Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Really lol. Where does this idea come from?
If Boomers are to blame for anything, it is for...
Not embracing the ZPG warnings and especially so in the face of the decline of
manufacturing and similar industrial jobs at the same time they (we) created and supported
public policies that actually reinforced, too often with public funds, the creation of more people
than we would ever have jobs for.
Since 1970, when the oldest of Boomers were 25, that has been happening at the rate of about
1,000,000 per year.
Not embracing the ZPG warnings and especially so in the face of the decline of
manufacturing and similar industrial jobs at the same time they (we) created and supported
public policies that actually reinforced, too often with public funds, the creation of more people
than we would ever have jobs for.
Since 1970, when the oldest of Boomers were 25, that has been happening at the rate of about
1,000,000 per year.
I seriously doubt that people created due to policies that are reinforced with public funds are competing for the same jobs as the millenials on this forum.
I think it has a lot more to do with the culture of instant gratification promoted by society at large/media and some Boomer parents themselves.
Besides, if I look at our 4 children. The only one who is struggling(in a decidedly first world kind of way) is struggling largely due to his own choices.
In fact, every millennial I know who is struggling is doing so because of their own choices.
Of course not, most of my points have already been listed in the other Generation Y thread. But come on, my generation (Gen Y) is receiving the harvest of 30 years of BAD POLICY.
- Bad Trade Policies that have destroyed the Middle Class
- A Changing economy to a Specialized Skill Economy, further eliminating a Middle Class and only leaving a HAVEs and HAVE NOTs.
- Cost of living continues to go up.
- Cost of education through the roof.
- Cost of healthcare through the roof.
- Seeing as though we are in a Specialized Skill Economy, it will take YEARS of higher education and working in lower level positions, before you even GET into the decent paying positions of $60k, $75k, $90k plus.
- A promotion of far left "we are all victims and have no responsibility for nothing" politics that has created a GROWING class of savages, degenerates, thugs, welfare mommies, drug dealers, criminals and convicted felons that are TAKING over the country piece by piece. Right now more people in nearly 38 states, sit around receiving money from the government instead of from a paycheck.
- A failed Social Security and Medicare system, where our generation is required to PAY into it but we likely aren't going to receive ANYTHING in 30-40 years when we are old and gray.
- A huge Military Industrial Complex that has our standing in the world still horrible, with new groups consistently popping up trying to "destroy us" which could potentially have us fighting war, after war, after war, running through our resources.
Do I need to go on? Generation Y benefits from the work of Generation X (and some of the Baby Boomers) with the IT BOOM which have created more efficiency along with faster and broader forms of communication. But other than that, we have NO OTHER BENEFITS over the prior Generations and in my opinion, America is on the Decline.
I am also a Millennial. However, to me it seems you are looking only at the bad and ignoring the good:
-Real wages are much higher than at any time before about 1980. While below peak, they are still high, historically speaking. Even the median wage in real terms is much above the 20th century average. The long-term trend is still UP.
-There is still a strong Middle Class. Income distribution is not bimodal - it is unimodal. The Middle Class has not been "destroyed".
-If parents are willing to sacrifice lifestyle, kids can still get an education with zero debt. The cost-of-living implicit in the Expected Family Contribution
(EFC) formula for federal grant aid is $33k for a household of two. This can be done if you are frugal (share a 2-bedroom apartment, share a car, etc.). Those who complain that "the middle class make too much for grant aid but not enough to afford to pay out of pocket" are treating the 2000 sqft. house and the 1 car per adult as necessities rather than luxuries. Therein lies the problem! Because money is fungible, the student loan debt is effectively lifestyle debt.
-Unemployment is below 6%, which is within the "normal" range. "High" unemployment would be above 6%.
-Healthcare costs are high; however they can still be managed. With Obamacare they are limited based on income.
-No generation has had people in their early 20s make a median income of $60k or $70k!!!
-We will get SOMETHING from SS. Even after complete exhaustion of the trust fund the current tax revenue will be sufficient to pay 77 cents on the dollar, based on recent trustee reports. The payout can be higher still with tax increases. Absent these, the trick is to pay the lower SS taxes and invest the difference. If you don't use the lower taxes to invest more for your retirement, therein lies the problem.
We are coming out of the worst job market since the Great Depression. Instead of the older generation retiring between 55-65 like they have in past decade.
While many older folks continue to work because they can't afford to retire, there are many older people who just refuse to leave the workplace and let this natural progression occur.
Fact: They didn't except in rare cases, any more than they do now. And back in what you think of as the dark ages, it took just as much time and trouble for younger people to work up in their jobs into management than it does today.
Over the last 60 years I have watched the job market, there have been numerous times that the economy tanked, and there was high unemployment, etc. When I was a child, I lived through the Great Depression, which makes today seem like a huge booming economy. You have no idea of what rough times are.
