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Calvin Klein long ago ceased being mostly if not exclusively a top designer brand. Mr. Klein like many others (including Michael Kors) have made tons of money aiming at mid-tier and below markets. That is where nearly all American, and some European so called "designer" names make their money today; licensing agreements that slap their names on products for the masses.
Calvin Klein brings in more revenue from licensing agreements (undergarments, perfume, and God only knows what else), than whatever TOL fashions that place still makes.
Want further proof? Calvin Klein recently announced it is shutting down their "collection" division.
Collection divisions are the high end side of designers like Ralph Lauren, Calvin Klein, Marc Jacobs, etc.... That is the stuff sold in either their own private retail outlets or high end shops like Barney's, Bergdoff Goodman, Nordstrom, Saks, etc...
If you wanted to know who started this whole mess; it was Coco Chanel. For those who couldn't afford the couture line, Chanel came out with perfume (at first) and then other little accessories. So if one couldn't afford a couture Chanel suit or from their ready made line; at least one could buy earrings, a handbag or something with that coveted name.
Chanel to its credit (and largely under the late Karl Largerfeld) kept the Chanel brand on a tight lead. That is to extent possible restricting the sales/distribution channel so only those select few could purchase.
Case in point; in past year or so Chanel looked around and realized too many persons "without style" or whatever were walking around with their coveted handbags. So prices were raised and numbers produced cut to limit amount on market. *That* is how you run an exclusive brand.
Chanel also has a vast and bewildering array of requirements/demands by any retail location that wishes to sell that line say such as Bloomingdales.
Chanel retains power to decide where in a shop it will be located, and who will be surrounding. So if you are an upscale mall attempting to lure Chanel they will decide what stores are going to be to left or right.
OTOH Michael Kors (especially handbags/leather goods) are nearly everywhere.
Very good insight. And I love Chanel. Karl Lagerfeld was brilliant in restricting access to their premium brand. Product access to only the select few is what defines a successful luxury brand. Chanel also tries to restrict their resale market through litigation - they are currently in the process of suing TheRealReal I think.
And as you mentioned, they heavily restrict retailers from selling their premium products - can you even get a Boy bag in Bloomingdales, or do they just sell their sunglasses and parfum there? I’ve read they are removing products from Dept. stores. I’ve only shopped at the Chanel boutique in Chicago because the product selection/service is so good, and now I have a relationship with the salesperson which could be dangerous.
I am at a point in my life where I’ll spend $ on fewer investment pieces instead of lots of cheaper clothes from a mall. I bought a Chanel tweed dress this year and it is my favorite piece of all time. I should probably avoid walking by that beautiful Chanel boutique, and a few other shops in the area.
Very good insight. And I love Chanel. Karl Lagerfeld was brilliant in restricting access to their premium brand. Product access to only the select few is what defines a successful luxury brand. Chanel also tries to restrict their resale market through litigation - they are currently in the process of suing TheRealReal I think.
And as you mentioned, they heavily restrict retailers from selling their premium products - can you even get a Boy bag in Bloomingdales, or do they just sell their sunglasses and parfum there? I’ve read they are removing products from Dept. stores. I’ve only shopped at the Chanel boutique in Chicago because the product selection/service is so good, and now I have a relationship with the salesperson which could be dangerous.
I am at a point in my life where I’ll spend $ on fewer investment pieces instead of lots of cheaper clothes from a mall. I bought a Chanel tweed dress this year and it is my favorite piece of all time. I should probably avoid walking by that beautiful Chanel boutique, and a few other shops in the area.
Very good insight. And I love Chanel. Karl Lagerfeld was brilliant in restricting access to their premium brand. Product access to only the select few is what defines a successful luxury brand. Chanel also tries to restrict their resale market through litigation - they are currently in the process of suing TheRealReal I think.
And as you mentioned, they heavily restrict retailers from selling their premium products - can you even get a Boy bag in Bloomingdales, or do they just sell their sunglasses and parfum there? I’ve read they are removing products from Dept. stores. I’ve only shopped at the Chanel boutique in Chicago because the product selection/service is so good, and now I have a relationship with the salesperson which could be dangerous.
I am at a point in my life where I’ll spend $ on fewer investment pieces instead of lots of cheaper clothes from a mall. I bought a Chanel tweed dress this year and it is my favorite piece of all time. I should probably avoid walking by that beautiful Chanel boutique, and a few other shops in the area.
Chanel is suing almost everything that breathes in the second hand (aka "circular" ) market. How successful they will be against the RealReal and others is anyone's guess.
