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Where is the CDC getting this statistic from? According to the DOJ, among college women, which is the most targeted demo where the incidence would be highest, it is 1 in 40.
Which is 2.5% of college women. Where is the CDC getting a 25% across the board, all women rape stat, 10x higher than DOJ?
Sorry, name calling is NOT a big deal at all. Someone calling a name across a street 1x is NOT harassment. It's just a jerk being jerky. Your perception is off. And it is in NO WAY EVER equivalent to rape. There is zero comparison there. By saying getting a tap on the butt in a bar or having a man yell something across the street is EQUAL to rape is a disservice. Because it makes people take rape less seriously because they are comparing the two as equals "well, if women think getting called a name is the same as getting raped, what the difference?"
I am sorry you were raped. But I have on other info on your case so I cannot comment on it.
But saying men have no idea rape is a problem does not match your statement that 1 in 3/4/5/ women are raped. If rapes were occurring at those high numbers, men would know it was an issue, wouldn't they? Since they are out and about raping all the time. They are the ones doing it so they *would* be aware of it. If the 1 in 3/4/5 -- interesting how the numbers just get tossed around -- numbers were accurate.
Again, please point out where I said yelling across the street is the equivalent to rape. Go ahead, look for it. It's going to be a while, because I never said that. What I have asserted is that it is just an example of how women are mistreated every, single day for no reason other than existing.
Also feel free to point out where I said that a tap on the behind is the same. And for the record, that DOES fit the legal definition of assault, and men have been charged for doing it.
The department of justice records REPORTED rapes. The CDC takes into account the number of assaults that were never reported. My case is not a rape according to the Department of Justice because he was never charged, thanks to the mishandling of my rape kit making it untestible.
And do you really think men go around telling their friends, "I raped her."? They may tell their friends they had sex with someone, but they sure as heck aren't going to tell them it was forced or coerced. So, no, I don't think most men know how many women are really raped. Their friends don't tell them they did it, and women sure as heck don't tell their guy friends that they were raped. They do, however, tell their women friends. Do you think my co-workers, neighbors, friends, etc. know I was raped? It's not like it was on the news. It's not like I bring it up in conversation. Heck, only a small handful of my immediate family even knows.
If rape is so rare, then why do we tell women to not walk alone at night? Or to use the buddy system at parties? Why? I mean, if it's relatively rare, why do we bother to tell them that?
Your responses do nothing but illustrate my point, that you, like I believe the majority of men, really DON'T have any idea how common it is. None.
Where is the CDC getting this statistic from? According to the DOJ, among college women, which is the most targeted demo where the incidence would be highest, it is 1 in 40.
Which is 2.5% of college women. Where is the CDC getting a 25% across the board, all women rape stat, 10x higher than DOJ?
Sorry, name calling is NOT a big deal at all. Someone calling a name across a street 1x is NOT harassment. It's just a jerk being jerky. Your perception is off. And it is in NO WAY EVER equivalent to rape. There is zero comparison there. By saying getting a tap on the butt in a bar or having a man yell something across the street is EQUAL to rape is a disservice. Because it makes people take rape less seriously because they are comparing the two as equals "well, if women think getting called a name is the same as getting raped, what the difference?"
I am sorry you were raped. But I have on other info on your case so I cannot comment on it.
But saying men have no idea rape is a problem does not match your statement that 1 in 3/4/5/ women are raped. If rapes were occurring at those high numbers, men would know it was an issue, wouldn't they? Since they are out and about raping all the time. They are the ones doing it so they *would* be aware of it. If the 1 in 3/4/5 -- interesting how the numbers just get tossed around -- numbers were accurate.
All women experience harassment
Most women are raped - which could be penetration or some sort of forced sex act
Even a significant minority of men are.
It's just the way things are.
I tried to report it. It was a small area. He was well known. People accused me of complaining about the sex (rape) because I was racist and that they knew him, he was a nice guy, and I was "lucky to have him." His cop buddies never made a police report so it was officially unreported, but I did all I could to report it.
I've encountered other women who also had police turn them away and refuse to write up a report.
There was even a case in Virginia where a man raped a young woman and the police pressured her to file a police report. She hadn't wanted to do so. She went along with it, and then the police arrested her for filing a false police report after police allowed rapist access to some of the evidence to potentially alter it. The rapist went on to kill the woman's nephew and is sentenced to life in prison. Seems this man is rumored to have been a criminal informant and the cops were trying to keep from losing their CI and was willing to basically torture this girl to do it and put her and her sister through hell. (Google Prince McLeod Rams murder sometime for full details on that.)
