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i'm surprised that people move here if the roads are in such bad shape in their view, and they think there is too much congestion, and sidewalks are a big quality of life thing for them. Do they not notice these things during their visits prior to moving? If a person was living in a place with perfect roads and streetscaping and numerous sidewalks, then the lack of these things as they see it would stand out on a trip to Greenville.
If I was big into sidewalks, i wouldn't be moving to a country suburb like Five Forks.
I'm surprised that a person who said the roads in Raleigh are terrible would relocate from Arizona to live in or near Anderson. I've always heard Raleigh is the most progressive city in the Carolinas. I can't imagine a person who criticized roads in Raleigh liking Anderson at all.
You make it sound like people only move cities to be in ones with better roads. There are other things such as a better job, better weather, more greenery etc. that can be factors as well. Nowhere did I mention that people shouldn't move to Greenville because it has poor roads. But it IS a disadvantage, especially one that will be become more and more prominent as it grows and attracts more people.
I gave the TJ/Target only as an example. Woodruff Industrial is not not busy. It is often backed up, and there are many cars always turning using the center lane. I have never seen anyone walk from one side to the other. Never in the few months I have been here, and frequented both those stores often. But to give you another example on the other side of the argument, there is a sidewalk all the way along the street one enters the Shops at Greenridge for. Why? Don't all the shops share the same parking lot? The answer is because it's newer. Which makes it pretty clear that many years back those planning had no vision.
You mentioned that many years back those planning wouldn't have an idea that Woodruff would become this central location for shopping requiring careful planning for roads - but someone did give the permits to construct and open all those stores, without considering that the roads may need an uplift as well.
Your point about sidewalks not being safe on busy streets is probably valid if the drivers are bad. There are many cities with many sidewalks, more pedestrians, and more busy streets than Greenville, with probably lower pedestrian fatality rates (http://ghsa.org/sites/default/files/...ht_ped2015.pdf). Arizona has some of the best sidewalks I have seen (I can't think of a single major street without sidewalks), yet it's pedestrian fatality rate is not too low (probably because the drivers are not that great - which I know they aren't). But the rate is lower than SC (which is #6). I know that Twin Cities have many sidewalks, even on busy roads. Pedestrian fatality rate for Minnesota - the lowest in the country. Because the drivers are good. Another state I can think of is Illinois.
I am curious as to why you would pick on everything else I posted, except for the postscript I added on Exit 40 on I-85. Would you acknowledge that that represents a case of lack of responsibility on the part of SCDOT?
I could easily walk from Target to Trader Joe's. How would a sidewalk change the fact that you have to cross Woodruff Industrial Lane? If there was a sidewalk, wouldn't it have to be within the two parking lots? I don't understand what your point is. Do you want a pedestrian bridge over that road? I don't think there is a large number of people who have any desire to walk between Target and Trader JOe's, anyway. There are car-based suburban shopping centers.
I don't know anything about your exit 40 comment. I never said everything perfect but if you premise is everything is perfect in these other areas that you keep talking about, is that really true?
if you are saying the drivers are bad in SC, why would you want to encourage more people to walk along the roads by adding more sidewalks.
I disagree with you strongly that the roads here are disadvantage for most people that live here.
I think criticizing a person in a contentious way but not directing the comment at them specifically is passive aggressive. and hilarious.
Disagreeing with somebody on something is not by definiition defensive. Your premise is that if anybody disagrees with you and people who holdl your negative view on anything, they are defensive. I'm expressing my sincere opinions and perception.
I would love for people on here to give me specific locations of potholes in the roads. If you provide me with exact locations of potholes, I think that I can get them fixed fairly quickly. I agree there are some roads that could used a paving, which is the case in every metro, but i'm not seeing all these potholes.
I been driving all over the metro for past 20 years and I'm not hitting potholes. I think many of the posts on here are misleading. You would think reading these posts that people are hitting like 10 potholes on the way to the mall or something.
