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Yes, please... use other developed countries as an EDU comparison
Chose the winners to come to USA and replace our system, our ENTIRE system. Not with theirs, but a better one, that would work excellent for the USA!
Very possible, very inexpensive, very effective, very quick (as in less time than Covid shut USA edu down).
The problem is the other countries do segregate based on grades as they get closer to college.
That does not fly in the US
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired
The problem is the other countries do segregate based on grades as they get closer to college. That does not fly in the US
What 'Flies' in the USA just may be the problem.
Not everyone is a clone, as those countires who are accused of treating their students as clones are proving to the world (and trouncing the USA in the process).
Life is not fair.
Was that one of those things we learned in or before kindergarten?
Life can be very full of choice, benefit, and contribution without being 'fair'.
Surprise to USA students... Not everyone will be a sports star, a college drop-out billionaire job creator, or be retired by age 40. but... in America those are options you are free to pursue. No mandatory "National Service", or career designation, so you really have a wide array of freedom! If only you were educated and confident in what really matters to equip you to pursue your dream! That path will NOT be measured by 'grades' equivalent to your peers.
Using 'grades' for placement or measure of initiative is very easy for the system, but very much a disservice and detractant from the true potential of your students.
Equity. Researchers said it was a form of segregation and had a negative impact on minorities.
So tracking disappeared.
Now they want to end GT programs for the same reason.
I know I shouldn't do this, but how is that segregation? Each kid has been in the same classes for the same number of years to that point. While we can argue around the separation between and A and a B; clearly the kid with the A has performed better than the kid with the C or D.
We award medals and millions of dollars to the fastest running, the best passer, etc in sports. Why in academics is performance suppressed and mediocrity rewarded.
I'd love an educator to provide a fact base, non emotion based, explanation of why a system such as tracking that provides an ability based educational outcome, is harmful, yet holding the A's to the same level as the D's isn't.
I know I shouldn't do this, but how is that segregation? Each kid has been in the same classes for the same number of years to that point. While we can argue around the separation between and A and a B; clearly the kid with the A has performed better than the kid with the C or D.
We award medals and millions of dollars to the fastest running, the best passer, etc in sports. Why in academics is performance suppressed and mediocrity rewarded.
I'd love an educator to provide a fact base, non emotion based, explanation of why a system such as tracking that provides an ability based educational outcome, is harmful, yet holding the A's to the same level as the D's isn't.
I'd like to see some truth come out. All these years since tracking was eliminated did not bring up "everyone".
Looking at PISA scores I'd say it did just the opposite...dragged everyone down.
But we dismiss it away saying "well this country does this, or this country does that" as excuses.
It won't change because the people in charge do not want it to change.
There is no way to actually eliminate tracking in schools.
There will always be intelligent students who get high grades and high standardized test scores, and less capable students who get low grades and low standardized test scores. People will choose different tracks based on their ability even if they are not placed in those tracks by the school system.
I know I shouldn't do this, but how is that segregation? Each kid has been in the same classes for the same number of years to that point. While we can argue around the separation between and A and a B; clearly the kid with the A has performed better than the kid with the C or D.
We award medals and millions of dollars to the fastest running, the best passer, etc in sports. Why in academics is performance suppressed and mediocrity rewarded.
I'd love an educator to provide a fact base, non emotion based, explanation of why a system such as tracking that provides an ability based educational outcome, is harmful, yet holding the A's to the same level as the D's isn't.
I know MANY educators who favor tracking. Stop making assumptions and lumping all educators together.
I know MANY educators who favor tracking. Stop making assumptions and lumping all educators together.
I think there are also different types of tracking. Some systems do it on a per class basis, so you are with the same group of kids throughout the day even in higher grades. Others may just have a few levels.
My friend who is now teaching PE was teaching English at a time when every kid in the grade had the same curriculum. It was extremely low level, and the only thing they could to was add additional lessons to the base lesson plan that was prescribed on a daily basis. She didn’t think that was helping anyone, and I agree. The lessons seemed appropriate for 5th grade and she was teaching 9th grade. I had left teaching at the time, but it was well below anything I had learned was a normal expected reading level in middle or high school.
You also have issues where kids who are bored/not challenged end up misbehaving and then they fall behind and cause others to fall behind because the teachers have to spend more time disciplining the kids. My sister was one of those kids. She’d finish what she needed to finish quickly and then be there clicking her pen or doing something otherwise super annoying because she had nothing else to do. In the overall scheme of things, I don’t think she was poorly behaved, but some kids are worse than that.
Getting kids all in one class in the high school level is really problematic. The level differences are just too big.
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