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This is also true...most Americans consume way more protein than needed and it does lead to adverse health effects. One of those effects is kidney problems/kidney stones. Our bodies simply are not designed to filter that much protein.
I've heard a lot of arguments from both sides on the excess protein and whether or not its an issue. I guess my take is that for some people it is, for some people its at least not a very big deal. But I think the chances for extra stress on the kindneys is definitely there.
Not to mention saturated fats and cholesterol. My father died of a heart attack when he was 56. His dad died of a heart attack. Genetics are not in my favor when it comes to heart health, so I prefer to err on the side of caution. I want to live long enough to be a grumpy old man!
Anything you can get from the cow you can get directly and more efficiently from what they eat yourself, with the exception of vitamin B12 which is only found in animal products.
Evidently not. And I, for one, have tried a very well regimented vegetarian diet and it leaves me sick as a dog. (My best friend, before she died, did quite well on a very well regimented vegetarian diet - her genetic makeup was different than mine.)
Just because you want to be a vegetarian and do well on it (presumably - don't know you well enough to know, so I'll take your word for it) does not mean that it is the ideal diet for other omnivores of your species. For that matter, I have, over decades of experimentation, discovered that I do much better if I have red meat or shrimp two or three times a week - chicken won't do it, fish won't do it, pork won't do it. It's my understanding that red meat contains two enzymes that aren't contained in other kinds of meat, and I suspect that has something to do with it, though I have no scientific tests on myself (other than diet manipulation) as evidence.
By the way, we raise our own meat. We live in an area prone to drought. We don't irrigate, though we do provide supplemental water for our animals - as was said, about 10-15 gallons per day, depending on the kind of animal and its size.
[/i]Evidently not. And I, for one, have tried a very well regimented vegetarian diet and it leaves me sick as a dog. (My best friend, before she died, did quite well on a very well regimented vegetarian diet - her genetic makeup was different than mine.)
Just because you want to be a vegetarian and do well on it (presumably - don't know you well enough to know, so I'll take your word for it) does not mean that it is the ideal diet for other omnivores of your species. For that matter, I have, over decades of experimentation, discovered that I do much better if I have red meat or shrimp two or three times a week - chicken won't do it, fish won't do it, pork won't do it. It's my understanding that red meat contains two enzymes that aren't contained in other kinds of meat, and I suspect that has something to do with it, though I have no scientific tests on myself (other than diet manipulation) as evidence.
What is it that meat "does" for you? Is it your energy level? Hunger level?
My diet has varied somewhat over the last 20 years (vegan, macrobiotic...), but one area where it has never wavered is in meat eating. I have eaten no meat for 20+ years....none. Not chicken, not turkey, not beef - no mammal flesh.
I stopped eating meat for a variety of reasons, but one of the main reasons I continue not to eat it is because of the wastefulness of it. From the horrors of factory farming to the sheer environmental damage, meat-eating makes no sense to me.
From time-to-time I'll take some vitamins, but I usually don't bother. I'm far healthier than my peers (others my age) and rarely get a cold or anything. I have no digestion or elimination problems, I don't get "upset stomachs" except on the rarest of occasions. I think it's far easier to not eat meat than it is to eat it.
Blood sugar level, among other things. I'm hypoglycaemic (diagnosed, by a doctor, with the icky test, before much of anyone had ever heard of it). My best friend, as I stated, as vegetarian, and she was also hypoglycaemic - but the diet that worked for her didn't work for me, and vice versa.
Just because you've found what works for you, in other words, doesn't mean that you're qualified to determine what works for everyone else on the planet. Every body is different. I'd never insist that, because a high protein meat diet works best for me, I'm healthiest, have the most energy, can think the most clearly, on that kind of diet, that YOU should take it up if eating a vegetarian diet is what you, through experimentation, have determined works best for your particular physical make-up.
If I felt so strongly that everyone should eat what I do and would get along just fine eating that and only that, I'd be prosyletizing a religion based on a belief system, not advocating a rational diet. I try really hard not to do that.
Sorry as i'm going to be unpopular on this thread to some of you good folks and also i do support Green Initiatives especially with Mercury covering the whole Earth do to Coal Production (Can't even eat Tuna anymore) but ..............i'm not giving up Red Meat or any Meat (except Tuna) as i've tried Vegan or Oatmeal only diets before and they sevierly mess with my blood sugars and mood swings and can't keep my semi muscular frame from Pumping Iron.
Secondly humans have been eating Meat as we Paleolithic Man or Hunter Gatherers have been on this Earth for millions of years hunting game and eating wild plants and berries where as Agiculture has been here for about 10,000 years so our Genome is still wired for the ''Ancient Diet '' for a large part still.
Thirdly that fumes the hell out of me about the ''Dead Zone'' in the Gulf of Mexico that is now the size of Texas as it's caused by all the Plant and Grains Fertilizers/Herbicides etc..to grow all the Agiculture crops being grown in those states along the Mississippi River that are causing the Enviro Hazzard runoff into the Mississippi River and downstream into the Ocean. There's not even any Plankton down there. Where's the Enviromental groups on that ???
I think if I actually owned a cow, I might have to stop eating meat. The love of animals would be the only reason I would ever cause me to become a vegetarian. And, while it's contradictory of me to keep eating beef if I truly love animals, I do it anyway, because I like beef. It would certainly never be because some think it's good for the environment.
But I don't own a cow, so I'm going to the market today and buy some Organic Milk and more Greenwise Ribeyes.
Anything you can get from the cow you can get directly and more efficiently from what they eat yourself, with the exception of vitamin B12 which is only found in animal products.
