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Many people in this thread don't seem to understand two things... 1) You ALSO want to be concerned with the LONG-term side effects. They are unknown. We don't know if there are any. 2) There's a difference between being "anti-vaccine" and being "anti-inadequately tested, experimental vaccine". Vaccines usually take 4 to 5 years to test -- not 2 months. These COVID-19 ones are being RUSHED to market under emergency authorization.
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Originally Posted by mysticaltyger
It amazes me how many people will either completely deny or minimize those 2 important distinctions.
There is a reason it is called Emergency Use Authorization.
It is illogical to fear hypothetical future adverse effects more than the very real morbidity and mortality from the infection. The probability that the vaccines will ever be found to be more dangerous than the disease is infinitesimally small.
They were not "inadequately tested". The money available made it possible to do large studies, and some that would have been done in sequence were done side by side instead. In addition, the companies started making vaccine before the studies were complete, gambling that they would get the EUAs. It was not necessary to wait for it to be produced - and in large quantities. In order to get the EUA safety and efficacy had to be demonstrated, and they were.
Now the data on millions of doses administered confirms that efficacy and safety. Both Pfizer and Moderna are preparing applications for full licensure and probably will have it before the end of the year.
Do you not know a lot of people? Or do you live in a fairly unpopulated area and don't have friends/acquaintances/family members living outside of your immediate location? I didn't think I knew a lot of people, but I know three who died of Covid (two 50-something men and one 70-something man) and several who were hospitalized. To not know ANYONE who was in the hospital or died makes me think that maybe you don't know many people, period.
I know tons of people just for the record. I live in a well populated area of Texas. I know one person who was hospitalized for one day. Don't know anyone who has died of Covid 19. I know numerous people who were sickish for a few days and also numerous families who were asymptomatic but quarantined.
Mom (84) has been in the hospital for almost two weeks. She has been diagnosed with dementia despite showing no signs of dementia prior to Vaccination Day.
I visited my parents one month ago. Mom had just renewed her driver's license, could walk, care for her dogs, and even offered to cook me pecan pies for the trip home. Today, she cannot walk, hold a coffee cup, nor remember that her mom died 18-years ago.
We spoke briefly and while her speech was clear, she spoke mostly of someone named Melvin before calling 911.
Rapidly progressive dementia can be a product of an overactive immune system. The doctors that have been treating my dad for the last three months claim that the vaccine elicited an immune response that "blew up" a mild, undetected UTI that has ultimately resulted in the dysfunction of his bladder, requiring a suprapubic catheter.
I am sorry to hear about your mom. My mom's vascular dementia progressed quickly, especially after she broke her hip and had to have surgery.
It also got a lot worse when she had a UTI so be sure your mom is checked for that as well as vascular dementia. There are several main types of dementia and some types can progress very quickly.
You know of course that dose #2 of Moderna MIGHT knock him out for a day.....just have him plan the next day free....just heard from a cousin..63....who had NO adverse effects from Moderna dose 2....does vary..
Hubs friends wife ended up dying. He got the call a few days ago. She went down hill, hubs friend pulled the plug. She went quick, 2 breaths and was gone so he made the right decision. She was 60. I don't know what strain they got and if they will be trying to see the strain. All I know is she had back issues, no other health issues. Hubs friend is still in quarantine, very weak. I'm glad they allowed him to be with his wife while she passed away.
I've told him about the side effects with the various vaccines so he knows the 2nd could take him out for a day or 2. I would have rather he got J&J but he was freaked out with his friends getting severe COVID. He's not near anyone with his main job, it's his weekend Sam's club job that he's worried about.
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Originally Posted by Deserterer
I think there is some truth to it with Pfizer and Moderna and Shingrix, but the latter being different from the former it still doesn't quite add up. Why not other vaccines? Why have I never heard of this phenomenon before covid? There are still some questions that need answering...
Shingrix shot one kicked my a$$ bad! Almost closed my throat, thankfully I'd brought Benadryl with me because I had a feeling I'd have a reaction because I have reactions to medication fillers. I had side effects for weeks that are in the threads here and in retirement. I did have shingles. No vax #2 so I hope that having shingles plus one vaccine will protect me even though it's supposed to be "rare" for someone to get shingles twice.
I'm not ready to try my luck with the COVID vaccine but if I do, I'm going with one and done J&J because I may not get a 2nd chance due to my many allergies. I'll be tested for what's known to cause allergies in the J&J vaccine. No surprises for me.
I also do not remember having any reactions to vaccines before the shingles vaccine but I'm not one to get a flu shot because of my allergies to medications. The last shot I had was tetanus, I don't recall having any reaction.
My son will be 36, I'm pretty sure that he had mild reactions to childhood vaccines but he was also sick a lot when he was little with ear infections. My daughter who's 8 years younger did have severe reactions with every vaccine where she would be miserable for a few days. At one point, I realized that she was getting more vaccines then her brother, I looked at the shot record and was right. I don't recall how many more she had then him and what they were.
