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If all the references of "let's hope it stay that way" are about Obama being elected president, I'm no expert, but I don't think there is anything to worry about. Illinois has some of the most lax homeschooling rules in the nation. As a matter of fact, they pretty much have no regulations in Illinois at all about homeschooling.
From what I have researched Obama never took any interest in changing the laws regarding homeschooling in Illinois. If he had any interest in eliminating homeschooling, I'm guessing he would have introduced some legislation in a state that has none. It never has come up in the legislature, so I think all is safe.
If all the references of "let's hope it stay that way" are about Obama being elected president, I'm no expert, but I don't think there is anything to worry about. Illinois has some of the most lax homeschooling rules in the nation. As a matter of fact, they pretty much have no regulations in Illinois at all about homeschooling.
From what I have researched Obama never took any interest in changing the laws regarding homeschooling in Illinois. If he had any interest in eliminating homeschooling, I'm guessing he would have introduced some legislation in a state that has none. It never has come up in the legislature, so I think all is safe.
Good point ! You're right, IL has no legislation, I forgot about that. I was concerned because I got an email from the HSLDA, and it said that Obama supports the NEA, which doesn't support freedom for homeschoolers, and wants total state involvement, if you homeschool. They also said they asked what his stance is on homeschooling but he never replied with an answer. But, this does make me feel better about where he stands...thanks for posting littlefamily !
If all the references of "let's hope it stay that way" are about Obama being elected president, I'm no expert, but I don't think there is anything to worry about. Illinois has some of the most lax homeschooling rules in the nation. As a matter of fact, they pretty much have no regulations in Illinois at all about homeschooling.
From what I have researched Obama never took any interest in changing the laws regarding homeschooling in Illinois. If he had any interest in eliminating homeschooling, I'm guessing he would have introduced some legislation in a state that has none. It never has come up in the legislature, so I think all is safe.
No, I'm not referencing Obama specifically (I voted for him). But government can change anytime and with a change in office, comes some uncertainty no matter who is in charge.
Sometimes when we try and change laws for the betterment of homeschooling, we inadvertently bring attention to other things that did not need to be "fixed." You just never know.
It's funny how the pro-home-school people get so defensive about it. A child needs to learn how to be around their peers, and being stuck at home with their mother all day is not the way to be. Plus, most home-schooled kids do not see the same amount of instruction as ones who attend actual schools. I was a child model and was around a lot of home-schooled kids and they were NOT well adjusted. My sisters were figure skaters and they were around a lot of homeschooled kids, and they had problems too. As a coach, all of my biggest problem children, the ones I would have to devote 10x the attention to, have all been home-schooled. The simple fact of the matter is, there are no benefits from taking a kid away from their peers and keeping them sheltered. If you fear your child isn't learning enough, work with them after school, on weekends and during the long vacations...or send them to private school. If you're worried about what they are exposed to, being sheltered is NOT a healthy alternative.
What happens when they go to college?
How do they adapt to learning in classes of 50-200 when they are used to a class of one?
How about in the work place?
Plus, social events that kids can attend is not an equivalent to the amount of social interaction and interpersonal skills learned in a school environment. There are many things a parent cannot teach that a child must learn from their peers or teachers who see things differently than Mom and Dad.
We never said home-schooled kids are "freaks", we said that they are missing out on a major part of life and it affects them in the short and long term. As a teacher, coach and former peer to home schooled kids, I have a lot of experience with this and there really is nothing about home schooling that could be better than sending the child to a real school and then tutoring them after class.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tkdmom
So, what you're saying is, public school is only about socialization, and not education...hmmm...sad. I am around homeschooled kids all the time, they are never a discipline problem, they listen very well. My son is involved with Karate, working on his blackbelt. He is taught to be respectful to everyone, and not have an attitude. Also, he is very compassionate, and empathetic, which I don't see a lot of these days from kids. So I don't buy what you're saying because it doesn't coincide with my experience with homeschoolers.
I don't think it's about "sheltering" a child, as you put it, as much as it is about taking control of your childs educational needs, because the PS lacks the ability to meet them, and making sure they get a proper education.
Some kids need public school, and some are not meant for it. I've done both, so I think I have enough experience to compare the two, probably like most homeschoolers have.
