Quote:
Originally Posted by mapl
Take my word, nicolepsy. I, for one don't believe for one minute that this story was fabricated. Although pitbulls are reputed to be steadfast and loyal to their owners, (which is possibly true), they're often quite unpredictable, especially towards strangers and strange dogs. There's a golden rule that applies to owners of pitbulls: Never trust your pitbull not to fight. More to the point, unlike pitbulls, most dogs don't have the ability to permanently maim or kill their prey.
Pitbulls evolved from the crossbreeding of the Staffordshire Bull Terrier, which was aggressive enough to kill rats that came over on ships carrying immigrants from the Old World to the USA, and the Bull Mastiff or the regular Bulldog, which was originally bred as a work dog. The muscularity and strength of a Pit Bull Terrier owes more than just a little bit to the Staffordshire Bull Terrier, and the coldheartedness and lack of emotion and high pain threshold is owed to the Bull Mastiff. Pitbulls also have strong mouths and jaws, plus furrows that can drain the blood from their victims' eyes as well. No matter what anybody says or thinks, these dogs have been known to turn on their owners or a family member out of the blue. Because of the genetic breeding, these dogs make perfect breeds for dogfights, and, contrary to whatever other people say or think, one has to ask why mostly tough guys and criminal elements buy these dogs.
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I for one also believe that this was a Pit Bull. What else would it be? It seemed as I read it the breed of dog was easily known.
However if you don't know about a breed why even comment on it. Making up "facts" about a breed, no matter what seems childish to say the least. This isn't just when dealing with Pit Bulls, more recently I saw negative untruths about Beagles which seems so senseless.
To clear this up....
*Pitbulls evolved from the crossbreeding of the Staffordshire Bull Terrier
No Pit Bulls were created from crossing Bulldogs and Terriers. There were a few types of bulldogs, various sizes and sorts which were often used in bull baiting. The Terriers included the Blue Paul Terrier, Black and Tan Terrier and White Terrier. The SBT is also a result of such cross breedings. SBT were known as the nanny dog because of their gentle nature with children.
*which was aggressive enough to kill rats that came over on ships carrying immigrants from the Old World to the USA
This statement seems ill placed of any breed and a pointless statement. As if a dog who would kill a rat is overly aggressive dangerous? I see a big reason to ban cats as they are "aggressive enough" to kill mice, rats and rabbits.
Most breeds which were used to kill rats were terrier breeds. Not generally APBTs although their relative the Bull Terrier is said to be used frequently in ratting contest. Some SBT were also used to kill rats. This is called keeping down vermin and no different then a cat or other breed doing the same.
Breeds developed and commonly used for ratting include
Manchester Terrier (1 of the first created for this purpose)
Jack Russell Terrier (which will even tangle with larger more formidable animals, true terrier fearlessness)
Yorkshire Terrier (was created from many small terriers and used to kill rats and other vermin, a breed such as this will take on a bear and die fighting, its their terrier nature)
Patterdale Terrier (developed/used to kill rats, fox and rabbits, today they are also used to hunt raccoon and badgers).
This is just a few of the breeds used for ratting. If you knew anything about breed history (obviously don't) and English life at the time you would know that peasants were not allowed to have the nice hunting dogs of royalty so most kept small terriers for hunting/rat killing. Many Terriers history lies in hunting of prey and killing rats, some who were vermin and some who were victim of ratting contest. You really have no idea what terriers were created and used for?
Dachshunds are much like terriers they were developed in Germany used to hunt badgers, I guess they are so aggressive to actually take on even a fox or larger animal.
*the Bull Mastiff or the regular Bulldog, which was originally bred as a work dog.
LOL you sure have a lot of knowledge to share. Again the APBT was created by crossing bulldogs and terriers and is a bull and terrier breed. I'm not sure what a "regular" bulldog is but this breed was created from bulldogs in Europe some of which were not actually "breeds" more like types. A bulldog was defined as a dog used in bull baiting or for helping hold bulls and helping in other work. The Bullmastiff
Charming. The APBT did not come from SBT/Bullmastiff cross in the least. The APBT has been around for quite some time, even not by this specific name, bull and terrier, half and half, sporting bull terrier, pit terrier or even simply bulldog (although it had terrier blood crossed in). The dogs were brought here at least in the 1800s and existed prior in England (and other countries like Ireland). The Bullmastiff was only just being developed/created in England in the
mid 1800s. They were created to keep game safe on estates because of poachers, they are from 60%Mastiff and 40% Bulldog, there only relation to the APBT is the bulldog blood. So how is it that the APBT existed before Bullmastiffs were even developed if they came from bullmastiffs?
The Bullmastiff came here (US) in the
late 1800s, they were not recognized in the US until 1933 and they were not even recognized by their own kennel club (of England) until 1924. APBTs were recognized in 1898 (in the US) and had been here several years before. What you are saying is not only nonfactual it is practically impossible considering Pits were developed before Bullmastiffs.
I’m not sure how one could mistake this as a cross with a Bullmastiff?
These are Petey from the Lil Rascals – Our Gang Comedies
This is a Bullmastiff
Which is larger in size, shorter muzzle, wrinkled face (hmm maybe they have furrows for blood draining?), almost always solid colored in either fawn, red or brindle (as only a small amount of white is permissible on the chest, they breed away from that however since white is so undesired and most have no white at all), and must have the black muzzle.
APBTs smaller, medium length muzzle, few wrinkles to the skin, can be almost any color and a few nose colors. White ranges from small amount (only similarity to the bullmastiff) BUT can also be Irish White, Piebald or extreme Piebald leading to a solid white dog. Not anything like a Bullmastiff. May or may not have a black muzzle like several other breeds.