My grandson also has a reaction to childhood vaccines and I'm not surprised because my daughter allowed them to give him 6 vaccines in one visit which really ticked me off. She didn't drive, I told her give him 2 with one oral, I'd bring her back for the rest, she said doctor said it's safe, so she continued like that until he was done. He continues to have a reaction with every vaccine which has been the flu shot while he was in preschool. It's not required in elementary school so he doesn't get one. My daughter and I noticed that he would be sick from the time he got a flu shot until the spring. He got this cough, would eventually start throwing up. Since he's stopped the flu shot, he's been pretty healthy. Hasn't had that cough. So weird.
I think it is because the new vaccines pack more immune system priming in a smaller package than the older ones did.
I suspect this as well, which is both good and bad. Fewer side effects mean more people are likely to take the vaccines, but more side effects may mean they are more effective, creating kind of a conundrum.
People are afraid of RNA vaccines because they are "new". However, not entirely new. They have been worked on for over a decade, and tested in different applications. Just because they were "new" to covid-19, does not mean the RNA vaccine was untested. So they were not tested for "two months". They were tested only for a few months with the covid spike protein, but that shouldn't matter, there's nothing alarming about that, imho.
There's a lot more to be afraid of in getting covid.
Many people in this thread don't seem to understand two things... 1) You ALSO want to be concerned with the LONG-term side effects. They are unknown. We don't know if there are any. 2) There's a difference between being "anti-vaccine" and being "anti-inadequately tested, experimental vaccine". Vaccines usually take 4 to 5 years to test -- not 2 months. These COVID-19 ones are being RUSHED to market under emergency authorization.
Are you prepared to lock down society for those four to five years to ditz around?
Are you prepared to lock down society for those four to five years to ditz around?
No they are not. Nor are they going to wear masks and social distance. That's just what antivaxxers do.
"1) You ALSO want to be concerned with the LONG-term side effects. They are unknown. We don't know if there are any. 2) There's a difference between being "anti-vaccine" and being "anti-inadequately tested, experimental vaccine". Vaccines usually take 4 to 5 years to test -- not 2 months. These COVID-19 ones are being RUSHED to market under emergency authorization."
The unifier among the two groups cited is that they don't give a **** about getting infected. They are young and don't care about anybody else because they don't see other young people getting infected and suffering. Those that get sick stay at home or end up in the hospital and are thus hidden.
We heard the same complaints about HPV vaccine where it took 7 years to develop and just recently released a CDC statement after 12 years of post-release data on safety and efficacy. No one in their right mind is going to wait 19 years for a vaccine that is killing people right now.
People are using excuses to cover up the fact that they are less afraid of the virus than a vaccine. The proof is they will not wear masks and social distance for 5 years until the safety studies are completed. It's a farce complaint. If it were killing mostly young people they would be running to get the vaccine.
Interesting, thank-you Suzy_q, you seem to know a lot and must be in the medical community. I completely agree vaccines do not cause autism nor alzheimer's disease. I've done some reading myself on both of them as there is generational alzheimer's disease in my family and friends with autistic children brought on quite an informative discussion about vaccines. Debunked!
Meh. My son's Immunologist has diagnosed a vaccine injury as causative for my son's severe autism. He is now medically exempt from all vaccines.
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Originally Posted by mysticaltyger
It amazes me how many people will either completely deny or minimize those 2 important distinctions.
Ikr; people already think they haven't had a long term injury because their headache went away after 5 days.
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Originally Posted by Medical Lab Guy
No they are not. Nor are they going to wear masks and social distance. That's just what antivaxxers do.
I'm antivaxx. I started masking in January 2020; two months before they were "recommended". Everyone looked at me like I had grown an extra head. I still mask. I pulled my son out of school three weeks before the "stay at home" started. Sometimes I think I am the only parent of an autistic child who can mask. That didn't come easy. I worked with him very hard on this. Now he always makes sure we have masks before we leave the car. He can easily mask for up to 8 hours straight. I could mask for 24/7; doesn't bother me one bit.
When covid wasn't even confirmed here in the US & people were saying "The flu is worse"; I told them "The flu statistics have been manipulated to use for a "Cry Wolf" ... Covid IS the Wolf". Search here on CD with my name + keyword "Wolf" ... I said it multiple, multiple times.
I think there is some truth to it with Pfizer and Moderna and Shingrix, but the latter being different from the former it still doesn't quite add up. Why not other vaccines? Why have I never heard of this phenomenon before covid? There are still some questions that need answering...
I presume you're referring to the immune response here?
1) Shingrix.. You've got a whole lot of people here mentioning it knocking them down for a day or two afterwards
2) Tetnus.. Quite often people have a sore arm after that shot. Which, prior to covid, they probably didn't even think anything about.
3) Flu.. How many times have you heard "I won't take a flu shot. Last time I did, it gave me the flu"? Think that through.. You know they didn't get the flu.. So what did they get? A strong immune response to it.
Outside of those.. What vaccinations does someone over the age of 6 get?
You've heard of it.. Just didn't realize you did..
As for the 2 year olds.. They just don't whine as much as adults unless they're REALLY not feeling well.
What I'm kinda curious about.. Is there any correlation between the reactions to a tetnus shot, or flu shot and the COVID vaccination shot? If you "got the flu" from the flu shot, does that mean you'll likely have a strong reaction to the COVID vax?
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