I for one, don't think that's what leftydan is saying. I think he's saying, kids need to be with peers, and learn how to be "taught" by someone other than their mother/father. (It's almost always the mother in the families I know.) The biggest concern I have about homeschooling is that kids don't learn to adapt to the teaching style of other adults. In school, be it public or private, a child usually has a new teacher every year. In middle/high school, they have several teachers, and sometimes get new ones at semester. I can remember many times, when my kids were in MS/HS they would do badly (for them, anyway) on a first test and I would say "Well, now you know how this teacher tests, you'll do better next time". And it was usually true. As parents, we try to adjust to our kids a lot; the teachers, not as much. And that's a good thing. Learning to get along with other kids, some of whom you are not going to like, is another good skill. I don't think you get that so much in sports, where everyone is at least interested in that sport, or scouts, which attracts a certain type of kid.
I for one, don't think that's what leftydan is saying. I think he's saying, kids need to be with peers, and learn how to be "taught" by someone other than their mother/father. (It's almost always the mother in the families I know.) The biggest concern I have about homeschooling is that kids don't learn to adapt to the teaching style of other adults. In school, be it public or private, a child usually has a new teacher every year. In middle/high school, they have several teachers, and sometimes get new ones at semester. I can remember many times, when my kids were in MS/HS they would do badly (for them, anyway) on a first test and I would say "Well, now you know how this teacher tests, you'll do better next time". And it was usually true. As parents, we try to adjust to our kids a lot; the teachers, not as much. And that's a good thing. Learning to get along with other kids, some of whom you are not going to like, is another good skill. I don't think you get that so much in sports, where everyone is at least interested in that sport, or scouts, which attracts a certain type of kid.
Incorrect on ALL counts. Haven't you been reading the posts? Our kids are taught by boy scout leaders, karate instructors, gymnastics coaches, art teachers, music teachers, etc., etc., etc.
They ARE with their peers during these times as well as many, many other times. They also learn to respect and get along with people of ALL ages, not just people who pick their noses and eat their own snot.
If you don't homeschool, you shouldn't have ANY concerns about it. I have more concerns about your kids being in public school.
Don't learn to get along with other kids in sports? Huh? Are you serious? You can't possibly be! Just because kids are interested in the same sport does not mean they are going to like each other.
Scouts attracts a certain type of kid? Just what kind of sterotype are you implying here?
I really feel sorry that you don't understand what you are talking about. It truly amazes me, but reinforces my decision to homeschool because every single thing you have said couldn't be farther from the truth.
I for one, don't think that's what leftydan is saying. I think he's saying, kids need to be with peers, and learn how to be "taught" by someone other than their mother/father. (It's almost always the mother in the families I know.) The biggest concern I have about homeschooling is that kids don't learn to adapt to the teaching style of other adults. In school, be it public or private, a child usually has a new teacher every year. In middle/high school, they have several teachers, and sometimes get new ones at semester. I can remember many times, when my kids were in MS/HS they would do badly (for them, anyway) on a first test and I would say "Well, now you know how this teacher tests, you'll do better next time". And it was usually true. As parents, we try to adjust to our kids a lot; the teachers, not as much. And that's a good thing. Learning to get along with other kids, some of whom you are not going to like, is another good skill. I don't think you get that so much in sports, where everyone is at least interested in that sport, or scouts, which attracts a certain type of kid.
I can see where you are coming from. Most schooled children DO have limited contact with adults, and it's important for them to have variety in the people that they do meet. The adults in their lives tend to always be in a position of authority over them: teachers, parents, coaches. I can see how it would serve schooled kids well to have a variety of "authority figures" in their lives, as they might not have many side-by-side relationships with adults.
Homeschooled kids don't have that experience as much, in my experience. Not every adult that they work with or talk to throughout the day is "in charge" of them. Any adult that they meet is a "teacher" of sorts, but they do'nt have the same authority over them that a school teacher does. Much as you and I go through our lives relating to people and learning from them, there does not need to be an authority figure in place in order for learning to happen. My kids learn from lots of people, not just me... and many of those people are not teachers or coaches.
Sometimes adults need to deal with difficult people, and trust me, homeschoolers do as well! My kids take outside classes with schooled and homeschooled kids, and not all of them are peaches and cream. As my homeschooling friends are moving into the preteen years with their children, I see that preteen girls who homeschool go through the same types of growing pains with friends (petty bickering, ignoring, meanness, you know, typical bratty kid behavior) that I did. Believe me, it was my hope that we'd avoid some of this by homeschooling, but alas, it's impossible to be "unsocialized" in this aspect. Kids are kids, whether they're homeschooled or not.
