[FloridaKash]

I hated High School. I would never do my homework but would constantly get A's or B's on my test. That resulted in D grades for me... which I don't think was fair. I showed I knew the material and could perform. There were other kids who did all of their homework and would get C's on their tests yet ended the class with A's or B's. Explain to me how that is fair. The slower kids who don't know the material as well as I do get a better grade?

I don't care if your kid pulls a A or B in class yet can't do well on the FCAT. It probably means your kid is super good on turning in homework but doesn't retain the material they have been working on. Heck, let's make grading easier. Your grade is entirely based on the FCAT. It is ridiculous that grades are typically 75% homework and 25% tests.

[num1baby]

Originally Posted by FloridaKash

I hated High School. I would never do my homework but would constantly get A's or B's on my test. That resulted in D grades for me... which I don't think was fair. I showed I knew the material and could perform. There were other kids who did all of their homework and would get C's on their tests yet ended the class with A's or B's. Explain to me how that is fair. The slower kids who don't know the material as well as I do get a better grade?

I don't care if your kid pulls a A or B in class yet can't do well on the FCAT. It probably means your kid is super good on turning in homework but doesn't retain the material they have been working on. Heck, let's make grading easier. Your grade is entirely based on the FCAT. It is ridiculous that grades are typically 75% homework and 25% tests.

So you are saying that I was a slower kid who didn't know the material? I don't agree. I knew the material, and trust me when I say I am not slow. I just do not do well on tests. I was also smart enough to know that I could still get an A or B in class by doing my homework. I think that the kids who followed the rules and did their homework deserved their good grades because they did the work. It is like going to work all week long, not doing anything your boss asks you to do. You finally do one task on Friday afternoon. You do it well, but you only did the one thing. Do you think you will get a good performance review? You have to put in all of the work.

Back to the subject of standardized testing, I don't think it works. So far you are one of very few people who says they did well on standardized testing. Almost everyone I know says they do bad on tests. That doesn't mean that they don't know the material. That means that the tests aren't an accurate measure of their knowledge.

[algia]

"Tests" always put on STRESS on kids, especially by those kids who go: "ohh crap, I didn't learn anything, I am going to fail" then get a straight "A"....etc...there are brilliant kids who fail tests just on the stress factor alone. But the pharmaceuticals have to make money too......so...lets medicate and keep testing! right? This is a very wrong approach to "education" and actual learning to retain that information versus learn and forget after the test!

[Swimmom32]

Originally Posted by num1baby

So you are saying that I was a slower kid who didn't know the material? I don't agree. I knew the material, and trust me when I say I am not slow. I just do not do well on tests. I was also smart enough to know that I could still get an A or B in class by doing my homework. I think that the kids who followed the rules and did their homework deserved their good grades because they did the work. It is like going to work all week long, not doing anything your boss asks you to do. You finally do one task on Friday afternoon. You do it well, but you only did the one thing. Do you think you will get a good performance review? You have to put in all of the work.

Back to the subject of standardized testing, I don't think it works. So far you are one of very few people who says they did well on standardized testing. Almost everyone I know says they do bad on tests. That doesn't mean that they don't know the material. That means that the tests aren't an accurate measure of their knowledge.

this is exactly what I mean..Again your so right but I dont think people will get it..

[Swimmom32]

Originally Posted by FloridaKash

I hated High School. I would never do my homework but would constantly get A's or B's on my test. That resulted in D grades for me... which I don't think was fair. I showed I knew the material and could perform. There were other kids who did all of their homework and would get C's on their tests yet ended the class with A's or B's. Explain to me how that is fair. The slower kids who don't know the material as well as I do get a better grade?

I don't care if your kid pulls a A or B in class yet can't do well on the FCAT. It probably means your kid is super good on turning in homework but doesn't retain the material they have been working on. Heck, let's make grading easier. Your grade is entirely based on the FCAT. It is ridiculous that grades are typically 75% homework and 25% tests.

My best friends dd who can not test well but this child is extremely bright and has been tested. She reads and writes and her math is way above her grade level as she is in HS...both my children read and write above their grade level, my daughter who is 12 is excellent in Science and does well on her School tests and Diagnostics and received an 89 on her science project that she also did by herself I just have to disagree..My father was a NYC teacher for 21 years and he hates the standardized tests an feels they are NOT a shoe in on whether or not the child can Learn or has Learned..There are alot of other factors that should be taken into account....As all children do NOT learn alike...The bottom line is they both just don't test well In General which does not mean they do not know the material..My SON is in DECA a business program thru his HS and he wrote a 23 page book on Internet Marketing by himself and put it into a powerpoint presentation Book came in 12th in the STATE OF FLORIDA Went to States a few weeks ago did a presentation in front of the Judges and Wound up coming in 5th in His Catagory out of 12, so IM SORRY but he would not have gone to states and came in 5th in the STATE of florida for his catagory if he wasnt SMART....60% by the way goes to TESTS here in Palm Beach County...25% is Homework and the rest is for lab or homework..

