Why are there people that think communism was at all a good thing?

[erasure]

Originally Posted by NJGOAT

Well, I actually just used some very well known quotes to support GS's argument that the Bible argues for a communal society. An argument which you dismissed out of hand as "an invention of liberals". I provided the passages and anyone can go ask a priest and they will tell you that it is framed as the ideal of a Christian society/commune. Despite my raging liberalism, I was very much raised in the Christian faith.

With that said, the Bible really doesn't have anything to do with economics. The entire side argument over the Bible was merely to address the OP's statement that Capitalism = Jesus and Communism = Satan. Anyone who has ever spent a minute in church knows that's a ridiculous analogy.

Now, if you want to actually debate economic theory, I'm all for it, but you've already demonstrated a complete lack of understanding of the basic terms and definitions. So, there isn't much to talk about.

NJ Goat, you are on top of things as ever.
Can't rep you enough for this post and the previous one with quoting of the bible)))

[erasure]

Originally Posted by momomanno

It's not "secular" versus "religious," except tangentially. The reason I say that is because Europe was quite religious. The main driving force towards communism is liberalism, which paves the way by opposing religion and then driving towards socialism and communism. And the irony is that liberalism essentially springs forth from the prosperity that it destroys, so it's essentially cyclical.

In order for any society to accept liberal beliefs, it has to be so prosperous that it can afford to be liberal. In other words, it has to accept people not working and yet being supported perpetually by the government and it has to accept an ever-growing government service and government force. In Europe, the factor that led to their prosperity was the total destruction of Europe followed by America essentially rebuilding it for them, as well as America taking on the total defense budget of Europe. Liberals point to the prosperity of Europe and claim that it was due to liberal policies, but that's their revisionism at work. In point of fact, they started out with a pile of money and then slowly and inevitably spent it all. We're now coming towards the end of that cycle, as many European countries are hitting their breaking points financially.

That can also be seen in America, where you start out with very prosperous states, such as California, which were not dominated by liberal beliefs. Then, as their prosperity allowed for liberalism to take hold, the states were progressively destroyed and bankrupted. That's always the cycle with liberalism, socialism, and communism.

Lolz. The main driving point towards communism is actually the ABSENCE of liberalism in the society, the all-encompassing domination of conservatism and despotism. When liberalism is PRESENT in society controlling conservatism, the need for communism actually disappears.

[momomanno]

Originally Posted by erasure

Lolz. The main driving point towards communism is actually the ABSENCE of liberalism in the society, the all-encompassing domination of conservatism and despotism. When liberalism is PRESENT in society controlling conservatism, the need for communism actually disappears.

Thanks for demonstrating the revisionism of liberalism, the ideology that requires authoritarian, centralized government and control of information. Your assistance is appreciated.

[erasure]

Originally Posted by momomanno

Thanks for demonstrating the revisionism of liberalism, the ideology that requires authoritarian, centralized government and control of information. Your assistance is appreciated.

That's not "revisionism" - that's straightenoutism of your faulty theories.
You are welcome.

[momomanno]

Notice how the liberal enters the thread and then fervently works to move it away from a discussion of liberalism and socialism by making completely irrelevant and generic comments? He will now proceed to make a series of childish comeback insults that are intended to garner a response that will allow him to repeat this process repeatedly, possibly for several pages, until the thread has been completely derailed and rendered useless. Then, having covered any discussion of liberalism and socialism, he will immediately scan the forum for the next thread to repeat the process.

The key is that when a liberal cannot control the information -- as in a school setting, where they are the teacher or professor -- then they will rely on their secondary method of merely making it impossible for information to be exchanged. In this way, liberalism and socialism are preserved.

[erasure]

Originally Posted by momomanno

Notice how the liberal enters the thread and then fervently works to move it away from a discussion of liberalism and socialism by making completely irrelevant and generic comments? He will now proceed to make a series of childish comeback insults that are intended to garner a response that will allow him to repeat this process repeatedly, possibly for several pages, until the thread has been completely derailed and rendered useless. Then, having covered any discussion of liberalism and socialism, he will immediately scan the forum for the next thread to repeat the process.

The key is that when a liberal cannot control the information -- as in a school setting, where they are the teacher or professor -- then they will rely on their secondary method of merely making it impossible for information to be exchanged. In this way, liberalism and socialism are preserved.

Notice how the conservative enters a thread and fervently works to turn it from a discussion of Communism into a thread about a liberal sleeping under his bed))))
At that he takes us through the whole process of his nightmarish experience, the crinkled sheets, flat pillow and sweaty blanket, before proceeding to the most frightening part of the full moon behind the window, the welfare recipients and centralized government.
The thought of liberal academia enters his mind as additional threat to exchange of conservative information, progressing from a full moon to a total eclipse.
I don't remember laughing so hard reading about the "secondary methods" and the ways of "preserving liberalism and socialism" here, sorry))))

[momomanno]

Notice that once again, she has said literally nothing in rebuttal? She managed to type out a lot of words, however. Although, it wouldn't matter. At some point, she'll just resort to typing short one- or two-word posts. The only important thing is to clutter up the thread with posts that lead people away from the link between liberalism and socialism/communism. Since she is unable to debate me, I will simply ignore her.

[erasure]

Originally Posted by momomanno

Notice that once again, she has said literally nothing in rebuttal? She managed to type out a lot of words, however. Although, it wouldn't matter. At some point, she'll just resort to typing short one- or two-word posts. The only important thing is to clutter up the thread with posts that lead people away from the link between liberalism and socialism/communism. Since she is unable to debate me, I will simply ignore her.

Not as many as I'd like)))
But since you expect me to write even shorter posts, let's try one more time;

"Why are there people that think communism was a good thing?"

Are you one of those people? Please contribute.
Your input is greatly appreciated.

[Phil75230]

Why people still believe in communism. It's because they don't want to see how selfish and indifferent to the human condition we humans tend to be. It's simply not a matter of educating people, though I think education and social admonishment can reign some of capitalism's worst abuses (slavery, severe underpay, unsafe working conditions, unreasonably short family leave [if present at all]). Hell, even religion, with all its threats of a horrid afterlife of some sort hammered into our heads for thousands of years, still hasn't changed human nature itself to the extent that something remotely like communism is viable for humans.

MAYBE Communism can work if we can genetically reengineer human behavior, or can use nano-robots to reprogram our brain's neural connections; in short, reengineer human nature itself (so that it's more cooperative than competitive, for starters). I wouldn't hold my breath, though!!

[GER308]

Originally Posted by Phil75230

Why people still believe in communism. It's because they don't want to see how selfish and indifferent to the human condition we humans tend to be. It's simply not a matter of educating people, though I think education and social admonishment can reign some of capitalism's worst abuses (slavery, severe underpay, unsafe working conditions, unreasonably short family leave [if present at all]). Hell, even religion, with all its threats of a horrid afterlife of some sort hammered into our heads for thousands of years, still hasn't changed human nature itself to the extent that something remotely like communism is viable for humans.

MAYBE Communism can work if we can genetically reengineer human behavior, or can use nano-robots to reprogram our brain's neural connections; in short, reengineer human nature itself (so that it's more cooperative than competitive, for starters). I wouldn't hold my breath, though!!

Yet the same human flaws, greed, desire for power above all... are the reason capitalism fails too. The answer is a balance of a competitive market and social fairness wich needs a regulated system along with tolerance and freedom.