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Old 01-11-2021, 07:26 AM
 
14,400 posts, read 14,298,103 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MillennialUrbanist View Post
Well, can you blame people? How long did "they" and "their" cronies expect us Americans to put up with this plandemic? 2 months? 2 years? Forever? Especially considering that SARS, MERS, and Ebola of the past were barely a blip on the radar. Nothing was closed. No masks. No social distancing. Those diseases were just something people were vaguely aware of.

People are willing to put up with temporary inconveniences (like social distancing) for the greater good. But "they" abused the privilege and betrayed America. So when people's patience ran out and real-life observations went against MSM's messages, people realized they were being had. So they took matters into their own hands, and resumed a normal life as much as possible.
Because of that America now accounts for one quarter of all the fatalities from coronavirus in the entire world. Today, we are listing 375,000 fatalities from the disease in a period of ten months and we are rapidlly closing in on 400,000. The people who run are hospitals are pleading with us to take safety measures because they are literally bursting at the seams in many places in this country.

Frankly, the individual response to coronavirus is some of the best evidence to me of what goes wrong when you let individuals have their way.

Coronavirus is different than the other diseases you listed above because it spreads faster and it has a higher fatality rate. Its really that simple.
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Old 01-11-2021, 07:58 AM
 
4,190 posts, read 2,506,426 times
Reputation: 6571
Perhaps look at the response to the polio epidemic. In 1940's polio outbreaks were becoming more common. Parts of Texas were shut down: San Angelo, San Antonio, Houston. In 1950, a deadly form of it hit VA. In Wytheville, VA a town of 5,500 people, almost 200 got it. Its still remembered as the Summer Without Children. Statewide over 1,000 kids got it; one of my playmates, who had a twin which was rare in those days, died of it. The Governor enacted a quarantine of the entire city; the complaint was he waited too long as beds filled from Roanoke all the way to Richmond. Folks did what they had to do for the public good knowing there was light at the end of the tunnel. I still remember getting my polio sugar cubes.

https://blueridgecountry.com/newssta...hout-children/

We could go the way of Norfolk VA of course. There is still a street called Quarentine Road. In 1855, the steamer the Benjamin Franklin arrived with yellow fever. When the quarantine on the ship was broken (quarantines became very common after the 1832 cholera pandemic), those violators were forcibly put in buildings on what is now Quarantine Road. But it was too late. From an initial outbreak of 183, it grew to over 3,000 deaths almost 10% of the city.

In short, we have put up with restrictions for periods of time in the past knowing the consequences.
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Old 01-11-2021, 08:26 AM
 
Location: NH
4,209 posts, read 3,758,240 times
Reputation: 6750
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Because of that America now accounts for one quarter of all the fatalities from coronavirus in the entire world. Today, we are listing 375,000 fatalities from the disease in a period of ten months and we are rapidlly closing in on 400,000. The people who run are hospitals are pleading with us to take safety measures because they are literally bursting at the seams in many places in this country.

Frankly, the individual response to coronavirus is some of the best evidence to me of what goes wrong when you let individuals have their way.

Coronavirus is different than the other diseases you listed above because it spreads faster and it has a higher fatality rate. Its really that simple.
400,000 is a big number by itself, but compared to the total population of 331 million, its really quite miniscule. Other than from the media, I havent heard of any hospitals busting at the seems. Not saying that there arent a few out there that are, but at the end of the day, just because you test positive does it mean you will need to visit a hospital or even receive any medical attention at all.

We are a society of hypocrites. Individual response triggered this past years protests which many people supported, however many of those same people feel that individual response is suddenly selfish when it comes to Covid for instance.

We are not only hypocrites, but the mandates in place often conflict with each other as well. Mandates suddenly make the fearful seem like they are indestructible and then complain when the number of cases rise and blame it on everyone except for themselves who could have removed themselves from the equation by staying home. Also, please help me to understand how number of flu cases this year have supposedly dropped significantly because of the mandates in place for Covid, however the cases of Covid are on the rise because people arent adhering to the mandates? None of this makes sense and to point fingers at those that have a different view point than you, well thats just selfish.
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Old 01-11-2021, 09:38 AM
 
2,289 posts, read 1,567,557 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mustangman66 View Post
400,000 is a big number by itself, but compared to the total population of 331 million, its really quite miniscule. Other than from the media, I havent heard of any hospitals busting at the seems. Not saying that there arent a few out there that are, but at the end of the day, just because you test positive does it mean you will need to visit a hospital or even receive any medical attention at all.

We are a society of hypocrites. Individual response triggered this past years protests which many people supported, however many of those same people feel that individual response is suddenly selfish when it comes to Covid for instance.