[bbronston]

The irony here is that people love to talk about how bad the schools are in Florida. They don't say that because they've observed all of the teachers or talked with all of the students. They pretty much are either parroting what they've heard or they are referring to SAT scores of Florida kids vis-a-vis scores of kids in other states (which, by the way, even the SAT people warn against). Obviously, the SAT is a standardized test that is applied throughout the US. It doesn't measure intelligence or knowledge. It is a tool to predict collegiate success and it is actually pretty accurate.
I don't know what the FCAT is supposed to be able to measure but I hope it is not actual understanding because I don't think it can really do that. It might be able to measure a student's ability to read a question, discern the crux of the question, evaluate the validity of the possible answers, and circle the right answer. I know what you are thinking but that is a worthwhile measurement because it would also be a tool to predict success on SAT tests and it is the SAT test score, as I mentioned, that people seem to focus on. Kids getting higher SAT scores equals a better chance of getting into top schools and that ability governs the "excellent schools vs terrible schools" debate. College isn't for everyone, though, and I think it is somewhat unfair to hold teachers accountable for making all their students qualified to attend college. I do think it is fair to hold teachers to a basic education standard that must be measurable one way or the other. That is what they are supposed to be doing, after all. But they must also have a system that says it is not alright to pass a kid that can't read, write, or do math at their current level onto the next level because the parent can't face reality.

[Swimmom32]

Originally Posted by bbronston

The irony here is that people love to talk about how bad the schools are in Florida. They don't say that because they've observed all of the teachers or talked with all of the students. They pretty much are either parroting what they've heard or they are referring to SAT scores of Florida kids vis-a-vis scores of kids in other states (which, by the way, even the SAT people warn against). Obviously, the SAT is a standardized test that is applied throughout the US. It doesn't measure intelligence or knowledge. It is a tool to predict collegiate success and it is actually pretty accurate.
I don't know what the FCAT is supposed to be able to measure but I hope it is not actual understanding because I don't think it can really do that. It might be able to measure a student's ability to read a question, discern the crux of the question, evaluate the validity of the possible answers, and circle the right answer. I know what you are thinking but that is a worthwhile measurement because it would also be a tool to predict success on SAT tests and it is the SAT test score, as I mentioned, that people seem to focus on. Kids getting higher SAT scores equals a better chance of getting into top schools and that ability governs the "excellent schools vs terrible schools" debate. College isn't for everyone, though, and I think it is somewhat unfair to hold teachers accountable for making all their students qualified to attend college. I do think it is fair to hold teachers to a basic education standard that must be measurable one way or the other. That is what they are supposed to be doing, after all. But they must also have a system that says it is not alright to pass a kid that can't read, write, or do math at their current level onto the next level because the parent can't face reality.

that is very true...The problem is years ago kids were promoted socially because it was a bad thing to leave a child back because then they were stupid..We retained our Daughter and it was the best thing for her, however had she had the proper Teaching when she was in 1st grade and 2nd grade and they would have picked up on the Issues she had instead of putting her in a Time Out because she was Not focusing or paying attention etc things might have been different...She is thriving in School as well as our son but still has a few small challenges..and We aren't from florida as our children went to school up North..

[algia]

we also go by Statistics who put Florida 45 in graduation rates.......aside from word of mouth. You can't be 45th out of 50 states if a good education is provided.

[vaughanwilliams]

Originally Posted by FloridaKash

I don't care if your kid pulls a A or B in class yet can't do well on the FCAT. It probably means your kid is super good on turning in homework but doesn't retain the material they have been working on. Heck, let's make grading easier. Your grade is entirely based on the FCAT. It is ridiculous that grades are typically 75% homework and 25% tests.

I think it's ridiculous that the FCAT or any other one size fits all test counts for anything other than a small percentage of a final grade. I did great on all my standardize testing-many times it was better than the class brainiacs. Doesn't mean I was smarter or retained more- I just have a knack of picking the most logical answers on multiple choice tests. I even could do it with math, which at the time was my worst subject, as long as I didn't have to show how I came up with the answer.

[num1baby]

Originally Posted by algia

we also go by Statistics who put Florida 45 in graduation rates.......aside from word of mouth. You can't be 45th out of 50 states if a good education is provided.

The question I have is is it up to the schools to make sure these kids graduate, or is it up to the parents? I think it is my job as a parent to make sure my child is doing her job by going to school, working hard at it and graduating at the end. How can the schools be held accountable for the parents not doing their job?