North vs. South (Carolina)... the good, the bad, and the ugly? (middle-class, transplants)
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I know there are plenty of people here that know one state or the other, and also many who know both very well. I would love to hear from you all.
I am presently researching possible areas to (hopefully) move to in a couple/few years and both North and South Carolina seem like they would be perfect fits for me in so many ways, but I honestly can't determine which would be a better fit, and which city would be the best for me.
Without telling you my criteria, I would like to hear pros and cons of one state over the other. I've done months worth of research and traveled out there a bit this summer, but so far I really like both. I know there are more abundant jobs in some areas, and more to do in other areas. I know the economy is struggling more in some other areas than others, but I also know it's all relative because most cities of any decent size in both states are doing better than where I currently live.
I don't know a lot about the government of each state, the various laws, and general everyday quality of life stuff. Would love to hear from both sides!
I think that perhaps a few basic criteria should be shared: are you looking for a place to live and work, or retire? Do you have any school-age children? Any geographical preferences?
Overall, NC is more progressive than SC, having made investments in education and infrastructure decades ago that are now paying off in a big way. NC also has more truly liberal areas than SC--well, just two (the Triangle and Asheville), but they are more noticeably liberal than anything in SC, although Columbia and Charleston lean a bit to the left.
Charlotte and the Raleigh-Durham area stand out above all other cities in both states in terms of size, growth, amenities, jobs, etc. After that, Columbia, Charleston, Greenville, Greensboro, and Winston-Salem are all more or less on the same level, give or take a few things. I think that SC's larger cities on the whole have more interesting geographical settings, but if you like a city in the mountains, Asheville takes the cake.
Both states have some nice cities but there are political/sociological viewpoints that help sway many in terms of their decision. South Carolina is quite conservative politically and socially, the Confederate Flag is still proudly flown above the state house for instance. North Carolina while not the most progressive state is quite a bit further along in terms of 21st Century practicality. The only exception in SC being many neighborhoods in/around downtown Columbia, maybe a few in Charleston or Greenville. Most who move from more progressive areas of the country find (more or less in order) cities in NC such as Durham, Chapel Hill, Asheville, Raleigh, Winston Salem, Greensboro and Charlotte to be attractive places to live and not much different.
NC also tends more to be a geographic melting pot versus mostly those born/raised there which you'll see much more of in SC.
NC also tends more to be a geographic melting pot versus mostly those born/raised there which you'll see much more of in SC.
The coast is a notable exception to this general trend in SC, and to a lesser extent, Columbia, Greenville, and the SC 'burbs of Charlotte (e.g., Fort Mill, Tega Cay, Indian Land, etc.).
I think that perhaps a few basic criteria should be shared: are you looking for a place to live and work, or retire? Do you have any school-age children? Any geographical preferences?
Overall, NC is more progressive than SC, having made investments in education and infrastructure decades ago that are now paying off in a big way. NC also has more truly liberal areas than SC--well, just two (the Triangle and Asheville), but they are more noticeably liberal than anything in SC, although Columbia and Charleston lean a bit to the left.
Charlotte and the Raleigh-Durham area stand out above all other cities in both states in terms of size, growth, amenities, jobs, etc. After that, Columbia, Charleston, Greenville, Greensboro, and Winston-Salem are all more or less on the same level, give or take a few things. I think that SC's larger cities on the whole have more interesting geographical settings, but if you like a city in the mountains, Asheville takes the cake.
Actually Greensboro and Winston Salem aren't that much less liberal than the Raleigh/Durham area, standing at about 50/50 overall (Red/Blue), with higher Blue numbers within the city limits. Both are considerably larger than Columbia, Charleston and Greenville with Greensboro at 275K population and Winston Salem around 235K. Columbia is SC's largest city with just 130K. The Greensboro-Winston Salem CSA is the 33rd largest metro area in the country with 1.6 million people. Raleigh-Durham is the 30th largest metro area, so we're not talking that much of a difference overall.
Ok, I'll share some basic criteria. I don't want to narrow myself down to the cities I think I'd end up without objectively hearing everything I can, but I suppose I should give ya some idea what I'm looking for!
By the time we would move, it would be just myself and my husband (son will be in college by that point). We are middle-class 40-something educated "professionals" and I am back in school again to earn an Accounting degree to open up my opportunities for better jobs and more money. So I would like a place that has opportunities for Accounting jobs.
My husband's "field" is pretty narrow but he is the best in the area at what he does - he is a supevisor in a local gov't office that deals with property/tax etc. issues. We are not sure how he would find a job that compares - that, unfortunately, would be the one thing that would keep us here...
I have not been to Raleigh but I know the economy is stronger there. But it sounds... maybe boring? Drove through Charlotte and Columbia on my Way from Asheville to Charleston. Charlotte sounds a wee bit intimidating, Columbia sounds like it has higher crime...
