's property in any way, you can be held liable for the losses ... typically in a small claims court. And if you interfere with the person using the premises within their now lawfully established residency, you can be held accountable for their damages as a tenant denied the use of their home.
The only way you can now legally get them out if they want to contest you without exposing yourself to damage claims and your personal liability is to follow the entire eviction process to the letter of the law. This person is in a position to take advantage of all the tenant's rights laws in Colorado to your disadvantage and there are numerous organizations which will step up in their behalf to defend the legal tenancy you've allowed. You, on the other hand, will need to expend time, energy, and real money to get them out of your home.
The best resolution, of course, would be if the person moved out peacefully in a timely manner upon your request in accordance with your original agreement. But from your post, it doesn't sound like they're making a good faith effort to do so and your "friendly" relationship is anything but at this time.
I know this from personal experience as a landlord in Colorado from several times over the last few years where similar falling out situations arose between lease signer residents and their friends they allowed to move into their home for a share of the expense while not getting them to sign on the lease. Notifying your landlord of this adverse situation will put you at risk of being in violation of your lease and getting yourself and original lease signing roommate evicted.
IIRC, this type of problem has come up a number of times in years past on C-D. There were a lot of folk who posted what they thought was the way to deal with the situation given their views on "tenants rights", or "fairness", or whatever other perspective they had to bring based upon the laws of their respective states. But the problem you now have is in Colorado and you've got to deal with it within the tenants' rights laws of this state ... which are intended to protect the rights of a tenant against landlord abuse. Unfortunately, these laws now work against you in this situation if your friend doesn't want to peacefully vacate the premises in a timely manner. You may even find yourself needing to retain the services of a lawyer at your expense for the process to legally get this person out of your home if you wish to remain in the place.
In fact, it may be easier for you to end your lease and move out yourself leaving the landlord with the eviction process problem of a person occupying their property who is not on a lease. You, of course, could still be held liable for any damages to the premises, loss of use, etc., by the owner until the possession was returned to the landlord and all damages, security deposits and such were resolved in accordance with your obligations under the lease.
Great post above. I will add to it that you are in violation of your lease and should your landlord find out and choose to do so, you may find yourself being evicted as well.
If I was your landlord and ended up getting saddled with one eviction, I would likely just evict everyone and get myself a tenant who was going to comply with my lease. Be very careful how you handle this.
You really need to do your best to talk your buddy in to moving out.
Yes I agree with most of the above posts and urge you to handle it on a personal level and not a legal one if possible. Since you informally let him in, it's really imperative that you informally get him out and then learn from that mistake. If you try to bring eviction notices or any other formal actions into the picture now it will just get very messy for everyone.
Your friend is likely to not move on his own. He has a great deal that he won't be able to replicate. He is paying 40% of an apt rent for a room that will cost him 50% of an apt. rent any where else. That means he is paying 80% of what it was costing each of you for the same room prior to his move in. On top of that he got in at a lower rate than will be available to a new tenant. He had no security deposit to put down and no application fee. Didn't have to have good credit or get a background check. Any of which may be hurdles he can't overcome to get his own place.
His share of utilities is 40% less than what you were each paying (.3/.5=.6 so he is paying 60% of what he would be paying if sharing with another person).
Would you move if you were him?
I guess if it were me I would just kick him out. You didn't pay any attention to the law when you let him in so being concerned about it now seems a bit after the fact. Next time realize you aren't just screwing over the landlord your also screwing yourself over because the laws are there for everyone's protection. If he is a decent leech he will just move on. If he is a professional who knew he could get his foot in the door and anchor down then you will have problems. Hopefully he is just your garden variety leech and will go on his way. To me he sounds like garden variety since he is working alot and also sounds like he is paying his bills. Think what would happen if he just stopped paying and refused to move..... You and your friend are still legally liable for the whole rent and utilities.
Bad Move if the fellow doesn't peacefully and willingly move out. It's got nothing to do about the "odds he'll sue you".
As explained by others above, he's got a great deal and is already less than a "friend" to his roommates. Unlikely that he'll move on, he probably understands his situation and is taking advantage of same for as long as he can. Particularly where he's not being a "mooch" and living there for free, he's been paying his "share" of the rent and utilities. He's done a great job of establishing his legal residency in the place.
Again, Colorado tenant rights laws are comprehensive and you can't just "kick" someone out ... even if they aren't on a lease, aren't paying their rent, whatever damaging scenario you can envision. Once they have established a tenancy, they have established legal use of the premises RIGHTS! The fellow is very well protected in this situation and doesn't have to do much to have the authorities intervene on his behalf.
Under Colorado LAW, the lease signing tenants could even find themselves with criminal charges in "Kick(ing) him out", especially if there's a "breach of the peace" in the process. All the fellow has to do is resist moving out and call the local PD or Sheriff's dept. and the other folk will find themselves on the wrong end of the law absent a court ordered eviction notice properly served and enforced under the supervision of the law. The advice above is the type of stuff where folk with the best of intentions find themselves afoul of the LAW ... and that's the crux of this situation.
Bad Move if the fellow doesn't peacefully and willingly move out.
As explained by others above, he's got a great deal and is already less than a "friend" now to his roommates. Unlikely that he'll move on, he probably understands his situation and is taking advantage of same for as long as he can.
Again, Colorado tenant rights laws are comprehensive and you can't just "kick" someone out ... even if they aren't on a lease, aren't paying their rent, whatever damaging scenario you can envision. Once they have established a tenancy, they have established legal use of the premises RIGHTS! The fellow is very well protected in this situation.
I understand all this. My question to the OP still stands: What are the odds that if you kick him out he'll sue you to get money because you violated his rights?
I understand all this. My question to the OP still stands: What are the odds that if you kick him out he'll sue you to get money because you violated his rights?
My guess - very unlikely.
NO, you're still completely missing the point.
It's NOT ABOUT GETTING SUED!
It's entirely about the fellow has LEGAL RIGHTS TO A TENANCY which are PROTECTED BY LAW in Colorado.
All this fellow has to do is resist moving out at the request of his friends and make a phone call to any of the Tenant's Rights groups in the area and the fellows trying to "kick him out" will find themselves on the WRONG END OF THE LAW. They are the ones who will be at risk of criminal charges and possible fines, not the fellow they're trying to get out of what was previously their place.
The State steps in to protect the "tenant rights" of the fellow who needs to leave to the detriment of his former friends. And as pointed out by others in this thread, those friends could find their own leasehold tenancy at risk with the landlord over this whole situation. They're the ones who stand to lose a lot here, not the guy who they were trying to help out.
The fellow doesn't have to "sue" anybody to cause serious problems for his former friends. The STATE steps in on his behalf to protect him in accordance with the tenant's rights laws. You are correct only to the extent that the fellow wouldn't sue in this situation but it's because he has no need to do so to protect his rights and interest in the residency he's established.
Last edited by sunsprit; 02-10-2015 at 11:10 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
