How to Solve The Gun Problem in USA 101 - an European perspective (arsenal, activist)
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Well I don't think my neighbors would appreciate re-introducing wolves, so yes, actually, we do. I have several acres of land, if we don't act to control the deer population, they will wipe out my garden, and then either run out in the road to get hit by a car (causing injury or death to the driver) or starve, spread disease then die a slow painful death ( unless they're eaten alive by bobcat or coyotes instead).
In Michigan, hunters are more likely to die in a automobile-deer collision on the road than a hunting accident in the woods.
Hunting is not just sport, there are still many rural areas in the USA where hunting is a significant part of how people put food on the table, including keeping pests out of the garden and predators away from livestock.
Hunting is also big business -- Firearms hunters (primarily deer and waterfowl hunters) in just the state of Michigan contribute nearly $2 billion to the state economy. That's just one US state.
I keep my grocery bill quite low by hunting and fishing and I live in CA. Horrors for some
For the record we have a family farm in CO with 1500 acres that I grew up on and may retire on. Deer everywhere.
You do know that the comparisons are made more fair by citing per capita aggregates right? Its a valid enough way of making a comparison. There is no rationalizing away the completely off the chain gun violence statistics of the U.S.
Indeed, I do. You also realize that when one enjoys the density of humans we do, mathematical odds go up exponentially. Regardless, between the freedoms we enjoy and the proliferation of weapons we are bound to have quite a few shootings. Regardless, we are willing to live with that fr the trade off.
It's a price we pay and are willing to pay it. Despite that, we have everyone and his brother coming here. I wish it would scare more away. We're full. 3rd most populated country in the world. And growing. We have doubled in less than 80 years.
Let me ask you something. Do you feel safer in India, the soviet union, brazil, columbia, and china than you do here?
Again, remove guns / ammo from households (nowhere to steal them) and ban the gun stores (nowhere to "legally" acquire them) and the problem is mostly solved, since they would have nowhere to find them in the US.
I'll sum it up for the last time. By promoting such a widespread diffusion of weapons on the country you're actively helping the criminals to easily acquire / steal them without even the need to leave the US territory, your city or even your neighbor: one could as well get shot today with the very same weapon that the thug stole from his neighbor househould the other day.
That is the problem. That is the point of my thread.
If you can't understand this reasoning, which is based on facts, then you're delusional into thinking that your guns are protecting you. They aren't. They're giving the criminals, hood-rats and gangs the chance to be violent criminals, ruining ENTIRE neighborhoods and in cases like Philadelphia entire portions of cities which could be otherwise safely gentrified.
Even worse when violent crime spills from these bad areas into good ones, which it occasionally DOES, and makes your daily life in a first world country less worrisome than it should be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slowpoke_TX
OP: How you gonna stop the thugs and criminals from getting illegal guns smuggled into the country?
There's no way the small Mexico can smuggle enough guns to pack the US territory with guns again.
US criminals are NOT getting their weapons from abroad, when there are way more than enough in the US of A.
Last edited by TheDeltaOrionis; 11-04-2015 at 08:50 PM..
Presidents have been assassinated while surrounded by armed, trained, Secret Service personnel. Police Officers and State Troopers have been wounded or shot to death armed and ready, or armed but not ready. Armed women have been raped. Armed homeowners have been burglarized... ... the guy chasing you down a blind alley is going to get you. Gun or no gun, you are his. Sorry. It went bad from the moment you started running. I think gun haters could accept the reality of gun possession and ownership, if our intelligence was not insulted periodically, by these wild claims of guns conferring some kind of immunity to pillage and rape. Just stop it. Guns allow fearful people a means to murder people they suspect of having bad intentions towards them, whether or not it is in fact the case. Guns are of no use against military level weaponry and armor and IF, big IF, the government ever really turned on the citizenry... ... the best use for the ~320 million firearms in civilian possession... suicide. Anything else can be ameliorated by: living in an area known to be free from violent crime or home invasion; adequate home security, exterior grade doors, window treatment appropriate to the level of threat posed by the environment; common sense situational awareness when out and about. Ben Carson took some heat for saying that the classroom of students attacked by a mass shooter in Roseburg, OR should have rushed him rather than lie down like sheep and allow him to execute several of them. He was criticized for saying this, but he is in fact correct. Having a gun under those circumstances would have done little or nothing.