Quote:
WHAT IS THE BIGGEST PROBLEM FOR COLLEGE GRADUATES TODAY?
They took degrees that has no demand for them. They took degrees that only pay about $30,000 or just a little more if they can even find a job in their field. Lets look at what degrees pay top wages and those that are almost useless.
Petroleum engineers can pick and choose who to work for, and start at about $100,000 per year. On the other hand, look at how many pay very low wages and benefits. Biggest reason for the differences: Low pay degrees have a huge surplus of millennials that took the easy courses, not willing to put forth the effort to get a degree that really pays off.
They did not go to college to get a degree that would give top incomes and chances for promotion, but took the easy way and took courses that lead to nearly worthless degrees, that pay less than many of the kids that they went to high school with, earn without college and the college debt.
Lets look at what has happened from 1951 to 2113 (last whole year for figures) in the way median income went up to what it is today.
Remember those old people you complain about not getting out of your way, were not making today's type wages so could not save money to live under today's economy. I am fortunate, as we own a very large custom home, 3 cars, and absolutely no debt. In fact we have not had any personal debt since the 1980s. I could write a check for $250,000 if I wanted to and it would clear, but not everyone is that fortunate. I was earning over $125,000 in today's dollars in 1957 only 3 years out of the navy, but not everyone was doing so. I had to fight tooth and nail from the day I got out of t he Navy in 1954, with a wife and 2 small children and no money saved up. I moved into the corporate world, and worked up to Division Sales Manager for a major old company, for west of the Mississippi river by the 1960s. I left corporate world to go into Commercial/Investment real estate brokerage where I remained till I finally retired so I could make real money.
I am telling you how we did, not to brag but to show it can be done, and it was even harder to make things like that happen back then, than it is today. There are so many opportunities all around us today, and one only has to look around to spot them. Most of the young today will not be highly successful, as they don't have the same drive I had back when I started. But I was unusual in the fact, that I fought hard as I did t o succeed. Most did not, and were willing to sit back and just do the job they had, without the drive to succeed.
I look around at the young people today, as I have done for the past 60 years, and see nothing has changed, except the young today expect things to be handed to them, and are not willing to get in there and fight to get what t hey want to get. They want the older generations to just quit, and let them have the positions the older generations worked all their life to achieve.
I think there are two economies, there is a good economy and a not so good economy. The good economy is mostly made up of those that didn't leave their jobs during or after the recession by choice or force. They are making money, especially if skilled in a specific field that has a need (more of a chance than just skill alone.) These people aren't crushed and are doing rather well. The bad economy is made up of those that lost their jobs during or after the recession or entered the market after the recession and do not have experience and/or the certificate/degree to move beyond and are actually crushed. They can't do much to survive and can't really move due to limiting factors (and not just themselves like many on here believe.)
I seriously doubt that (40Million surplus) people ....
are competing for the same jobs as the millenials
Really? Who do you suppose that they are competing with then?
And when they do find a job...
What do you suppose is the principle reason that employers are able tokeep wages low?
And to keep work hours high? And work schedules awful? And abandon any responsibility
for training? Or to have any meaningful paths to advancement?
Last edited by MrRational; 12-30-2014 at 03:52 PM..
Fact: They didn't except in rare cases, any more than they do now. And back in what you think of as the dark ages, it took just as much time and trouble for younger people to work up in their jobs into management than it does today.
Over the last 60 years I have watched the job market, there have been numerous times that the economy tanked, and there was high unemployment, etc. When I was a child, I lived through the Great Depression, which makes today seem like a huge booming economy. You have no idea of what rough times are.
They took degrees that has no demand for them. They took degrees that only pay about $30,000 or just a little more if they can even find a job in their field. Lets look at what degrees pay top wages and those that are almost useless.
Petroleum engineers can pick and choose who to work for, and start at about $100,000 per year. On the other hand, look at how many pay very low wages and benefits. Biggest reason for the differences: Low pay degrees have a huge surplus of millennials that took the easy courses, not willing to put forth the effort to get a degree that really pays off.
They did not go to college to get a degree that would give top incomes and chances for promotion, but took the easy way and took courses that lead to nearly worthless degrees, that pay less than many of the kids that they went to high school with, earn without college and the college debt.
Lets look at what has happened from 1951 to 2113 (last whole year for figures) in the way median income went up to what it is today.
Remember those old people you complain about not getting out of your way, were not making today's type wages so could not save money to live under today's economy. I am fortunate, as we own a very large custom home, 3 cars, and absolutely no debt. In fact we have not had any personal debt since the 1980s. I could write a check for $250,000 if I wanted to and it would clear, but not everyone is that fortunate. I was earning over $125,000 in today's dollars in 1957 only 3 years out of the navy, but not everyone was doing so. I had to fight tooth and nail from the day I got out of t he Navy in 1954, with a wife and 2 small children and no money saved up. I moved into the corporate world, and worked up to Division Sales Manager for a major old company, for west of the Mississippi river by the 1960s. I left corporate world to go into Commercial/Investment real estate brokerage where I remained till I finally retired so I could make real money.
