What do you prefer, Romance or Germanic Europe? (theory, Dutch, Italians)
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The map is funny, although of course quite wrong, but still, funny There are several maps like that, there is also a global one...
Anyway, it's hard to say, while I prefer Germanic Europe for the efficient and reliable way things work there, I prefer Latin Europe (except France) for its immaterial quality of life, it's just much more beautiful to the eye (landscape, vegetation, architecture), the light is more intense, people are more open and friendlier, the women are more beautiful and charming...
So, sure, sometimes I get pissed when things down here in uncivilized European Mexico don't work the way they should, but at the end of the day I can't really imagine living in a Germanic country anymore, it would be so gloomy and cold to me.
Location: Near Tours, France about 47°10'N 0°25'E
2,825 posts, read 5,276,197 times
Reputation: 1957
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling
Anyway, it's hard to say, while I prefer Germanic Europe for the efficient and reliable way things work there, I prefer Latin Europe (except France) for its immaterial quality of life, it's just much more beautiful to the eye (landscape, vegetation, architecture), the light is more intense, people are more open and friendlier, the women are more beautiful and charming...
what do you dislike about France, compared to Germanic countries and to the other latin countries? (I guess that on your prefences what you said means that you like more latin countries excepted France fist, then Germanic countries, and at last France.
It is funny because the town where I'm France is full of retired people from Germanic nations who moved here to find exactly what you talk about of latin coutnries, it seems that they like France quite a lot...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling
So, sure, sometimes I get pissed when things down here in uncivilized European Mexico don't work the way they should, but at the end of the day I can't really imagine living in a Germanic country anymore, it would be so gloomy and cold to me.
what do you mean by "European Mexico"? Do you mean you live in a part of Mexico populated with Europeans; Or do you live in southern Europe and seem to compare it with Mexico?
what do you dislike about France, compared to Germanic countries and to the other latin countries? (I guess that on your prefences what you said means that you like more latin countries excepted France fist, then Germanic countries, and at last France.
It is funny because the town where I'm France is full of retired people from Germanic nations who moved here to find exactly what you talk about of latin coutnries, it seems that they like France quite a lot...
what do you mean by "European Mexico"? Do you mean you live in a part of Mexico populated with Europeans; Or do you live in southern Europe and seem to compare it with Mexico?
Somehow France is neither to me, neither Germanic, nor Latin, it is an odd mix, almost like 50:50. The southern third or so looks ok, but the rest doesn't appeal to me any more than Germany does.
Generally speaking I am not a big fan of France, I don't like the sound of the language, people always appear loud and arrogant to me, that whole nationalist grand nation crap (almost like in the US) is ridiculous. In this respect I like Germany, where most people are not at all patriotic or even nationalist.
I am German, but I live in Portugal, which in that funny map above is referred to as a less civilized version of Mexico
The "grande nation" expression is just a very stupid German media thing and not really used by the French. This gives us (Germans) the impression that the French are nationalist and arrogant.
cf. Grande Nation
The French I have met the last 40 years or so living on the French border were not arrogant. Ok, some occasionally clearly showed us Boches they did not like us in the 60s and 70s. But those times are gone.
By French I mean the "real" French and not Alsacians (who speak the same dialect as I do, so for me they are not really French).
Off course the French are more patriotic or nationalist than Germans, but really we are the least patriotic nation in the world anyway.
Location: Near Tours, France about 47°10'N 0°25'E
2,825 posts, read 5,276,197 times
Reputation: 1957
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling
Somehow France is neither to me, neither Germanic, nor Latin, it is an odd mix, almost like 50:50. The southern third or so looks ok, but the rest doesn't appeal to me any more than Germany does.
Aren't you confusing "latin" with "mediterranean climate"? I'm afraid, by seeing your descriptions that it seems what you expect.
I'd like to notice that even if the 2/3 north of France have no mediterranean climate it doesn't mean it is more "Germanic", even if I obviously understand that a German person would probably find it "less exotic" than the mediterranean part. Being "less exotic" doesn't mean that it is "half-germanic". Actually the only parts of France that I would considered to be half-latin half-Germanic would be Alsace, some parts of Lorraine and the French Flanders area.
There are also some of non-mediterranean climate areas in the other latin countries (I'm not even speak about Romania which doesn't have at all). A big part of Spain can hardly fits in the mediterranean-climate stereotypes (almost "tropical" exotic images in some minds) that people of Germanic Europe have in mind when they think "latin"; especially those areas in Castilla-y-Leon with their harsh winters, the areas of Atlantic coast with their cools and rainy summers, even Madrid and most of Castilla-La-Mancha doesn't fit in that stereotype either.
Concerning the mentality stereotypes I always find amusing (but also a bit condescendant) that northern Italians, who are probably one of the most efficiant, industrial, entrepreneurial and economically well-organised place in Europe are often pictured as part of inefficiant/mafia/underdevelopped country. On the caricatural map above, France is placed in the "indutrial/well fonctionning/zero-currupution" part of Europe as well as Germany or Switzerland; while northern Italy is supposed to be another world... Actually where I'm from, in the Var department, not far from, everything is much more unefficiant/high-unemplyment/un-industrial than the prosperous Norther Italy. The same way, Catalonia is much more prosperous than Languedoc-Roussillon... But people still think that France is a "half-germanic" country, supposedly very healthy, super-clean, industrial, hard working, well-managed, debt-free... We are unfortunally far from this situation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling
Generally speaking I am not a big fan of France, I don't like the sound of the language, people always appear loud and arrogant to me, that whole nationalist grand nation crap (almost like in the US) is ridiculous. In this respect I like Germany, where most people are not at all patriotic or even nationalist
The "grande nation" expression is just a very stupid German media thing and not really used by the French. This gives us (Germans) the impression that the French are nationalist and arrogant.
cf. Grande Nation
The French I have met the last 40 years or so living on the French border were not arrogant. Ok, some occasionally clearly showed us Boches they did not like us in the 60s and 70s. But those times are gone.
