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Most all liver and liver related disease comes about from alcohol consumption or the ingestion of toxins that the liver cannot process properly. Fatty liver is no exception, and is nearly always lifestyle related.
I've shown you that's false (bolded) from a reputable source. 100 million people, almost a full 1/3 of our country's population have this problem and it isn't from alcohol.
Fatty liver is another story, that is mainly diet related and I only speak for the US. Our diets are terrible. Diabetes and obesity are big problems in this country. The liver problems fall in line with those problems. It's a hidden problem as in nobody even realizes they have it. It may be lifestyle related but sorry, there aren't that many heavy drinkers around. This affects all age groups, even children.
First and foremost, not giving advice here or telling you that you are a drunk, etc. Only you can see whether you yourself can see whether you have a problem with consumption and adjust accordingly. A few points to consider though...
The going from 5 to 4 to 3 drinks, substituting wine for liquor, beer for wine thing has been tried by many and usually not with great results. Now, we are talking about individuals with a heavy drinking history here. Most, if not all of them did not get there overnight.
Actually all of the above is what alcoholics try to justify their need to drink. "I don't have to quit, I'll just cut down or switch out types."
All that does, is prove that you are addicted to alcohol and will do anything OTHER than quit drinking, to continue drinking.
I've shown you that's false (bolded) from a reputable source. 100 million people, almost a full 1/3 of our country's population have this problem and it isn't from alcohol.
Fatty liver is another story, that is mainly diet related and I only speak for the US. Our diets are terrible. Diabetes and obesity are big problems in this country. The liver problems fall in line with those problems. It's a hidden problem as in nobody even realizes they have it. It may be lifestyle related but sorry, there aren't that many heavy drinkers around. This affects all age groups, even children.
We can agree to disagree.
It's interesting news, gguerra, and worth consideration.
On the other hand, alcoholism is very high right now in our country and it can be a hidden disease for many years. A majority of doctors don't talk about alcohol consumption and patients rarely self-report accurately. You might be surprised to discover how many secret addicts you know that you would never have guessed until they start to show symptoms that can't be covered up.
Again, early stage alcoholism is often missed because people don't have the correct information to accurately recognize it and rely on old stereotypes. Denial is everywhere when it come to addiction.
Junior doesn't have a drinking problem. He just needs to settle down and get in with a better group of friends.
Grandma doesn't have a problem. She just has a sip of brandy for her heart now and then.
Jim, the successful businessman, doesn't have a problem. It's just that his divorce and heavy workload is causing a little extra stress right now.
The preacher doesn't have a problem. No one has ever seen a drink touch his lips.
Coach doesn't have a problem. He just likes to celebrate his wins and drown his losses. That's normal for anyone.
Doctor doesn't have a problem. He's an expert on disease and should know if he does or not. No one's ever seen him drunk.
And we've discussed the drinking Moms who use every social occasion to get out the wine. Sophisticated wine drinkers just plain aren't alcoholics. Look at what they spent. Look at the crystal glasses. That doesn't look like alcoholism.
Actually all of the above is what alcoholics try to justify their need to drink. "I don't have to quit, I'll just cut down or switch out types."
All that does, is prove that you are addicted to alcohol and will do anything OTHER than quit drinking, to continue drinking.
Mmm, yeah. That was exactly my point. If the drinking is so 'bad,' switching around the types of alcohol is going to do nothing.
Much better described in the Big Book...
The bottom line is when it comes to drinking, one knows when he/she has a problem. It is whether he/she chooses to acknowledge it and change the lifestyle, or brush it off, despite many not only health warnings, but reactions from friends, co-workers, etc.
No amount of 'advice' is going to make the person change UNTIL he/she realizes the change is needed and works to change. That is why in some circles that deal with addiction, people do not give advice but rather share their own stories, so others around them may say, "Holy s&*t, I may have a problem too."