For example, one person was talking about how he can't walk from Target to Trader Joes when in fact it is quite easy to do because they basically share the same parking lot, and a sidewalk is not even necessary. Was pointing this out 'defensive? I don't think so. I don't think being accurate is defensive. I think that was reaching for a disadvantage of Greenville regardless because how often is a Target and Trader Joes within a reasonable walking distance of each other. Trader Joes probably does not generally locate in big box store areas like Woodruff.
And wasn't someone else passive aggressive with me?
See attached - Santa Ana, CA. Trader Joe's and Target separated by a street with sidewalks.
I could easily walk from Target to Trader Joe's. How would a sidewalk change the fact that you have to cross Woodruff Industrial Lane? If there was a sidewalk, wouldn't it have to be within the two parking lots? I don't understand what your point is. Do you want a pedestrian bridge over that road? I don't think there is a large number of people who have any desire to walk between Target and Trader JOe's, anyway. There are car-based suburban shopping centers.
I don't know anything about your exit 40 comment. I never said everything perfect but if you premise is everything is perfect in these other areas that you keep talking about, is that really true?
if you are saying the drivers are bad in SC, why would you want to encourage more people to walk along the roads by adding more sidewalks.
My point is when the area was being planned and permits were being given, it'd have made more sense to modify the roads so as to add sidewalks in such places (doesn't have to be this exact place - but there are many similar places).
Last edited by Soapsud; 12-21-2016 at 05:15 PM..
Reason: Bolded for emphasis - this was just an example, probably a silly one - but there are many such others!
My point is when the area was being planned and permits were being given, it'd have made more sense to modify the roads so as to add sidewalks in such places (doesn't have to be this exact place - but there are many similar places).
ok but there is no demand for sidewalks along Woodruff road. it doesn't make sense to ask people to pay for something that isn't going to be used much.
Your point specifically used Trader Joes and Target as your example, but to walk between the two doesn't require walking along Woodruff Road. Why use an example that does not help make the point about sidewalks?
And wasn't someone else passive aggressive with me?
See attached - Santa Ana, CA. Trader Joe's and Target separated by a street with sidewalks.
How is pointing out Trader Joe's and Target basically share the same parking lot and it is easy to walk from one to the other 'passive aggressive'?
I don't think being accurate is passive aggressive. I'm stating my views, I'm not attacking you for your views. there is nothing wrong with wanting more sidewalks if that is what you want. in my view, Greenville has sidewalks in areas where there is some demand for them. i don't think that the new sidewalks and bike lanes on Roper Mountain Road will ever be used. not worth the cost in my view.
i agree sidewalks look better if they are offset from the curb and not an extension of it. If you look at the newer part of Fairview Road near Harrison Bridge, the sidwalks are offset and it looks nice.
anyway, I will not post again on this topic. if you see potholes in the metro, just post the specific location on here, and I will get it fixed fairly soon. I know an engineer at the DOT. I will mention the Exit 40 sign as well. I assume that it takes some time for them to create a new sign with the same info. i will also mention the litter on the interstate. i never noticed much litter on 85 outside of tire tread but when I drive on it there is a steady volume of traffic or it is dark.
Last edited by ClemVegas; 12-21-2016 at 06:56 PM..
How is pointing out Trader Joe's and Target basically share the same parking lot and it is easy to walk from one to the other 'passive aggressive'?
That wasn't.
The following was.
I'm surprised that a person who said the roads in Raleigh are terrible would relocate from Arizona to live in or near Anderson. I've always heard Raleigh is the most progressive city in the Carolinas. I can't imagine a person who criticized roads in Raleigh liking Anderson at all.
Your last post had it been earlier would have avoided a lot of bickering. I respect your opinion. But I'd not shy from putting my forward either: which is that the roads here, but the kind of size the city and area is becoming are terrible in every way possible. The new roads are probably better, but that is just coming up to the standard of other cities/counties of a similar stature. Doesn't change that there was no vision in the past or as the area was growing bigger.