You can get that Chanel Boy bag and everything else from that and other luxury brands at physical or online consignment or whatever shops. https://www.tradesy.com/s/chanel/boy-bag/
Ironic thing is that the high end customers of Chanel, Gucci, Prada and other such brands are the ones flooding market with all these "consignment" or whatever goods.
You have plenty of women out there who have more money than God (their own or from husbands, boyfriends, various other sources). So they buy Chanel or whatever by the bags full, then dump it on the RealReal, Tradesy, or similar places to get some of their money back. This or because of their social or media status, or maybe because they spend the equilivent to a budget of a small country per year in haute couture and ready made are either given things outright, or at deep discount. In years past great ladies like Nan Kemper would hang on to such things. Given the fragility of "fame" (and with it their finances) women today will sell that luxury item in a minute to get the money out of it.
Luxury designer goods are like automobiles and jewels; deprecation sets in the moment the things leave the shop. Resale value thus depends entirely upon what someone is willing to pay for such things second hand.
You have plenty of women out there who have more money than God (their own or from husbands, boyfriends, various other sources). So they buy Chanel or whatever by the bags full, then dump it on the RealReal, Tradesy, or similar places to get some of their money back. This or because of their social or media status, or maybe because they spend the equilivent to a budget of a small country per year in haute couture and ready made are either given things outright, or at deep discount. In years past great ladies like Nan Kemper would hang on to such things. Given the fragility of "fame" (and with it their finances) women today will sell that luxury item in a minute to get the money out of it.
Luxury designer goods are like automobiles and jewels; deprecation sets in the moment the things leave the shop. Resale value thus depends entirely upon what someone is willing to pay for such things second hand.
In recent years, Chanel products have been retaining their resale value more than most other designer brands. I don’t think there are the steep discounts on the “circular” market for Chanel. If there is a huge discount, the product has damage, is out of style, missing certificate of authenticity/hologram, or is a fake... I’m sure amazing finds can be had - they are just far and few between, and shoppers around the world are all on the hunt for them. I’ve watched these circular markets and determined it was easier to just spend a little more for the new item and eliminate the risk I’ll get a damaged/fake product.
Also, I don’t think Chanel caters to the social media mavens quite as much as the other designer brands. I doubt if they are giving away as many free products to be peddled by Instagram style makers as, for example, Dior does... Dior sends out tons of free logo diorissimo saddle bags to be hawked on social media, which IMO ultimately depreciates their luxury status. If I see the same bag/clothes in everyone’s media feed, it no longer has the desireability it once did for me. But maybe I’m in the minority, as plenty will buy the latest Fendi logo item a Kardashian is wearing.
In recent years, Chanel products have been retaining their resale value more than most other designer brands. I don’t think there are the steep discounts on the “circular” market for Chanel. If there is a huge discount, the product has damage, is out of style, missing certificate of authenticity/hologram, or is a fake... I’m sure amazing finds can be had - they are just far and few between, and shoppers around the world are all on the hunt for them. I’ve watched these circular markets and determined it was easier to just spend a little more for the new item and eliminate the risk I’ll get a damaged/fake product.
Also, I don’t think Chanel caters to the social media mavens quite as much as the other designer brands. I doubt if they are giving away as many free products to be peddled by Instagram style makers as, for example, Dior does... Dior sends out tons of free logo diorissimo saddle bags to be hawked on social media, which IMO ultimately depreciates their luxury status. If I see the same bag/clothes in everyone’s media feed, it no longer has the desireability it once did for me. But maybe I’m in the minority, as plenty will buy the latest Fendi logo item a Kardashian is wearing.
Note I did add "whatever" brands besides Chanel, was not implying they did go all in with freebies, product placement and such to the "rich and famous".
Note I did add "whatever" brands besides Chanel, was not implying they did go all in with freebies, product placement and such to the "rich and famous".
I know... I just like talking about how great Chanel is in so many ways.... I’m a little obsessed with it.
In recent years, Chanel products have been retaining their resale value more than most other designer brands. I don’t think there are the steep discounts on the “circular” market for Chanel. If there is a huge discount, the product has damage, is out of style, missing certificate of authenticity/hologram, or is a fake... I’m sure amazing finds can be had - they are just far and few between, and shoppers around the world are all on the hunt for them. I’ve watched these circular markets and determined it was easier to just spend a little more for the new item and eliminate the risk I’ll get a damaged/fake product.