There are quite a few advances so to speak in treating addiction and one worth noting is the neurofeedback. Worth looking into for those who struggle with addiction.
Our solution is having a mj edible right at Happy Hour. After that, the desire is gone. Plus sleep is divine!
We can still imbibe on social occasions, which are rare these days. That way, we don't feel "deprived".
So far, it's been working.
As to fatty liver, I spent a long time on medical sites, and it seems 90% of the info is directed towards NAFLD and it's almost hard to find the alcoholic version.
As I said, "lifestyle" is a component of fatty liver and other liver problems. Sorry to burst your bubble, but a lot of fatty liver IS caused by alcohol. A lot is also caused by obesity, but it gets hard to distinguish weather the obese person has fatty liver from the alcohol of from being obese. Probably a combination. Certainly some non-drinker obese people get fatty liver, but once again it is a lifestyle thing from being obese. Doctors have certain guidelines they use to make the determination of NAFL. Probably it involves how much the patient reports drinking, and if the number of reported drinks is below a certain number, it can be called NAFL. How many alcoholics are truthful to their doctors about how much they drink is probably-- not very many. Being a healthy weight, non drinker with NAFL might get you a footnote in a medical journal article.
Last edited by ocoilslick; 12-22-2020 at 02:00 PM..
Reason: sp
It would seem like exaggerating but I personally know someone who has been drinking at least 6-7 units of alcohol every day over the last 28+ years.. his liver enzymes as in the OP were much elevated after extreme indulgence in the holiday season of 2019.. But fell to perfect range of in March 2020 after a level of control.. his are high again as of tests in last two weeks ago..again bc of extreme indulgence..
He's functional. Socially well connected. Prigrossinally successful.
His life is a mystery to all his friends... for a guy in his mid 50s without consequences for his behavior of almost 3 decades.. he doesn't take any prescriptions.. never had a surgery. Never hospitalized.. no known major issues..
And yet.. without exaggerating.. he's been drinking at least 6-7 units on average of alcohol for the last almost 3 decades!!!
It would seem like exaggerating but I personally know someone who has been drinking at least 6-7 units of alcohol every day over the last 28+ years.. his liver enzymes as in the OP were much elevated after extreme indulgence in the holiday season of 2019.. But fell to perfect range of in March 2020 after a level of control.. his are high again as of tests in last two weeks ago..again bc of extreme indulgence..
He's functional. Socially well connected. Prigrossinally successful.
His life is a mystery to all his friends... for a guy in his mid 50s without consequences for his behavior of almost 3 decades.. he doesn't take any prescriptions.. never had a surgery. Never hospitalized.. no known major issues..
And yet.. without exaggerating.. he's been drinking at least 6-7 units on average of alcohol for the last almost 3 decades!!!
Doctors etc used to tell people that once your liver is damaged it will never recover. This was told in some attempt to get people to stop drinking. Of course Doctors do not know what they are talking about when psychology is involved, and instead drunks used it as an excuse to keep drinking. Fact of the matter is that unless you have severe alcohol related liver damage already, if you stop for long enough-- chances are you liver WILL regenerate itself and heal. As your friend found during his brief sobriety.
Fact of the matter is that unless you have severe alcohol related liver damage already, if you stop for long enough-- chances are you liver WILL regenerate itself and heal. As your friend found during his brief sobriety.
Wow! Thanks for sharing the info.
Question: Didn't Winston Churchill drink a 'large amount' everyday and yet was not called an 'alcoholic'. What makes some people manage such a lifestyle like him and my friend without severe consequences for so long?
If you can actually cut down your drinking from >5 back down to 2 per day and keep it there for longer than 2 weeks, you should be good to go. There are studies that show the liver heals itself also by cutting down alcohol vs quitting completely. Cutting down for just a day or two now and then doesn't count.
The liver is an amazing organ. Also, make sure that the "2" drinks you drink are actually 2. (A 4 oz shot of vodka is not "1" drink).
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