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I think it's beyond disgusting (criminal, actually) that people who have made the choice to have children but have limited incomes are subsidized by everyone else (both those with children and those without) who have normal incomes. Modern science has allowed us the choice or having or not having children, through birth control. Anyone with a modicum of responsibility will consider their financial resources before making choices about financial commitments. I chose for quite a few years to pursue motorcycling as a hobby, but I did not expect any else to subsize that choice. Those who choose to have a pet or pets (I do not) also should be able to feed and take care of their pet(s) without subsidy from others. All this is even more true when we consider that our world is dangerously over-populated right now, a fact that is little talked about. I suppose people prefer to pretend that everything is fine with the world rather than admit that there are huge and intractable problems facing us and our offspring.
Actually I sort of agree, but I only get upset when some a$$ says something negative about people who have chosen not to have children. Instead of thanking us for helping to subsidize the education, food and healthcare for their kids.
Honestly, I don't mind paying. I think there's no way two people can raise a kid on their own. So if the rest of society takes up the role of helping to raise the children, then so be it. But people with children should be a little more understanding and grateful to those of us who cough..used birth control.
On topic, yep I used to wonder that during the housing "boom" LOL then I found out about the "ARM." and lax lending standards. I have one person I wonder how she affords a really expensive house and car...but I guess she makes a lot more than I do.
I have relatives who have children and live in a nice house, both have cars but work lower-paying jobs. The household inocme is probably 80K for 5 people. My guess is they have a couple of debts, but may save money in ways I find unacceptable LOL: eating non-organic food...I spend a lot of money on food. I suspect a lot of people also skip savings.
Those who choose to have a pet or pets (I do not) also should be able to feed and take care of their pet(s) without subsidy from others.
Please put me in touch with an agency which would help subsidize the expenses I have where the many rescue animals I've taken in and cared for over many years are concerned. I didn't know such existed and, as a bona fide taxpayer, I'd truly appreciate a little help even if only in the form of a tax write-off. Thanks!
Please put me in touch with an agency which would help subsidize the expenses I have where the many rescue animals I've taken in and cared for over many years are concerned. I didn't know such existed and, as a bona fide taxpayer, I'd truly appreciate a little help even if only in the form of a tax write-off. Thanks!
I do not know of any such agency. When I wrote that sentence I meant to imply a comparison: since we do not subsidize pets, we should not be subsidizing children either since having either one (pets or children) is basically a choice. I do recognize a strong counter-argument to my analogy, namely that children are human beings and it is both unfair and tragic that they should suffer because of bad choices made by their parents. So in the case of children there is a real dilemma as far as public policy goes.
I'm not talking about people living in McMansions. In those cases, unless they're rich, it's obvious that they're in debt.
I'm talking about young people that work part-time minimum wage jobs but somehow they manage to support themselves.
These people often don't 'live' they 'exist' on borrowed money.
I'm hardcore old school from the get go so I live well by fully understanding the concept of "enough". If I can't pay in full for it then I really don't need it..........
Yeah, 30k is better than 20k. But isn't that negated by the fact they have kids?
If you have no kids, 30k is definitely better than 20k. But if you have kids, what good is that extra money? It would just go toward the kids. Sure, the government pays for some stuff. But not everything.
I'd rather make 20k with no kids than make 30k but have kids to pay for. Neither scenario is desirable, though.
Kids make you lose money, not gain money. One of the reasons I'm never having kids.
It depends.
Education is free. Food is free via Foodstamps. Healthcare is free for the kids.
What are the largest expenses after that? Clothing?
The largest expenses of education, healthcare, and food are paid for already.
When you factor in salary + healthcare + foodstamps + tax return credits, these folks are not making so little. It prob runs on the order of 45K and all of it is tax free.
Meanwhile I have to bust my ass for 30k after taxes ( paid essentially 25% of my income and state, local, and federal) while receiving a big **** you from both the state and federal government. How fair or sustainable is this really?
btw Food Stamp income guidelines:
Income Guidelines (no elderly or disabled member)
Family Size Monthly Gross Income* Annual Gross Income*
1 $ 1,174 $ 14,088
2 $ 1,579 $ 18,948
3 $ 1,984 $ 23,808
4 $ 2,389 $ 28,668
Each additional person $ 406 + $ 4,872 +
I'm not talking about people living in McMansions. In those cases, unless they're rich, it's obvious that they're in debt.
I'm talking about young people that work part-time minimum wage jobs but somehow they manage to support themselves.
I know someone that works a part-time minimum wage job and his roommate also works a part-time minimum wage job. But as far as I know, they support themselves. I don't know how they do it.
They don't live a life of luxury. But they don't live in poverty either. They pay for college, rent a house together, drive cars (which is expensive when you add up the price of the car, insurance, gas, and maintenance), and they go out to eat.
Just an fyi... those "McMansions" vary in price depending on where people live. I don't consider our home one of those, however, some would...
In any case, our home where we are currently living, is almost $300K less than it would be if we were living say in parts of CA or even parts of MD.
In some states such as TX or SC, our same house would be almost $150K LESS than what it is here... so, it is all relevant to the area in which you live and I do not think that it is accurate to assume that everyone who is living in one is in debt if they aren't rich.
Yes, there are MANY people living way beyond their means, but if you don't know the actual people or their circumstances, one can't judge I guess.. at least, that is what I was told when I started a similar thread many months ago...
Just an fyi... those "McMansions" vary in price depending on where people live. I don't consider our home one of those, however, some would...
In any case, our home where we are currently living, is almost $300K less than it would be if we were living say in parts of CA or even parts of MD.
In some states such as TX or SC, our same house would be almost $150K LESS than what it is here... so, it is all relevant to the area in which you live and I do not think that it is accurate to assume that everyone who is living in one is in debt if they aren't rich.
Yes, there are MANY people living way beyond their means, but if you don't know the actual people or their circumstances, one can't judge I guess.. at least, that is what I was told when I started a similar thread many months ago...
You should hope that it's not a McMansion. What size lot do you have?
Their children will grow up to pay FICA tax and help fund the Social Security program. If you say it is insane for the government to subsidize poor children, remember there is method to their madness.
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