I Loved Asheville but not enough opportunity/affordable housing there. I REALLY LOVED Charleston but not sure about finding jobs/affordable housing. I like the sounds of Greenville on paper, which we flew into... but I didn't stay there at all - drove right to Asheville. I really wish I had investigated the area for a day...
A Whole Foods Market/Trader Joes is almost a must. My city has a Whole Foods (not market) that is more like a convenience store compared to Whole Foods Market.
Affordable housing - would be really nice to be able to find something built within the past 10-20 years with at least 2000 sq ft for around $200-250k in a nice neighborhood that isn't going to be a terrible commute to our jobs.
Things to do within the area and a couple hours drive would be great. I like the mountains quite a bit but I really love the ocean.
Ok, well once I got going, it seems I wasn't able to stop. That was a lot more criteria than I thought I was going to give!
Regarding politics, I lean more to the left and currently live in an area that leans way to the left, and I can see how that can really hurt a city. I realize that cities that lean more to the right seem to be more economically stable. I can get along either way.
Actually Greensboro and Winston Salem aren't that much less liberal than the Raleigh/Durham area, standing at about 50/50 overall (Red/Blue), with higher Blue numbers within the city limits.
Red/blue percentages aren't the best gauge of liberalness. Sometimes that's the case due to large minority populations that may vote Dem but are more on the socially conservative side.
Quote:
Both are considerably larger than Columbia, Charleston and Greenville with Greensboro at 275K population and Winston Salem around 235K. Columbia is SC's largest city with just 130K.
SC has very restrictive annexation laws while NC has had some of the most liberal annexation laws, so you can't really use city populations to gauge their size. MSA's are a much better gauge of the true sizes of these cities, which are similar:
The Greensboro-Winston Salem CSA is the 33rd largest metro area in the country with 1.6 million people. Raleigh-Durham is the 30th largest metro area, so we're not talking that much of a difference overall.
And Greenville-Spartanburg-Anderson CSA is 39th at about 1.4 million, but there's still a palpable difference in feel, especially considering that they are all multi-nodal metros. Raleigh is definitely larger and faster-growing than the largest city in the Triad and Upstate and continues to pull away. Again, Charlotte and Raleigh are tiered above the rest of the cities in the Carolinas in most respects.
Ok, I'll share some basic criteria. I don't want to narrow myself down to the cities I think I'd end up without objectively hearing everything I can, but I suppose I should give ya some idea what I'm looking for!
By the time we would move, it would be just myself and my husband (son will be in college by that point). We are middle-class 40-something educated "professionals" and I am back in school again to earn an Accounting degree to open up my opportunities for better jobs and more money. So I would like a place that has opportunities for Accounting jobs.
My husband's "field" is pretty narrow but he is the best in the area at what he does - he is a supevisor in a local gov't office that deals with property/tax etc. issues. We are not sure how he would find a job that compares - that, unfortunately, would be the one thing that would keep us here...
I have not been to Raleigh but I know the economy is stronger there. But it sounds... maybe boring? Drove through Charlotte and Columbia on my Way from Asheville to Charleston. Charlotte sounds a wee bit intimidating, Columbia sounds like it has higher crime...
I Loved Asheville but not enough opportunity/affordable housing there. I REALLY LOVED Charleston but not sure about finding jobs/affordable housing. I like the sounds of Greenville on paper, which we flew into... but I didn't stay there at all - drove right to Asheville. I really wish I had investigated the area for a day...
A Whole Foods Market/Trader Joes is almost a must. My city has a Whole Foods (not market) that is more like a convenience store compared to Whole Foods Market.
Affordable housing - would be really nice to be able to find something built within the past 10-20 years with at least 2000 sq ft for around $200-250k in a nice neighborhood that isn't going to be a terrible commute to our jobs.
Things to do within the area and a couple hours drive would be great. I like the mountains quite a bit but I really love the ocean.
Ok, well once I got going, it seems I wasn't able to stop. That was a lot more criteria than I thought I was going to give!
It seems that your husband's job is the real linchpin here, in which case your best bets would probably be the state capitals of Columbia and Raleigh. Of course Raleigh is larger, faster-growing, and has more jobs overall. Columbia provides quicker access to the mountains and a wider variety of coastal locations (Myrtle Beach, Charleston, Hilton Head/Beaufort, Savannah). Both have Whole Foods and Trader Joe's (Columbia landed both relatively recently, while Raleigh has had them for a while now). I'm pretty sure both areas meet your housing requirements. Columbia's crime is mostly relegated to parts of the city easily avoided, so that shouldn't be a major concern.
If your husband can find a comparable job in the private sector, then Greensboro, Winston-Salem, Greenville, and Charleston would be great options as well. Of course Charlotte would be too, but it seems like it might be a little too large for your tastes.
I like NC more. The cities are nicer and the people are more friendly to transplants (not by much though). The moment I cross the border into SC, I always can tell by the crappy roads and cops every 100 yards waiting to give you a ticket for going 1 mile over the speed limit.
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