To clarify, I was not sterotyping about scouts, but I do think that yes, it attracts kids who are interested in scouting, that is, in the outdoors, earning badges, doing service projects. In Boy Scouts, it includes a belief in God. (Girl Scouts do not have that requirement.)
My kids were highly involved in gymnastics, so I know the drill. Until they make pre-team, they go once or twice a week for an hour or so. Most kids do not go past this level. There's a lot of waiting around, just like someone said about school. It's an individual sport, not much cooperation required. The kids that stay in it and go on to team do make friends there, in fact, my kids became friends with kids they wouldn't have met otherwise.
I can be interested in education issues even if I do not/did not homeschool. I didn't do IB, nor did my kids; I only went to one college and majored in one subject, but I can be interested in all of it.
To clarify, I was not sterotyping about scouts, but I do think that yes, it attracts kids who are interested in scouting, that is, in the outdoors, earning badges, doing service projects. In Boy Scouts, it includes a belief in God. (Girl Scouts do not have that requirement.)
My kids were highly involved in gymnastics, so I know the drill. Until they make pre-team, they go once or twice a week for an hour or so. Most kids do not go past this level. There's a lot of waiting around, just like someone said about school. It's an individual sport, not much cooperation required. The kids that stay in it and go on to team do make friends there, in fact, my kids became friends with kids they wouldn't have met otherwise.
I can be interested in education issues even if I do not/did not homeschool. I didn't do IB, nor did my kids; I only went to one college and majored in one subject, but I can be interested in all of it.
You can be interested in something, sure, but your interest seems to lean more toward insulting people who do homeschool. If you have valid questions, (ya know, 'cause you're interested) then ask questions. Don't continue to perpetuate myths and stereotypes about homeschooing.
It is one thing to be interested in a topic and actually WANT to learn more about. It is another story altogether when you come in with a preconceived notion and are essentially insulting everyone that is thinking differently than you are.
You can be interested in something, sure, but your interest seems to lean more toward insulting people who do homeschool. If you have valid questions, (ya know, 'cause you're interested) then ask questions. Don't continue to perpetuate myths and stereotypes about homeschooing.
It is one thing to be interested in a topic and actually WANT to learn more about. It is another story altogether when you come in with a preconceived notion and are essentially insulting everyone that is thinking differently than you are.
Here is a sampling of some of the things I have said about homeschooling on this thread. Since you are on it, too, you can simply look back and see everything I have said, including quotes. And your sarcasm does not become you. I think I have been as objective as anyone else on this forum. And I do not use sarcasm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
Colleges Coveting Home-Schooled Students, Colleges Aggressively Competing for Home-Schoolers in Quest for Best Students - CBS News (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/09/30/ap/national/mainD8KF1LRG0.shtml - broken link)
The story does not match up with the headline. Here are the opening sentences:
I have no doubt that home schooled students can go to college and do well. All of these articles talk about having a portfolio, etc. I think some homeschooled kids get their GED as well, which is an indication of mastery of basic high school subjects. As I said before, community colleges have open enrollment, though some require some placement testing of very non-traditional students. It seems the usual track for home schooled kids is to go to CC for a year or two, then transfer.
I think any home schooler should prepare their kids for the possibility of going to college. While there are a few examples of people starting their own businesses at 18, etc, the fact is most people find they have to have some sort of post-high school education to get a decent job in today's world. To take the Registered Nurse exam, you have to be a graduate of an approved school of nursing. That is just one example. It is not a good idea to limit your kids by not preparing them for the possibility of going to college, IMO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
Actually, if you look over all my posts, I'm trying to be balanced. tony23 is the one arguing that homeschooled students are superior. He said he had statistics to prove it. I'm saying it doesn't look that way.
Statistics are helpful, and if they showed a way greater advantage to one or the other, I'd definitely say that's the way to go. However, these stats are equivocal at best. More college admissions people in Ohio think that homeschooled kids are about the same, or they simply don't know if they are better or worse (~2/3) than think homeschooled students are better prepared. The sample size in this grop was small, too; 34 admissions officers. A group of different admissions officers might see it entirely differently. Not to mention this was based on the admissions people's perceptions, not any hard data. Homeschooled students score slightly higher on critical thinking (this is all based on stats provided by tony23, BTW), but the difference is not statistically significant.
