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Old 01-07-2019, 09:16 AM
 
1 posts, read 822 times
Reputation: 38

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I have got empathy for animals since I was a child. When I was growing up, my faith and values changed several times, but my love and empathy for animals never changed. Now I already know that animal protection is the most noble cause.

Below is a brief summary of my animal protection principles.


We must protect animals.

Like human beings, animals have consciousness and feeling, and can experience suffering and happiness.

No one wants suffering, and neither do animals. This is a sufficient reason to protect animals.

We do not advocate "protecting plants".

Plants do not have brain or nerve, so they never have any consciousness or feeling at all.

Therefore, in terms of morality, it is not necessary to protect plants.

We do not advocate "protecting mosquitoes".

Vertebrate animals, especially mammals and birds, have developed advanced nervous systems, therefore having strong feeling and consciousness.

However, most invertebrates, such as insects, only have a very simple nervous system, which means that their feeling and consciousness are very weak.

We must not kill animals, even though animals keep killing each other.

If a child who is three or four years old killed a man, you cannot condemn the child, because it knows nothing. Similarly, animals should not be condemned for killing others, because animals have low intelligence and cannot understand that their behaviors bring suffering to other individuals. In fact, many animals have the same intelligence level as a child.

However, adult humans' intelligence is high enough for them to know that their behaviors may bring suffering to other individuals. Therefore, for adult humans, doing such behaviors is obviously evil.

We must not follow the law of nature.

The natural law that allows the stronger ones to prey upon the weaker ones runs counter to human morality. If not, there would be no need to protect the disadvantaged groups.

The laws of nature are brutal, but human morality is empathetic. Human beings must fight against the brutality and stop the killing.

We should be more concerned about animals than people.

The suffering and misery faced by animals are far more severe than people's hardship. At least the people are not being murdered or tortured.

Moreover, humans can be good or evil, but animals are all innocent and lovable, just like children.

Rich people and elites have strong power, but always squander the power on luxurious lives and meaningless faiths. I will be the owner of power, and use the power to make the greatest contribution to animal protection.
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Old 01-07-2019, 12:33 PM
 
Location: Virginia
10,113 posts, read 6,461,064 times
Reputation: 27687
"At least the people are not being murdered or tortured?" I presume you don't read or watch the news much? Look, I'm a great proponent of animal rights and always have been. However, it's inane to say that people don't have rights and need protection as well. What about abused and murdered children? How about women (and men) who are the victims of domestic violence? Look at the innocent casualties of war across the world. Should they just be ignored and left to fend for themselves? Sorry, but I think not.
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Old 01-07-2019, 12:40 PM
 
12,111 posts, read 23,318,667 times
Reputation: 27253
Personally, I like a good bacon cheeseburger.
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Old 01-07-2019, 03:54 PM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
7,291 posts, read 5,173,859 times
Reputation: 17804
Maybe this thread oughta be re-directed to the Religion Forum?


There's just too much wrong with it to deserve any attention here.
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Old 01-08-2019, 04:56 AM
 
Location: Minnysoda
10,659 posts, read 10,740,285 times
Reputation: 6745
I absolutely love animals as well!!!


On my plate besides the potatoes..................



See? If you're going to troll you're going to get ogreish answers...........
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Old 01-08-2019, 07:31 AM
 
Location: DC
6,848 posts, read 8,005,837 times
Reputation: 3572
This belongs in a PETA section, not Green Living
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Old 01-08-2019, 09:55 AM
 
Location: NW Nevada
18,161 posts, read 15,652,523 times
Reputation: 17152
Quote:
Originally Posted by KAICHEN1988 View Post
I have got empathy for animals since I was a child. When I was growing up, my faith and values changed several times, but my love and empathy for animals never changed. Now I already know that animal protection is the most noble cause.

Below is a brief summary of my animal protection principles.

We must protect animals.

Like human beings, animals have consciousness and feeling, and can experience suffering and happiness.

No one wants suffering, and neither do animals. This is a sufficient reason to protect animals.

We do not advocate "protecting plants".

Plants do not have brain or nerve, so they never have any consciousness or feeling at all.

Therefore, in terms of morality, it is not necessary to protect plants.

We do not advocate "protecting mosquitoes".

Vertebrate animals, especially mammals and birds, have developed advanced nervous systems, therefore having strong feeling and consciousness.

However, most invertebrates, such as insects, only have a very simple nervous system, which means that their feeling and consciousness are very weak.

We must not kill animals, even though animals keep killing each other.

If a child who is three or four years old killed a man, you cannot condemn the child, because it knows nothing. Similarly, animals should not be condemned for killing others, because animals have low intelligence and cannot understand that their behaviors bring suffering to other individuals. In fact, many animals have the same intelligence level as a child.

However, adult humans' intelligence is high enough for them to know that their behaviors may bring suffering to other individuals. Therefore, for adult humans, doing such behaviors is obviously evil.

We must not follow the law of nature.

The natural law that allows the stronger ones to prey upon the weaker ones runs counter to human morality. If not, there would be no need to protect the disadvantaged groups.

The laws of nature are brutal, but human morality is empathetic. Human beings must fight against the brutality and stop the killing.

We should be more concerned about animals than people.

The suffering and misery faced by animals are far more severe than people's hardship. At least the people are not being murdered or tortured.

Moreover, humans can be good or evil, but animals are all innocent and lovable, just like children.