Of course a mix of the 2 would yield something different. I have seen some before and most gain the large, rounder skull of the Bullmastiff and some have the shorter muzzle the same with Pit/Boxer mixes. Although not always some will look a lot like a pure Pit but large. As well these dogs often lose drive and ability. Especially when it comes to hunting/fighting. These crosses typical create larger lazier dogs, the sport the have been best in has been weight pull because of their size/strength. These strains which are APBT/BM crosses are not usually comparable to APBTs in their working ability, so it is ridiculous to think that they would be created from such.
*The muscularity and strength of a Pit Bull Terrier owes more than just a little bit to the Staffordshire Bull Terrier, and the coldheartedness and lack of emotion and high pain threshold is owed to the Bull Mastiff.
That is true of the SBT, they are very strong and many comment that the SBT while a separate type (today) is actually the ancestor of the APBT. As the dogs imported were basically SBT and only refined in the US.
Considering that APBTs didn't come from bullmastiff your comment is irrelevant. Although it is a little humorous. The high pain tolerance in the APBT came from the cruel sport of pit fighting, which is also what the SBT was used for. The bulldogs and SBT ancestors of the APBT had to have a high pain tolerance to fight one another as I'm sure 2 dogs biting into each other causes great injury is painful. That is where the high pain tolerance comes in. This didn't come from bullmastiff. Bullmastiff didn't even need a very high pain tolerance to guard against poachers, they worked along gamekeepers and rarely had to fight a man or take any type of abuse. It was the gamekeeper you had to watch out for and of course sentencing to be hanged.
APBTs themselves don't have a "lack of emotion" as a trait. They can be quite an emotional breed and are very handler sensitive. They are also sensitive to moods and feelings of their owner/family.
A Bullmastiff couldn't be cold hearted, this is something applied to humans not animals. They don't have reasoning to cold heartily plot something out like a serial killer.
Bullmastiff are one of the few guard breeds that were actually bred to corner/hold intruders rather then bite/attack them. The worse they did was jump at/knock down the person. Sometimes they penned them down like that other times against something. Which to me would make them a safer guardian then most others and one of the least dangerous anyway. I'd rather be attacked in a bullmastiff fashion then the way other breeds do with their teeth!
*Pitbulls also have strong mouths and jaws, plus furrows that can drain the blood from their victims' eyes as well.
They do have a strong jaw, some stronger then others. Furrows for draining blood? What an imagination you have. Maybe write a fiction novel on a mid-evil monster? Next we'll hear they breath fire and their tongue flies out to grab their victims right to their jaws.
*No matter what anybody says or thinks, these dogs have been known to turn on their owners or a family member out of the blue.
Its not what I think its what I know. They can like any other breed attack or even kill a family member. I wouldn't call it out of the blue but people do because they don't understand dogs or their body language. The Lab that attacked the 9yr old boy was also "out of the blue" according to his mother. I nor anyone else can't pretend to know what took place but I doubt the dog just woke up that day and decided to attack her son. She missed or ignored warning signs.
I also know that while like any other dog they can be dangerous they are not very likely to turn on their owners. Because they were specifically bred to not turn on their owner or even a handler who was a stranger when fighting or injured. A poorly bred dog will not live up to the breeds traits and isn't a good representation of what Pit Bulls are generally like. The same goes for other breeds, they are not what that breed normally is, they will do things atypical to that breed whether its a minor annoyance or a big danger.
*Because of the genetic breeding, these dogs make perfect breeds for dogfights, and, contrary to whatever other people say or think, one has to ask why mostly tough guys and criminal elements buy these dogs.
Well no kidding? I don't know what people you are talking about. Anyone that knows the history and creation of the APBT knows that they have been bred and developed for fighting. Why would they not be "perfect" at it. Its an unfortunate truth. This is like saying about Labs "these dogs make perfect breeds for retrieving" Um yeah.
Since we are talking about genetic breeding what about the fact that human aggression was culled out of them because a sound dog was needed to be separated during a fight and aftercare given on a dog with severe wounds. Most other breeds are known for biting humans when fighting, its even acceptable. I've been on forums and talked with people face to face about how their "which ever breed" got into a fight and they got bit separating them. It is more then common knowledge that when a dog is severally injured it is likely to lash out, growl or bite out of pain or fear. While dog fighting might be a heartless bloodsport it caused positive traits to be set in out of need. Breeding and genetics locked in these traits gameness, stability, trustworthy, loyal, strength, courage, energy.
Those people buy the dogs for obvious reasons. They are jerks who will misuse and abuse dogs for their own selfish needs. They choose large or powerful breeds because of just that. The dogs appear intimidating and of course are physically powerful. I love when it backfires since APBTs are generally very people friendly its funny when druggies get them as guard dogs. When the cops raid the dog is just standing there wagging their tail. Happens a lot around my area, I don't love that they have APBTs I just love that they think they are getting a big bad dog and get a powder puff. I think it is awesome that the Pit Bull named Popsicle was rescued in a drug bust and used as a narcotic dog. It is like he is paying them back for all that abuse they put him through. Well at least did, he retired as the #1 customs dog in the US, when he graduated at the top of his class and received a significant seizure medal it was like a big slap in the face to the people who abused him and threw him out like garbage. Probably because he wouldn’t be a mean guard dog or fight as he found was dying and had wounds on his head.
Maybe we should ask why those in service or law enforcement use them? Most of them say because of their determination and that they are easy to train and love to work.
If someone doesn’t like or even trust Pits that’s there choice and they have every right to say so. Making up facts isn’t needed nor should it be done. How could someone take you seriously if you show to not be credible by making up a whole breed history among other things? There are a multitude of sources available for learning about accurate breed histories.
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I was just a few minutes late. I had some other historic pics which I thought would be of interest relation to the first batch I posted. 