I am telling you how we did, not to brag but to show it can be done, and it was even harder to make things like that happen back then, than it is today. There are so many opportunities all around us today, and one only has to look around to spot them. Most of the young today will not be highly successful, as they don't have the same drive I had back when I started. But I was unusual in the fact, that I fought hard as I did t o succeed. Most did not, and were willing to sit back and just do the job they had, without the drive to succeed.
I look around at the young people today, as I have done for the past 60 years, and see nothing has changed, except the young today expect things to be handed to them, and are not willing to get in there and fight to get what t hey want to get. They want the older generations to just quit, and let them have the positions the older generations worked all their life to achieve.
Until the oil dries up in that locale.
I think both drilling and mining are volatile and risky.
Quote:
For each one who got rich by mining
Perceiving that hundreds grew poor
I made up my mind to try farming
The only pursuit that was sure.
-The Old Settler's Song from the 1870's.
True thing - I'd say almost a timeless truism, from 140 years ago to today.
The older generation is fully responsible for the plight that millenials find themselves in today. It's a cop out for the older generation to assume that all, or most, millenials have been handed things on a silver platter for most of their lives. That's simply not true. Life is more challenging today than anytime since the Great Depression.
The cost of college has gone up tremendously, leaving many millenials, even those with professional jobs, with insane amounts of debt that they will not pay off until their 40s, 50s, or later. Why has the cost of college risen so precipitously? Why hasn't the older generation done more to keep the cost in check? So many people from "older" generations will talk endlessly about how they worked their way through college. Yes, when college was several hundred dollars a semester, I am sure that was more than doable. College can now reach into the tens of thousands of dollars a semester. Few, if any students, are going to be able to work, attend school, and cover that entire amount. We are no longer in a time where most can expect to make a decent living without a college degree either.
When saddled with tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loan debt, home purchasing becomes unattainable. Instead of the older generation chiding a growing chunk of millenials for living with mom and dad well into their 20s, the older generation should recognize that this isn't because millenials want to be coddled. It's because some millenials simply can't afford to pay Sallie Mae $1000/month, eat, and afford rent. Some millenials also want to get out of debt quickly and living rent free is a way to fast track out of student loan debt. Why the older generation seems fine with bailing out banks, but not the next generation, is a question I have had for a long time.
We are coming out of the worst job market since the Great Depression. Instead of the older generation retiring between 55-65 like they have in past decades, a large chunk of older folks are now deciding to work until the wheels fall off, preventing the natural movement of people in middle management positions from being promoted into higher management positions, people from entry level positions being promoted into middle management positions, and college graduates from being hired into entry level positions. While many older folks continue to work because they can't afford to retire, there are many older people who just refuse to leave the workplace and let this natural progression occur.
Older folks have also been responsible for electing the people who have destroyed our economy. As their senility deepens, so do their terrible political choices. They are selfish in thinking about their quality of life for the relatively short time they have left on this earth, while the younger generation is left to pick up the pieces after they're six feet under.
I am not bitter at the older generation, as much as I am just frustrated at the smugness and aloofness of many older people who fail to recognize that life is not as simple as it was in the 50s-90s.
I hear that about college debt a lot, but for the most part the people I know PAID for the kids college. The kids aren't the ones carrying the debt. It's the parents.
The other thing to add about college debt is that it's not just college expenses -- because education lending is not dischargeable, there is a great deal of predatory lending going on.... and a lot of that is for crappy Heald type "colleges" and encourage the borrower to finance a lifestyle -- sure get a new car, you need to get to school... get a nice apartment, you need a place to study...
You can still get a good college education with out staking the rest of your life. But it's not the easiest way, and you'll have to work rather than party your way through school.
Really? Who do you suppose that they are competing with then?
And when they do find a job...
What do you suppose is the principle reason that employers are able tokeep wages low?
And to keep work hours high? And work schedules awful? And abandon any responsibility
for training? Or to have any meaningful paths to advancement?
Middle class people and even working class, are not having children imo because of any public policy or lack thereof. They have children because they want to or because they have an OOPS and decide they can support the child. No one I know has children because they can take a tax deduction for said child.
The only people who have children they cant support are those who are poor or on welfare and even then who knows if those people have children believing they can support them with the public money available to them or if they are just ignorant.
In any case college educated millenials are not imo competing with children born into poverty for jobs whether or not those children were born as a result of failed public policy.
The reasons imo employers are able to keep wages low is they have not been hiring and instead sitting on large piles of cash due to the uncertainties created by the current administration.
The reasons imo employers are able to keep wages low is they have not been hiring
and instead sitting on large piles of cash due to the uncertainties created by the current administration.
Oh. Gotcha. Well, so long as you have a good solid reason.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