Rich people and elites have strong power, but always squander the power on luxurious lives and meaningless faiths. I will be the owner of power, and use the power to make the greatest contribution to animal protection.

I agree and understand some of your points in having empathy for animals. I grew up on a pretty remote ranch butting right up against the wilds and since there were no kids my age anywhere nearby my best friends were our animals. Those included horses, dogs and barn cats. Many of the cats would only come to me. However there was and still is a harsh reality with the wild critters. Predators in particular. Coyotes, mountain lions were a constant problem with feral dogs also being tossed into the mix.


Not ALL animals are cute and loveable. Not by a long shot. If you had ever seen what a mountain lion or coyotes have done to a newborn calf or foal or to more than one in one attack you might get a bit of a wake up call. The coyotes were also hard on my barn cat buddies so an animosity developed. We accepted a certain amount of predator loss with the range stock as it's going to happen but when it becomes a habit and the preds start "thrill killing" a stop has to be put to it.


One marauding cat got into a neighboring ranches sheep pen one night filled with ewes and lambs and killed them all and only ate the milk bags from the ewes. Now abuse of domestic animals and deliberate killing of wildlife just for the hell of it I have heartburn with. But there are situations where action must be taken with wild predators. Also with overpopulated destructive rodents. Populations of many wild animals need to be controlled and hunting is a part of that. Deer are a good example.


Many of your views are just not practical and realistic. I to have a streak of empathy in me for animals. Having to participate in the hunt to take that sheep killing cat out saddened me in the end. However at the same time I knew it had to be done. We did our best to coexist with the wildlife but when lines got crossed we had to act. That's just the way it is. Our domestic animals were extremely well cared for. All of them even the animals raised for food. The latter however were not pets and thus we didn't form attachments.


Animals should never be abused or tortured I agree. But never killing them just isn't going to happen. With wild animals wonton stock killing and attacks on people dictate an immediate and lethal response. I have to be unapologetic in telling you that. Animals do not matter more than people. If one of my loved ones was attacked by a wild animal such as a mountain lion I would be the first one mounting up with my rifle. There are exceptions in such attacks on people where the people involved are attacked via their own blatant stupidity. However ambush predator attacks on people are a different story.


Your views and their intentions are understandable to a point but used as strict doctrine are just not workable in the real world.
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Old 01-08-2019, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Squirrel Hill PA
2,195 posts, read 2,594,008 times
Reputation: 4553
There are many noble causes in the world. None is more important than the others.

Your post shows tremendous lack of understanding as far as the intelligence of animals and plants goes. There is a great deal of research to show that animals are much smarter than we think and are capable of more complicated thought processes than they are credited for. Plants have been seen to form relationships, partnerships and communities and even communicate and care for their young.

There is a great deal about plant's animals, bugs and the rest of nature that we still really don't know.

Your emotions about them don't change the fact that humans are really not all that different from the animals. We are as much a part of nature as the birds and the bugs.

Death is a natural part of the cycle of living. Life is ugly, painful, messy, beautiful, joyful, special and ordinary.

In the end nothing you do can change any of that.

And that's okay.
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Old 01-08-2019, 01:21 PM
 
Location: Canada
14,735 posts, read 15,083,028 times
Reputation: 34872
Hey guys, I doubt she will be back but perhaps we should ease up on the OP and try a gentler approach. I don't believe the OP is an adult or a troll, I think she sounds like an immature young teen.

I'm thinking she is what I call a "Bambi kid", a sheltered city bred youngster with misguided and unrealistic ideals (maybe watching too many Disney animated movies) and with little to no real life education nor personal experience with animals and other aspects of nature.

.
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Old 01-08-2019, 05:23 PM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
7,291 posts, read 5,173,859 times
Reputation: 17804
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
Hey guys, I doubt she will be back but perhaps we should ease up on the OP and try a gentler approach. I don't believe the OP is an adult or a troll, I think she sounds like an immature young teen.

I'm thinking she is what I call a "Bambi kid", a sheltered city bred youngster with misguided and unrealistic ideals (maybe watching too many Disney animated movies) and with little to no real life education nor personal experience with animals and other aspects of nature.

.
I call 'em graduates of The Bambi Institute of Environmental Sciences.


OK, let's assume the OP is a naïve young one (maybe even a recent college grad.) Let's analyze the points one by one for educational purposes:


We must protect animals.-- Must? Unsubstantiated reasoning.


We do not advocate protecting plants-- if you don't protect the plants, there won't be any animals to protect.


We do not advocate protecting mosquitoes-- their larvae are extremely important food sources in the aquatic ecosystem. The OP has little understanding of the food web.


We must not kill animals.... It must be understood that H.sapiens evolved as we have due to our carnivorous habits. Our ability to utilize plants as food improved our chances for survival, but our survival is by no means dependent on plants as food. We could go into a long dissertation here on how human physiology & psychology are oriented toward carnivorous life style....Then there's the problem of population management in a world where we have significantly altered available habitat. Eg--We killed off the wolves, so now there's too many deer. Too many deer means they all can starve. Now that's what I call cruel.


We must not follow the rules of nature-- ??? Do I really need to explain why that's so stupid? There is no right nor wrong in Nature-- only survival.


We should be more concerned about animals than people-- the reasons given after that statement are just plain false and were obviously part of an indoctrination program and not based on real world observation by the writer.


Some of us side with the predator when we watch those PBS documentaries. If the predator misses out on too many kills, then he starves. Isn't the predator as important as the prey in the ecosystem? There has to be a balance in Nature.
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