I love this quote. "We talk about how many women were raped last year, not about how many men raped women. We talk about how many girls in a school district were harassed last year, not about how many boys harassed girls. We talk about how many girls in the state of Vermont got pregnant last year, rather than how many men or boys impregnated teenage girls. So you can see how the use of the passive voice has a political effect. (It) shifts the focus off of men and boys and onto girls and women. Even the term 'violence against women' is problematic. It's a passive construction; there's no active agent in the sentence. It's a bad thing that happens to women, but when you look at that term, 'violence against women," nobody is doing it to them. It just happens to them. Men aren't even a part of it." -Jackson Katz
Yes, and also many of the men that rape do it to many women. Plus, not many men admit to rape, so there's no way other than convictions to determine number of rapists, which wouldn't include the number of rapists who aren't convicted. The number of rapes are often taken from random surveys, and even that isn't accurate since it would depend on the sample. It's a bigger problem than conviction rates indicate and likely an even bigger problem than the surveys indicate.
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Why are they underreported?
Because victims don't want to put up with victim-blaming. Because we as a culture are so judgmental against weakness and sensitivity that we lack compassion for people with those traits. Also because we tend to be around people like us and don't think anyone in our social circle could possibly be like that. Add to that the fact that humans in general love to flatter themselves that they (and their immediate social circle members) are better people than we and they actually are.
Given all this, it's not hard to see why people trivialize or blame victims if they come forward.
I have often wondered how many men out of 10 would rape a woman if they had the opportunity, there was no chance of any repercussion whatsoever and no way anyone would ever know. My guess is 7 or 8 out of 10 would rape. I asked my husband and he said probably 2 out of 10. I honestly think that men give other men the benefit of the doubt. They think "Oh Joe/Bill/Tom/Bob would never do something like that." But women know otherwise and are often not believed so they are reluctant to report rape. I know many women who were raped and they never reported it. It's the same old story. They knew they would get the blame and the system was stacked against them.
My Dad was a very good man, but he was very naive about people. When my sisters and I were in high school a local prominent businessman's son was accused of rape. My father actually said "I don't believe that. He comes from a good family and I know his father from Rotary Club." My mom, my 3 sisters and I all laughed hysterically because we knew that the prominent businessman was a total creep and his son was worse. My Mom asked my Dad if he thought that his friend from Rotary treated her the same as he treated my Dad, and my Dad was dumbfounded. My Dad, and many other men, never understand that powerful/prominent men act totally different around their peers than they do around people they view as powerless and vulnerable.
I think that most men will never understand that many men treat men very differently from the way they treat women, especially when there are no other men around to witness it. That's part of the reason why rape victims are not believed. Remember that swimmer at Stanford who raped a drunk women. And the judge was concerned about ruining his life.
Last edited by Jakealope; 10-19-2017 at 01:31 PM..
Reason: Added another thought
Again, please point out where I said yelling across the street is the equivalent to rape. Go ahead, look for it. It's going to be a while, because I never said that. What I have asserted is that it is just an example of how women are mistreated every, single day for no reason other than existing.
Also feel free to point out where I said that a tap on the behind is the same. And for the record, that DOES fit the legal definition of assault, and men have been charged for doing it.
The department of justice records REPORTED rapes. The CDC takes into account the number of assaults that were never reported. My case is not a rape according to the Department of Justice because he was never charged, thanks to the mishandling of my rape kit making it untestible.
And do you really think men go around telling their friends, "I raped her."? They may tell their friends they had sex with someone, but they sure as heck aren't going to tell them it was forced or coerced. So, no, I don't think most men know how many women are really raped. Their friends don't tell them they did it, and women sure as heck don't tell their guy friends that they were raped. They do, however, tell their women friends. Do you think my co-workers, neighbors, friends, etc. know I was raped? It's not like it was on the news. It's not like I bring it up in conversation. Heck, only a small handful of my immediate family even knows.
If rape is so rare, then why do we tell women to not walk alone at night? Or to use the buddy system at parties? Why? I mean, if it's relatively rare, why do we bother to tell them that?
Your responses do nothing but illustrate my point, that you, like I believe the majority of men, really DON'T have any idea how common it is. None.
Quote from you: "In regards to the #metoo campaign - it's not just about outright assault, although 1 in 3 women have been rapes. Think about it. 1 in 3. Look around the room and think about that when your family is gathered together for the holidays. But it's also about mistreatment and harassment. I don't know one, single, woman who has not been grabbed at a party or bar, or had vile things said or yelled to her by complete strangers while walking down the street. That's harassment"
You are mentioning "mistreatment" "harassment" and "rape" as though they are equal when discussing the metoo "campaign" and I use that word loosely.
You truly believe that every 3rd or 4th man you pass by on the street is a rapist? You honestly believe that? Where is the CDC getting these numbers? Are they made up? WHERE is the data to support the number that 1 in 4 women are raped?