I don't think expressing surprise a person who thought roads in Raleigh were bad would move cross country to live near the relatively poor rural former mill town Anderson is bickering or being passive aggressive. I'm genuinely surprised given the reputation Raleigh has for having great roads and being a progressive metro. You've put a lot of emphasis on roads and sidewalks as being important to you. I know people who grew up in and prefer posh gentrified areas and I know they would be miserable in Anderson.
I would think a person who could get a job at CU despite living on the other side of the country could land a job at other universities located in more urban areas with the infrastructure that you like. taking a job at a college in a rural area seems to be contradictory to these priorities. You come across as a person who prefers urban areas but the Upstate obviously is not that urban.
There have been some people on this forum who don't live in Greenville who show up to make negative comments about it and they typically focus on beating up on the roads. They typically have not made many posts on the forum. I thought you were one of those people. Perhaps you are not.
Your comment about how you can't walk between Target and Trader Joe's is bizarre because they basically share a parking lot. It is in fact quite easy to walk between the two of them (similar to walking from the Barnes and Noble to the Best Buy within Greenridge) and a sidewalk between the two of them is not needed. You presented this example as though a person would walk between the two of them along Woodruff Road but that isn't the case. That is why I thought you were pretending to live in Greenville.
anyway, moving on. I generally avoid posting on topics like this because I get accused of being a homer and defensive if I express my relatively positive views on the roads and other things.
Last edited by ClemVegas; 12-21-2016 at 08:08 PM..
I'm surprised that a person who said the roads in Raleigh are terrible would relocate from Arizona to live in or near Anderson. I've always heard Raleigh is the most progressive city in the Carolinas. I can't imagine a person who criticized roads in Raleigh liking Anderson at all.
Your last post had it been earlier would have avoided a lot of bickering. I respect your opinion. But I'd not shy from putting my forward either: which is that the roads here, but the kind of size the city and area is becoming are terrible in every way possible. The new roads are probably better, but that is just coming up to the standard of other cities/counties of a similar stature. Doesn't change that there was no vision in the past or as the area was growing bigger.
Please don't think my response earlier about bickering was about this thread, it wasn't. My apologies if I made it seem like that. There is actually some good info and opinions in this thread.
Unfortunately, you are right. And, I made a mistake, I read these boards and saw the enthusiasm for Greenville. Main St is nice and we decided that this would be a good place to raise kids. My mistake was separating the enthusiasm from reality. Even with the lower cost of living, economically, we are not as far along as we could be had we moved to a place like Charlotte.
I am not a fan of Atlanta but, even looking at that now is an option. Greenville lacks a lot of opportunities for young professionals. If you are an engineer, there are some jobs available but they still don't pay enough to match other areas.
From a business perspective, this is still a heavy manufacturing environment. There are no fortune 500 companies based here..........not even large HQ/regional operations. There is a fledging entrepreneurial thought in the area but you see that in most places. The difference is that Greenville does not have the capital to move thoughts and ideas into reality/profit.
The proof is when you look at average salaries........even with SC's low base, Greenville trails Charleston and Columbia in household income.
Yeah, that's just how it is unfortunately. If you're coming to the Upstate, you can probably expect a pay cut. You're seeing more options and diversity emerging, but it's still pretty behind the game in general.
There's one marketing company downtown that's so cheap, I made more as an intern in DC (no it wasn't in politics) than their full time employees make. I'm still baffled every time I look at Glassdoor that they think that salary is okay. The COL is not low enough here for that. And even with this COL, the wages are still low.
And the office culture is definitely more mature and conservative. Still a pretty "suit and tie" type of place with definitely older employees. You don't see a lot of the perks the younger-skewing companies have.
I wouldn't call the job market disadvantageous to everyone. Plenty of people do well around here, and the medical is actually the largest employer, but for the professional crowd in general, yeah. It could be better.
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