In just this last month of October I have heard of 3 incidents where a father has killed his own children in hunting accidents. One of them killed his daughter. He missed the deer or the bullet went through the deer... killed his daughter. WTF. I would also die. I would not be coming out of the woods alive after doing something like that. In 2015 does any adult need to be running around in the woods in camouflage shooting live ammunition at Bambi? The stars are waiting people. Over at Jet Propulsion Laboratory plans are being made to lift payloads to Mars. There is an International Space Station in orbit around this planet and an astronaut is in it going on 215 days in space. His wife is Gabrielle Giffords a former senator from Arizona whose career in politics was cut short when a gunman opened fire on her at an event where there must have been 50 or more attendees with handguns on their person. 8 or 9 people were killed that day and she was the only survivor. If you can call it that. I suspect she has recovered as well as she is going to recover. That is considerably short of "normal". Some people will still be able to get guns no matter what is done to prevent it. That shooter would not have been one of them. The Roseburg shooter would not have been one of them. The Newtown shooter would not have been one of them. The Sandy Hook shooter would not have been one of them. The Virginia Tech shooter would not have been one of them. The Colorado theater shooter would not have been one of them... ...
A Gun is your best Protection. There are a lot of "Bad" people out there, and having a Gun can save your life, regardless of what Gun Haters would have you believe. They want you to bet your life, or the life of your loved ones, on them being right. Bad gamble, because you may not get to play again.
All those people who you claim that would not have been able to get guns, would have gotten guns anyway, and did get guns, so you have no point. In fact, your whole post is flawed and not true. Like your reference to Deer Hunting. What has that got to do with anything? Accidents happen. How many Car Accidents happened that day? All those guns where legal anyway, so what's your point?
Again, remove guns / ammo from households (nowhere to steal them) and ban the gun stores (nowhere to "legally" acquire them) and the problem is mostly solved, since they would have nowhere to find them in the US.
I'll sum it up for the last time. By promoting such a widespread diffusion of weapons on the country you're actively helping the criminals to easily acquire / steal them without even the need to leave the US territory, your city or even your neighbor: one could as well get shot today with the very same weapon that the thug stole from his neighbor househould the other day.
That is the problem. That is the point of my thread.
If you can't understand this reasoning, which is based on facts, then you're delusional into thinking that your guns are protecting you. They aren't. They're giving the criminals, hood-rats and gangs the chance to be violent criminals, ruining ENTIRE neighborhoods which could be otherwise safely gentrified.
"Remove guns from households." That's not a fact, that's a fantasy. That can't be done in the US with merely the passage of a law, it would take the obliteration of the entire Bill of Rights and the institution of the harshest totalitarian regime since Stalin. Then you'll have to institute rigid population re-education for several generations, including destroying US history and re-writing it.
Start with the real world as it is. Guns can't be uninvented and Americans are not Europeans. Funny, too, at my CHL class there were a number of Asians and Europeans who identified themselves with passports--oh, dang...they're being infected before even becoming citizens.
Last edited by Ralph_Kirk; 11-04-2015 at 08:56 PM..
Again, remove guns / ammo from households (nowhere to steal them) and ban the gun stores (nowhere to "legally" acquire them) and the problem is mostly solved, since they would have nowhere to find them in the US.
I'll sum it up for the last time. By promoting such a widespread diffusion of weapons on the country you're actively helping the criminals to easily acquire / steal them without even the need to leave the US territory, your city or even your neighbor: one could as well get shot today with the very same weapon that the thug stole from his neighbor househould the other day.
That is the problem. That is the point of my thread.
If you can't understand this reasoning, which is based on facts, then you're delusional into thinking that your guns are protecting you. They aren't. They're giving the criminals, hood-rats and gangs the chance to be violent criminals, ruining ENTIRE neighborhoods which could be otherwise safely gentrified.
Remove Guns? How would you suggest doing that? Why don't you get rid of all the Mosquitos in the United States first. If you can do that, I may listen to you.