Evidently not. And I, for one, have tried a very well regimented vegetarian diet and it leaves me sick as a dog. (My best friend, before she died, did quite well on a very well regimented vegetarian diet - her genetic makeup was different than mine.)
Just because you want to be a vegetarian and do well on it (presumably - don't know you well enough to know, so I'll take your word for it) does not mean that it is the ideal diet for other omnivores of your species. For that matter, I have, over decades of experimentation, discovered that I do much better if I have red meat or shrimp two or three times a week - chicken won't do it, fish won't do it, pork won't do it. It's my understanding that red meat contains two enzymes that aren't contained in other kinds of meat, and I suspect that has something to do with it, though I have no scientific tests on myself (other than diet manipulation) as evidence.
By the way, we raise our own meat. We live in an area prone to drought. We don't irrigate, though we do provide supplemental water for our animals - as was said, about 10-15 gallons per day, depending on the kind of animal and its size.
I'm just curious, how did a vegetarian diet make you feel?
I've read a book on eating for your blood type. I don't know how true it is, but I'm A positive, which the book said has the worst digestion and should eat the most restrictive diet. It said red meat was bad for A pos. people, and I had figured out years before that beef often made me sick (didn't digest it well), so I already had given it up. Much of what the book suggested, I already did. I think the book said people with type O were the "goats" that could eat anything, digested everything well, and lived longer. A pos. people are supposed to either be vegetarian or eat only fish and poultry. I'm wondering if other blood types may need meat to feel good? Or maybe the whole blood type/diet theory is just silly?
I've been on a vegetarian diet for several years and feel fine, btw.
but entirely rejecting meat isn't an answer either.
Allow me to introduce an opposite viewpoint. It has worked extremeley well for me for more than 35 years! I am one of the healthiest 59 yr olds on the planet. Though I'm not going to tell anyone what or how they should eat, I strongly encourage everyone to give up meat completely and eat a vegetarian diet. Your health will improve tremendously over time, animals will no longer need to be slaughtered, and the planet as a whole will be a happier place.
In her 1971 ground breaking book, Diet For A Small Planet, Francis Moore Lappe brought to light the fact that;
... to produce 1 lb. of protein in the form on beef or veal, we must feed 21 lbs. of protein to the animal. Other forms of livestock are slightly less inefficient, but the average ratio in the U.S. is still 1:8. It has been estimated that the amount of protein lost to humans in this way is equivalent to 90% of the annual world protein deficit.
...We got hooked on grain-fed meat just as we got hooked on gas guzzling automobiles. Big cars `made sense' only when oil was cheap; grain-fed meat `makes sense' only because the true costs of producing it are not counted....Diet For A Small Planet
groove1 wrote:
The only necessary nutrient that is ONLY found in animal products is vitamin b12.
That is an old myth, perpetuated by meat lovers. Actually, Spirulina is a great plant source of B12. Here's a quote form this article regarding the health benefits of Spirulina.
A major argument frequently used to support the consumption of animal foods in the diet and negate the tremendous value of Spirulina incorrectly states that plants do not contain vitamin B12. A single serving of Spirulina contains 45% of your daily value of vitamin B12. That's good news and reassuring for vegetarians, many of who are incorrectly led to believe that eating animal food is critical to getting this essential blood building vitamin.
Last edited by CosmicWizard; 04-24-2008 at 10:30 AM..
but entirely rejecting meat isn't an answer either.
Allow me to introduce an opposite viewpoint. It has worked extremeley well for me for more than 35 years! I am one of the healthiest 59 yr olds on the planet. Though I'm not going to tell anyone what or how they should eat, I strongly encourage everyone to give up meat completely and eat a vegetarian diet. Your health will improve tremendously over time, animals will no longer need to be slaughtered, and the planet as a whole will be a happier place.
In her 1971 ground breaking book, Diet For A Small Planet, Francis Moore Lappe brought to light the fact that;
... to produce 1 lb. of protein in the form on beef or veal, we must feed 21 lbs. of protein to the animal. Other forms of livestock are slightly less inefficient, but the average ratio in the U.S. is still 1:8. It has been estimated that the amount of protein lost to humans in this way is equivalent to 90% of the annual world protein deficit.
...We got hooked on grain-fed meat just as we got hooked on gas guzzling automobiles. Big cars `made sense' only when oil was cheap; grain-fed meat `makes sense' only because the true costs of producing it are not counted....Diet For A Small Planet
groove1 wrote:
The only necessary nutrient that is ONLY found in animal products is vitamin b12.
That is an old myth, perpetuated by meat lovers. Actually, Spirulina is a great plant source of B12. Here's a quote form this article regarding the health benefits of Spirulina.
A major argument frequently used to support the consumption of animal foods in the diet and negate the tremendous value of Spirulina incorrectly states that plants do not contain vitamin B12. A single serving of Spirulina contains 45% of your daily value of vitamin B12. That's good news and reassuring for vegetarians, many of who are incorrectly led to believe that eating animal food is critical to getting this essential blood building vitamin.
I get weak when I don't eat any meats for too long. A high-fat diet is actually good for a person who works a lot and in a cold environment. Study the Iinuit a bit. Vegetarianism doesn't work for me, as it doesn't for many. Furthermore, my interest in self-sufficiency and living in a remote part of Alaska will make relying on stuff like that a bad idea. I'd rather adapt to and be a part of the natural world around me than to be separate. Humans are naturally omnivores and meant to hunt. Killing of animals is not a terrible thing, they do it to themselves anyways. As I said before, it's all in the amounts and making it sustainable. If you like your diet go ahead and keep with it, but don't try force it on others.
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Is it your energy level? Hunger level?
