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[quote=DC at the Ridge;5805909]Please point out where it is explicitly forbidden.[quote]
Nice try, Dude, but that wasn't your argument.
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Because if it's not explicitly addressed by the federal powers, then it implicitly becomes one of the states' rights.
Please see Texas v. White, 74 U.S. 700 (1869)
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The Declaration of Independence actually addresses the Founding Fathers position on secession.
The Declaration of Independence is not law, it is a declaration that preceded both the Articles of Confederation and the US Constitution and holds no faith or credit.
Once again, nice try, but never try to out BS and BS'er.
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Then the Constitution does not prohibit it, and it could have done so, if the Founding Fathers had desired to do so.
The prevailing theory as enunciated in a excellent piece of oratory by Daniel Webster during a debate with Robert Hayne in 1830 is that the US is like the Mafia, once you are in, you are in for life.
Feel free to look up what is referred to as the Webster-Hayne Debate.
When the original authors of the Constitution were ALIVE, and the New England states brought up secession for consideration, there was no public outcry that they didn't have the right to do so.
Talk was cheap and it never came close to being a Constitutional issue. Either way, the issue has been conclusively resolved.
But while I am at it, the there is an additional issue that I might entertain, that being the right of the original 13 states are distinctly different from those of all subsequent states. In short, if there is a right to secede then that right only goes so far as to renounce state hood and revert to territories. But that is a debate for another day.
Are these Republican voters who are advocating for states to secede? Let the Alaskans steal this nation's oil?
I am not anywhere near being a Republican but I agree with the right to peaceful, voluntary secession.
Just as with the peaceful 1992 dissolution of Czechslovakia into the Czech Republic and Slovakia, negotiations about resources would be an important requirement to any successful secession or group-of-states realignment.
No state would be foolish enough to advocate unilateral secession where there are significant national resources at stake.
But while I am at it, the there is an additional issue that I might entertain, that being the right of the original 13 states are distinctly different from those of all subsequent states. In short, if there is a right to secede then that right only goes so far as to renounce state hood and revert to territories. But that is a debate for another day.
The right to secede is American. It is a testament of the rights of each state, an acknowledgment that the government is not the true power, but the people are. The fact that people have forgot that is only fitting for the chains they place around themselves. They deserve the bondage they prepare and may it be as horrible and trying as it has been in the past. Maybe we won't experience the full brunt of it in our lifetimes, but our children most certainly will and when they suffer the chains of bondage may they curse the ignorance of their ancestors for their own stupidity.
I think its sickening that a group of people believe federal land belongs to them. And I believe that kooky guy who lead that party Todd Palin was a part of was willing to kill American soldiers (take back the land by force if necessary) to get his hands on the land and oil. Sorry if I find that the very essence of unpatriotic.
And I think it's sickening that a group of people in the lower 48 believe that Alaska belongs to them because the feds bought it from someone who had no right to sell it in the first place.
Secession may have actually been right for Alaska at one time; that time isn't now, though. Who knows about the future; the way the country is becoming divided it doesn't seem too improbable that a few generations down the road it'll go the way of the Soviet Union.
[quote=WinterinAmerica;5806396][quote=DC at the Ridge;5805909]Please point out where it is explicitly forbidden.
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Nice try, Dude, but that wasn't your argument.
Please see Texas v. White, 74 U.S. 700 (1869)
The Declaration of Independence is not law, it is a declaration that preceded both the Articles of Confederation and the US Constitution and holds no faith or credit.
Once again, nice try, but never try to out BS and BS'er.
The prevailing theory as enunciated in a excellent piece of oratory by Daniel Webster during a debate with Robert Hayne in 1830 is that the US is like the Mafia, once you are in, you are in for life.
Feel free to look up what is referred to as the Webster-Hayne Debate.
Talk was cheap and it never came close to being a Constitutional issue. Either way, the issue has been conclusively resolved.
But while I am at it, the there is an additional issue that I might entertain, that being the right of the original 13 states are distinctly different from those of all subsequent states. In short, if there is a right to secede then that right only goes so far as to renounce state hood and revert to territories. But that is a debate for another day.
It was my argument, because, hey, dude, I'm not TKramer. Backtrack through the thread, okay?
The Declaration of Independence wasn't law, it was a political statement made to the world to justify the colonies separating themselves from England. A justification of secession by the very people who drew up the Constitution. What valuable insights into the Constitution we might gain, if we read the Decalaration as well!
Webster's position in a debate may make an excellent argument, but it, like the Declaration, is not law, nor did Webster's position encompass all the prevalent opinion of the day, hence the reason for having the debate. And indeed, Webster's position did not settle the issue, because the possibility of secession has been raised repeatedly over the past 200+ years. The Civil War only forcefully quelled a secession, it didn't resolve the legal question.
The feds are not popular in Alaska. I think it's the state most likely to secede. And no it's not un-American. This country only exists because the colonies seceded from British control. When the federal government no longer does it job (protect liberty) it's time to either do away with it or leave its control. If Obama has his way and the government grows in power, eats at our civil rights, etc., it's time for action.
This is complete ca-ca. The colonists did not "secede" from Great Britain. They REVOLTED from the authority of the Crown and threw out by force of arms the Crown's political administration in what are now the United States.
Get your terminology straight! The United States was eventually formed after the American Revolution, not the American Secession!
Maybe its time for a little revolution in this country
If you can't accomplish the political change that you want under the Constitution and all other relevant present laws, then you would be considered both un-American and a criminal.
A "revolutionary" act is by definition un-American, I would say.
If the Constitution doesn't address secession, then the states need to get themselves together and amend the Constitution.
This is complete ca-ca. The colonists did not "secede" from Great Britain. They REVOLTED from the authority of the Crown and threw out by force of arms the Crown's political administration in what are now the United States.
Get your terminology straight! The United States were eventually formed after the American Revolution, not the American Secession!
Secession /= revolution
We call it a revolution, but it doesn't fit that definition. A revolution is a struggle to overthrow the existing government. We didn't overthrow the British government. We rebelled against their authority, and separated ourselves by force from their rule. A sort of secession, if you will.
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