Also, I don’t think Chanel caters to the social media mavens quite as much as the other designer brands. I doubt if they are giving away as many free products to be peddled by Instagram style makers as, for example, Dior does... Dior sends out tons of free logo diorissimo saddle bags to be hawked on social media, which IMO ultimately depreciates their luxury status. If I see the same bag/clothes in everyone’s media feed, it no longer has the desireability it once did for me. But maybe I’m in the minority, as plenty will buy the latest Fendi logo item a Kardashian is wearing.
With the advent of easy credit, if someone truly wants to spend a few thousand on a Chanel bag such things aren't so difficult to obtain as in years past.
While some might be paying APR of 14%-22% on that purchase over a *long* period of time; hey they still have that bag or whatever, this even if the true cost was much more.
Think that was one of reasons Chanel began restricting supply of certain items. Credit is rather easily obtainable nowadays, especially those retail/department store cards. Again people may be paying huge sums of interest on that carried balance, but they can comfort themselves with all that bling.
Hence Karl Largerfeld/Chanel feeling too many people with no "taste" or whatever being seen with Chanel bags. That was really code for "too many low class and broken down people are being seen with our product; we've got to tighten things up".
Look at Louis Vuitton. That brand with its signature bags was once the height of chic. Now that rappers and others have make "Louis nap sacks" their own, many others won't be caught dead with signature LV merchandise. Maybe the hard sided luggage or certain more discreet pieces.
I know... I just like talking about how great Chanel is in so many ways.... I’m a little obsessed with it.
Right there with you!
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal
With the advent of easy credit, if someone truly wants to spend a few thousand on a Chanel bag such things aren't so difficult to obtain as in years past.
While some might be paying APR of 14%-22% on that purchase over a *long* period of time; hey they still have that bag or whatever, this even if the true cost was much more.
Think that was one of reasons Chanel began restricting supply of certain items. Credit is rather easily obtainable nowadays, especially those retail/department store cards. Again people may be paying huge sums of interest on that carried balance, but they can comfort themselves with all that bling.
Hence Karl Largerfeld/Chanel feeling too many people with no "taste" or whatever being seen with Chanel bags. That was really code for "too many low class and broken down people are being seen with our product; we've got to tighten things up".
Look at Louis Vuitton. That brand with its signature bags was once the height of chic. Now that rappers and others have make "Louis nap sacks" their own, many others won't be caught dead with signature LV merchandise. Maybe the hard sided luggage or certain more discreet pieces.
Agree! I have a piece of LV luggage and even that I feel is "meh"... Dear Lord I realize how bizarre that sounds. Lol.
Agree! I have a piece of LV luggage and even that I feel is "meh"... Dear Lord I realize how bizarre that sounds. Lol.
I am the same . My piece of LV luggage is at the back of my closet now. My Chanel obsession has intensified since I got my tweed dress. It is so beautiful, and so well made, and so classic, and has history to it. I mean CoCo wore something very similar. Last week, I watched the Ruth Bader Ginsburg movie and she wore a similar Chanel tweed dress when she became a Supreme Court Justice decades ago.
Sometimes I go to YouTube to watch Karl send my dress down the runway on a model at his Paris fashion show. Then I go back and watch every Fall and Spring show from the last 5 years. And I think - how do I score entry to the next Chanel show?... as if... Or, I think maybe someday I’ll invest in a Chanel au couture piece... Total crazy thinking. Chanel/Karl was brilliant in building up that fantasy. And I bought into it. I’m too easily influenced by beautiful clothes.
Here's how I see some of the brands mentioned (and a few others for comparison):
Upper Upscale: Armani
Mid Upscale: Polo Ralph Lauren
Entry Level Upscale: Tommy Hilfiger, Nautica, Calvin Klein
Mid Range: Izod, Chaps
Cost Conscious Consumer Brand: Fruit of the Loom
These are from the standpoint of mens' clothing. There may be some others that could be added to these categories.
This is fairly accurate. Nautica is slightly lower than Tommy, but above IZOD and Chaps.
Here are a few more brands that I would add (both preppy style and non-preppy):
Upper Upscale (aka Luxury): Ralph Lauren Purple Label
Mid-Upscale: Lacoste
Entry Level Upscale: Lauren by Ralph Lauren
Mid-Range: Greg Norman, Callaway, Van Heusen, Arrow
Semi-Economy: U.S. Polo Assn, PGA Tour
Cost Conscious/Economy: Hanes, Gildan
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Total crazy thinking. Chanel/Karl was brilliant in building up that fantasy. And I bought into it. I’m too easily influenced by beautiful clothes. 