Here are more recent number is reported rapes from October 2013 from the National Crime Victimization Survey:
in 2003: 1.4 rape/sexual assault per 1,000 (total no. 325,310)
in 2011: 0.9 rape/sexual assault per 1,000 (total no, 244,190)
in 2012: 1.3 rape sexual assault per 1,000 (total no. 346, 830)
How can the CDC exponentially inflate these numbers?? When the NCVS is reporting 1.3 incidents --that's both rape AND sexual assault -- per 1,000 PEOPLE, not even solely women.
and the CDC ups it to 1 in 4/5.
RECAP:
Statistic of rape/sexual assault per October 2013, NCVS Criminal Victimization, 2012: 1 in 1,000
CDC estimate of "real" rapes: 1 in 4
I'm not saying there are unreported rapes, OF COURSE THERE ARE.
But not to the point of 1 out of 4 women are raped. There is NOTHING to back that statistic.
And to be clear, when you first posted YOU believed it was 1 out of 3.
I am very sorry it happened to you, truly I am. But it does not happen to the extent that you THINK it does.
I have often wondered how many men out of 10 would rape a woman if they had the opportunity, there was no chance of any repercussion whatsoever and no way anyone would ever know. My guess is 7 or 8 out of 10 would rape. I asked my husband and he said probably 2 out of 10. I honestly think that men give other men the benefit of the doubt. They think "Oh Joe/Bill/Tom/Bob would never do something like that." But women know otherwise and are often not believed so they are reluctant to report rape. I know many women who were raped and they never reported it. It's the same old story. They knew they would get the blame and the system was stacked against them.
My Dad was a very good man, but he was very naive about people. When my sisters and I were in high school a local prominent businessman's son was accused of rape. My father actually said "I don't believe that. He comes from a good family and I know his father from Rotary Club." My mom, my 3 sisters and I all laughed hysterically because we knew that the prominent businessman was a total creep and his son was worse. My Mom asked my Dad if he thought that his friend from Rotary treated her the same as he treated my Dad, and my Dad was dumbfounded. My Dad, and many other men, never understand that powerful/prominent men act totally different around their peers than they do around people they view as powerless and vulnerable.
I think that most men will never understand that many men treat men very differently from the way they treat women, especially when there are no other men around to witness it. That's part of the reason why rape victims are not believed. Remember that swimmer at Stanford who raped a drunk women. And the judge was concerned about ruining his life.
There was a study done of men in college, albeit a small one, that found, "Almost a third of the men (31.7 percent) said that in a consequence-free situation, they’d force a woman to have sexual intercourse." Ironically, when they changed the wording of the question to use the word rape, "13.6 percent said they would rape a woman." These were the same group of men. While both of those numbers are horrifying, what is really disturbing is that it insinuates that nearly 20% of them didn't think forcing a woman to have sexual intercourse was the same as rape.
All women experience harassment Most women are raped - which could be penetration or some sort of forced sex act
Even a significant minority of men are.
It's just the way things are.
Quote from you: "In regards to the #metoo campaign - it's not just about outright assault, although 1 in 3 women have been rapes. Think about it. 1 in 3. Look around the room and think about that when your family is gathered together for the holidays. But it's also about mistreatment and harassment. I don't know one, single, woman who has not been grabbed at a party or bar, or had vile things said or yelled to her by complete strangers while walking down the street. That's harassment"
You are mentioning "mistreatment" "harassment" and "rape" as though they are equal when discussing the metoo "campaign" and I use that word loosely.
You truly believe that every 3rd or 4th man you pass by on the street is a rapist? You honestly believe that? Where is the CDC getting these numbers? Are they made up? WHERE is the data to support the number that 1 in 4 women are raped?
Here are more recent number is reported rapes from October 2013 from the National Crime Victimization Survey:
in 2003: 1.4 rape/sexual assault per 1,000 (total no. 325,310)
in 2011: 0.9 rape/sexual assault per 1,000 (total no, 244,190)
in 2012: 1.3 rape sexual assault per 1,000 (total no. 346, 830)
How can the CDC exponentially inflate these numbers?? When the NCVS is reporting 1.3 incidents --that's both rape AND sexual assault -- per 1,000 PEOPLE, not even solely women.
and the CDC ups it to 1 in 4/5.
RECAP:
Statistic of rape/sexual assault per October 2013, NCVS Criminal Victimization, 2012: 1 in 1,000
CDC estimate of "real" rapes: 1 in 4
I'm not saying there are unreported rapes, OF COURSE THERE ARE.
But not to the point of 1 out of 4 women are raped. There is NOTHING to back that statistic.
And to be clear, when you first posted YOU believed it was 1 out of 3.
I am very sorry it happened to you, truly I am. But it does not happen to the extent that you THINK it does.
Your responses are the reason that the #metoo campaign exists. What I said, and you quoted, was that the #metoo campaign isn't meant just for women who were raped. It's meant for women who have been raped, assaulted, harassed and otherwise mistreated based solely on their gender. I didn't invent the campaign, I'm just telling you what it's intentions were.
The CDC says 1 in 4/5 women are raped. You can disagree with them all you want, but here are their sources:
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