We are not only hypocrites, but the mandates in place often conflict with each other as well. Mandates suddenly make the fearful seem like they are indestructible and then complain when the number of cases rise and blame it on everyone except for themselves who could have removed themselves from the equation by staying home. Also, please help me to understand how number of flu cases this year have supposedly dropped significantly because of the mandates in place for Covid, however the cases of Covid are on the rise because people arent adhering to the mandates? None of this makes sense and to point fingers at those that have a different view point than you, well thats just selfish.
From where, (other than the media), would you normally expect to hear of matters such as hospital overcrowding or any other matter of public interest?
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Old 01-11-2021, 10:04 AM
 
Location: NH
4,209 posts, read 3,758,240 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Very Man Himself View Post
From where, (other than the media), would you normally expect to hear of matters such as hospital overcrowding or any other matter of public interest?
I have heard the media on many occasions stating how hospitals are overflowing. If that were true, the Navy ship in NY would have been required, it instead sat empty. Friends who are medical professionals in my local area said there is no overload around here even though the local news was telling everyone there was. On one occasion they showed a local hospital prepping for the large influx, except they failed to realize New England doesnt have palm trees and the pictures they were using had palm trees in the background. I dont know where you would find this information other than from the media, but in my opinion, its not really a question I would even think to ask. I just know the media isnt always accurate with the info they provide and use stories such as this to invoke fear.

If all of the facts were presented, not partial facts or a compilation of outlying cases, I feel the public may have a much different outlook. We may have a much more positive attitude, more comradery, etc.
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Old 01-11-2021, 10:22 AM
 
11,337 posts, read 11,037,875 times
Reputation: 14993
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Because of that America now accounts for one quarter of all the fatalities from coronavirus in the entire world. Today, we are listing 375,000 fatalities from the disease in a period of ten months and we are rapidlly closing in on 400,000. The people who run are hospitals are pleading with us to take safety measures because they are literally bursting at the seams in many places in this country.

Frankly, the individual response to coronavirus is some of the best evidence to me of what goes wrong when you let individuals have their way.

Coronavirus is different than the other diseases you listed above because it spreads faster and it has a higher fatality rate. Its really that simple.
Except hospitals are not overflowing in almost all areas. You are hearing about a few areas because it sensationalizes the news and attracts eyeballs. Like yours.

And if a solition of collectivism is your answer, then we are better off dead. The individual is, and must remain, the basic unit of society, and the focus of rights and protections. The tyranny of the majority is the greatest evil.

Interesting that our most socialist state: California, is the state with the poorest response, the greatest hospital crisis, and the most inane dedication to collectivism. They are actually running out of oxygen for patients. That’s how efficient collectivism is.
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Old 01-11-2021, 10:23 AM
 
Location: Crook County, Hellinois
5,820 posts, read 3,873,703 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webster View Post
Folks did what they had to do for the public good knowing there was light at the end of the tunnel.
The problem with this plandemic is that it's a whole new beast, where there is no light at the end of the tunnel. Any light is just headlights of an oncoming train. "They" keep extending the lockdowns ad infinitum, and using inflated numbers to boot.

So, people created their own light inside the tunnel, by defying the lockdowns, effectively telling the governors to stick it where the sun don't shine.
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Old 01-11-2021, 10:27 AM
 
11,337 posts, read 11,037,875 times
Reputation: 14993
Quote:
Originally Posted by MillennialUrbanist View Post
The problem with this plandemic is that it's a whole new beast, where there is no light at the end of the tunnel. Any light is just headlights of an oncoming train. "They" keep extending the lockdowns ad infinitum, and using inflated numbers to boot.
The vaccine is the light at the end of the tunnel. By June or July that light will be shining on most of us.
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Old 01-11-2021, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Taos NM
5,353 posts, read 5,129,553 times
Reputation: 6771
1: A diverse group is not going to be as collective as a tribe of 100 related individuals. America is more diverse than many countries like Japan that are more collective in nature.

2: I think the individualism is political moreso than cultural; the political individualism is still rightly justified in response to what collectivism politics demonstrated last century. Culturally, Americans go to church, place a big emphasis on family ect... Looking past the lens of politics, I don't think Americans are that different in personal behaviour from Chinese outside of Beijing or Russians outside or Moscow.
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Old 01-11-2021, 10:52 AM
 
4,944 posts, read 3,051,034 times
Reputation: 6740
Quote:
Originally Posted by MillennialUrbanist View Post
The problem with this plandemic is that it's a whole new beast, where there is no light at the end of the tunnel. Any light is just headlights of an oncoming train. "They" keep extending the lockdowns ad infinitum, and using inflated numbers to boot.

So, people created their own light inside the tunnel, by defying the lockdowns, effectively telling the governors to stick it where the sun don't shine.

The problem in ours, and many other states; are unilateral decisions being made by governors using provisions never designed for plandemics(lol).
These decisions need to be made by respective state legislatures, so as to represent the majority will of the people.
And considering how many aren't even willing to take the jabs, keeping things closed/restricted now seems pointless.
With respect to rugged individualism, employees in other countries have also objected to vaccinations; stating discrimination.
They'll be many lawsuits over this one, and little to no precedent for courts to make decisions.
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