Better yet, let me "Sum" it up for you. By wanting to get rid of all Guns, your actually helping Criminals commit crimes in a safer environment.
There is no common sense in your reasoning, so there is nothing to get out of it. Your delusional if you think you or anyone else can disarm America. Its impossible, period. Only a mentally challenged person would think that all citizens and criminals alike, would surrender their firearms if asked to, or a law was passed to turn them in. Its comedy to even think that. NO one could enforce it.
Remove Guns? How would you suggest doing that? Why don't you get rid of all the Mosquitos in the United States first. If you can do that, I may listen to you.
Better yet, let me "Sum" it up for you. By wanting to get rid of all Guns, your actually helping Criminals commit crimes in a safer environment.
There is no common sense in your reasoning, so there is nothing to get out of it. Your delusional if you think you or anyone else can disarm America. Its impossible, period. Only a mentally challenged person would think that all citizens and criminals alike, would surrender their firearms if asked to, or a law was passed to turn them in. Its comedy to even think that. NO one could enforce it.
You still don't seem to understand HOW criminals take their guns, which I have already explained. Criminals take guns / ammos in the US territory, either by stealing them from US citiziens themselves or "legally" acquiring in gun stores with sketchy practices. Stop selling guns in the US territory. Problem mostly solved.
You don't even have to forcibly take guns away from citiziens and criminals.
Stop selling ammos and in general close the THOUSANDS of gun stores everywhere in the US save for the non-diverse hunting communities in Idaho, Vermont or whatever - they'll run out of either guns or ammos sooner or later. Or simply tackle the problem with small steps, it doesn't have to be a sudden change.
Yeah, the NRA doesn't want that. But if the US as a collectivity changes its wrong mentality towards guns and the "safety" they provide, along with voting the right politicians and presidents who are openly against guns, I bet the NRA may as well shut the **** up.
The problem is that the US isn't taking ANY step against the problem.
Last edited by TheDeltaOrionis; 11-04-2015 at 09:10 PM..
You don't even have to take guns away from citiziens and criminals.
Stop selling ammos and in general close the gun stores save for the non-diverse hunting communities in Idaho, Vermont or whatever - they'll run out of either guns or ammos sooner or later.
Or simply tackle the problem with small steps, it doesn't have to be a sudden change.
The problem is that the US isn't taking ANY step against the problem.
Ya, please do. The guys that reload "like me" will get rich on the black market. Excellent strategy. You should run for President.
Ya, please do. The guys that reload "like me" will get rich on the black market. Excellent strategy. You should run for President.
Amen, and when I get my 3D Printer, I can make a good living printing guns , and like you, reloading ammo. By the time we run out of resources to do this, we will have "Energy Pulse Weapons."
You still don't seem to understand HOW criminals take their guns, which I have already explained. Criminals take guns / ammos in the US territory, either by stealing them from US citiziens themselves or "legally" acquiring in gun stores with sketchy practices. Stop selling guns in the US territory. Problem mostly solved.
You don't even have to forcibly take guns away from citiziens and criminals.
Stop selling ammos and in general close the THOUSANDS of gun stores everywhere in the US save for the non-diverse hunting communities in Idaho, Vermont or whatever - they'll run out of either guns or ammos sooner or later. Or simply tackle the problem with small steps, it doesn't have to be a sudden change.
Yeah, the NRA doesn't want that. But if the US as a collectivity changes its wrong mentality towards guns and the "safety" they provide, along with voting the right politicians and presidents who are openly against guns, I bet the NRA may as well shut the **** up.
The problem is that the US isn't taking ANY step against the problem.
Your theory makes no sense at all. Closing gun stores does nothing. The Millions of guns out there are not in gun stores. They have already been sold and are in private hands. All that will happen is that Private sales will rise, and folks will be selling and trading in guns with each other. Your problem still does not go away.
The NRA is not going away, and the Population is not changing its mind on Gun Ownership. In fact, support has increased a lot for Gun Rights, instead of going down, as you suggest.
And we are taking steps. We are supporting the NRA more, and writing/emailing Politicians , letting them no we don't vote for anti-gun Politicians, nor make donations to them.
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