As far as statistics not lying, when I took stats in college one of our assinged readings was a book called "How to Lie with Statistics". And yes, statistical significance does matter. Some differences are due simply to chance, e.g. which students were chosen to be in each group. Statistically significant results mean the differences are not due to chance.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
One of the docs in the practice I work for has a wife who homeschools. In a way, it's good for them, b/c a dr's schedule is so erratic, so on his days off during the week, they can do family activities. The others send their kids to a variety of schools, private (church-realted), public, and public charter.
My DH has a co-worker whose wife homeschools. This guy is an engineer, the wife worked in banking before she had her kids. I don't think they have advanced degrees. A lot of PhDs work in academia, and may have a dim view of homeschooling. We live in a college area (U of Colo) and I don't know any PhDs who are homeshooling.
My kids did gymnastics with some home-schooled kids, and some of them had a hard time taking turns, probably b/c they didn't have much experience with that at homeschool.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana
I for one, don't think that's what leftydan is saying. I think he's saying, kids need to be with peers, and learn how to be "taught" by someone other than their mother/father. (It's almost always the mother in the families I know.) The biggest concern I have about homeschooling is that kids don't learn to adapt to the teaching style of other adults. In school, be it public or private, a child usually has a new teacher every year. In middle/high school, they have several teachers, and sometimes get new ones at semester. I can remember many times, when my kids were in MS/HS they would do badly (for them, anyway) on a first test and I would say "Well, now you know how this teacher tests, you'll do better next time". And it was usually true. As parents, we try to adjust to our kids a lot; the teachers, not as much. And that's a good thing. Learning to get along with other kids, some of whom you are not going to like, is another good skill. I don't think you get that so much in sports, where everyone is at least interested in that sport, or scouts, which attracts a certain type of kid.
Show me where I have insulted someone who home schools. I don't mean disagree, I mean insult.
I for one, don't think that's what leftydan is saying. I think he's saying, kids need to be with peers, and learn how to be "taught" by someone other than their mother/father. (It's almost always the mother in the families I know.) The biggest concern I have about homeschooling is that kids don't learn to adapt to the teaching style of other adults. In school, be it public or private, a child usually has a new teacher every year. In middle/high school, they have several teachers, and sometimes get new ones at semester. I can remember many times, when my kids were in MS/HS they would do badly (for them, anyway) on a first test and I would say "Well, now you know how this teacher tests, you'll do better next time". And it was usually true. As parents, we try to adjust to our kids a lot; the teachers, not as much. And that's a good thing. Learning to get along with other kids, some of whom you are not going to like, is another good skill. I don't think you get that so much in sports, where everyone is at least interested in that sport, or scouts, which attracts a certain type of kid.
I understand your objections, and of course they're reasonable -- learning to learn from teachers with different teaching styles and approaches is helpful, of course.
That said, though, I'm fairly sure this is not a skill that takes forever to learn, and for the most part, kids are pretty adaptable, particularly if they're older. I've had students who were homeschooled and public-schooled in my classes, which I realize isn't a perfect representative sample of either group, but I've honestly never had a former homeschooler have a difficulty in adapting to having multiple teachers. I've had homeschoolers who haven't liked the particular styles of specific teachers, sure, but that was a universal complaint among everyone who took that person's class.
The second objection you raise, that is, about dealing with different types of people, is also very reasonable because of course in life we do need to deal with people of all kinds.
However, in the average, everyday interaction with kids, I don't think interactions are as homogeneous as you are possibly thinking. Take our family as an example -- again, I realize this is not necessarily a representative example, but it's all I have for right now. This morning, our child went to our religious services where she played with several of her friends after worship, including one new girl and a two-year-old with whom she had a great time. Later in the day, she went with me to our gym's child care where she played with the kids whose parents were working out at the time. That's one day, but here we have two very different groups of kids, one more homogeneous by religion, but the other fairly heterogeneous, with the only common factor being "parents who work out at this gym."
As I said, we're not necessarily representative of all homeschoolers, but as kids move from activity to activity and setting to setting, I'm fairly confident that they actually do get that exposure to diverse types of folks that you're justifiably concerned about.
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