By French I mean the "real" French and not Alsacians (who speak the same dialect as I do, so for me they are not really French).
Off course the French are more patriotic or nationalist than Germans, but really we are the least patriotic nation in the world anyway.
I used to have French colleagues, except for one black guy they were all rather arrogant and loud. Nor did they mix with the other colleagues the way other nationalities did. They had a rather stand-offish reputation in the office.
Real French? Well, France is a somewhat heterogeneous country just like Germany or Italy. In each of these countries there is a clear north-south divide, even in terms of ethnicity. Many French are ethnically much more Germanic than Romance. The mere words French and France come from Franks, i.e. various Germanic tribes.
And the French on average look much more similar to Germans than to, say, Spaniards or Italians.
Aren't you confusing "latin" with "mediterranean climate"? I'm afraid, by seeing your descriptions that it seems what you expect.
I'd like to notice that even if the 2/3 north of France have no mediterranean climate it doesn't mean it is more "Germanic", even if I obviously understand that a German person would probably find it "less exotic" than the mediterranean part. Being "less exotic" doesn't mean that it is "half-germanic". Actually the only parts of France that I would considered to be half-latin half-Germanic would be Alsace, some parts of Lorraine and the French Flanders area.
There are also some of non-mediterranean climate areas in the other latin countries (I'm not even speak about Romania which doesn't have at all). A big part of Spain can hardly fits in the mediterranean-climate stereotypes (almost "tropical" exotic images in some minds) that people of Germanic Europe have in mind when they think "latin"; especially those areas in Castilla-y-Leon with their harsh winters, the areas of Atlantic coast with their cools and rainy summers, even Madrid and most of Castilla-La-Mancha doesn't fit in that stereotype either.
Concerning the mentality stereotypes I always find amusing (but also a bit condescendant) that northern Italians, who are probably one of the most efficiant, industrial, entrepreneurial and economically well-organised place in Europe are often pictured as part of inefficiant/mafia/underdevelopped country. On the caricatural map above, France is placed in the "indutrial/well fonctionning/zero-currupution" part of Europe as well as Germany or Switzerland; while northern Italy is supposed to be another world... Actually where I'm from, in the Var department, not far from, everything is much more unefficiant/high-unemplyment/un-industrial than the prosperous Norther Italy. The same way, Catalonia is much more prosperous than Languedoc-Roussillon... But people still think that France is a "half-germanic" country, supposedly very healthy, super-clean, industrial, hard working, well-managed, debt-free... We are unfortunally far from this situation.
No, I was not talking about Mediterranean, nor about the climate as such. My point is that except for the language the French are pretty Germanic. To me the border between Germanic and Romance Europe is not between France and Germany, but between France and Spain.
Regarding patriotism, I have perceived the French differently. Maybe we see it differently because you are French (I suppose), while I am not.
When it comes to genetics, I prefer to look at Haplogroups:
The Irish are quite different from the English, but not too much unlike the Welsh.
Not really. The dominant Haplogroup in both regions is R1b. I've read studies that have said that while areas such as the "Danelaw" are a little different from places like Wales, Cornwall and Ireland the core ancestry in all areas of the British Isle are the same Neolithic peoples with a smaller contribution by Celts, Romans and Germanic tribes. As far as a "national" identity, of course they're different, but genetically they're pretty darn close.
I used to have French colleagues, except for one black guy they were all rather arrogant and loud. Nor did they mix with the other colleagues the way other nationalities did. They had a rather stand-offish reputation in the office.
Real French? Well, France is a somewhat heterogeneous country just like Germany or Italy. In each of these countries there is a clear north-south divide, even in terms of ethnicity. Many French are ethnically much more Germanic than Romance. The mere words French and France come from Franks, i.e. various Germanic tribes.
And the French on average look much more similar to Germans than to, say, Spaniards or Italians.
I do not agree. At least here in Spain, the french people who lives here are well integrated. Last year i met many foreign students at my university and connected very well with the french girls, they had a character quite similar to spanish in some ways. You are living in Portugal, do you think they are the most open people in the world? I think people have a confusion about the mediterranean character, french people are not more closed than spaniards for exemple. Italians are world apart...They are more extroverted.
Not really. The dominant Haplogroup in both regions is R1b. I've read studies that have said that while areas such as the "Danelaw" are a little different from places like Wales, Cornwall and Ireland the core ancestry in all areas of the British Isle are the same Neolithic peoples with a smaller contribution by Celts, Romans and Germanic tribes. As far as a "national" identity, of course they're different, but genetically they're pretty darn close.
On the Isles I mostly noticed two broad types, the more southern-looking darker type and the pale to reddish type with their light blue eyes and light blond hair
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There are several maps like that, there is also a global one...
