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If you don't know your reference in some way that's long term or haven't been using them long term, it's pretty risky to not give them any kind of heads up. On the other hand, if you were sub-par in whatever the job was and use a reference without conferring with them, I don't think you should expect they'd say anything glowing. Still, I wouldn't necessarily say anything too repugnant. The truth should be spoken, but it can be done vaguely...
Seriously, for maintaining a reference sending a email every few weeks or months isn't exactly hard. A few simple words to keep your existence in the person's mind is the least one should be able to do if the reference isn't a friend, isn't smitten with you, or isn't a friend of the family.
I would have left it at "I haven't seen or heard from him in more than a year" and said good day. The interviewer can draw his/her own conclusions.
We at one time had some rental houses. I never gave anybody a bad reference. What I did do was say that I had to have a signed,notarized release from the tenant to release info. That got the message across without saying a thing.
Agree, there are no laws against giving a negative reference, or against giving more that dates, duties, and title, like many believe.
Many companies set this as an internal policy because they are afraid of lawsuits (people can sue for anything, doesn't mean they'll win.)
Basically you can legally give any factual info in a reference if it's true and not an intentional lie, and you can give any opinions you wish. You should also avoid avoid giving any info that might hint at any protected class the person might belong to, because this will come close to violation of discrimination laws and open the door to the person deciding they didn't get hired because of protected-class info you gave out.
I've been a professional reference for many people, many having been people I supervised when they were graduate students doing internships. Usually people use me for a year or two after we've worked together, and after that they've presumably gathered up more recent references.
But I had one woman who continued to use me as a reference for years, I mean up to 10 years, after we ended our work together. She also stopped contacting me to ask if I would still be a reference, or to even let me know someone might be calling me about her. She was only like a C- employee at best when I supervised her, and I wouldnt even continue to do this for an A+ employee if they stopped contacting me but still used me as a reference.
I started the callers that I had not worked with her in 10 years, and had not heard from her in over 5 years, and I'm confused as to why they are contacting me. I'm sure that gave them a clear picture of her lack of judgment, so it was a negative reference, but more implied than stated.
Op, I support your decision to give a bad reference. I would not get tied up in worrying that I should give a bad employee a good reference because he needs a job and "has to put food on the table", etc. I would not feel guilty about giving him an accurately negative reference. I prefer to feel more for the other unemployed people who are competing with that bad employee for the position, who need to out food on their tables. I'd feel guilty about giving an inaccurate good reference that might give the bad employee a job over some good employee out there.
Agree, there are no laws against giving a negative reference, or against giving more that dates, duties, and title, like many believe.
Many companies set this as an internal policy because they are afraid of lawsuits (people can sue for anything, doesn't mean they'll win.)
Basically you can legally give any factual info in a reference if it's true and not an intentional lie, and you can give any opinions you wish. You should also avoid avoid giving any info that might hint at any protected class the person might belong to, because this will come close to violation of discrimination laws and open the door to the person deciding they didn't get hired because of protected-class info you gave out.
I've been a professional reference for many people, many having been people I supervised when they were graduate students doing internships. Usually people use me for a year or two after we've worked together, and after that they've presumably gathered up more recent references.
But I had one woman who continued to use me as a reference for years, I mean up to 10 years, after we ended our work together. She also stopped contacting me to ask if I would still be a reference, or to even let me know someone might be calling me about her. She was only like a C- employee at best when I supervised her, and I wouldnt even continue to do this for an A+ employee if they stopped contacting me but still used me as a reference.
I started the callers that I had not worked with her in 10 years, and had not heard from her in over 5 years, and I'm confused as to why they are contacting me. I'm sure that gave them a clear picture of her lack of judgment, so it was a negative reference, but more implied than stated.
Op, I support your decision to give a bad reference. I would not get tied up in worrying that I should give a bad employee a good reference because he needs a job and "has to put food on the table", etc. I would not feel guilty about giving him an accurately negative reference. I prefer to feel more for the other unemployed people who are competing with that bad employee for the position, who need to out food on their tables. I'd feel guilty about giving an inaccurate good reference that might give the bad employee a job over some good employee out there.
Some places do ask references from a long time ago, the US Foreign Service for example will do an extensive background check that includes interviews with people you worked with from years back. I don't know if that was the case here but who knows although she should have given you a heads up.
Nope she weas just applying for social work jobs and even though she evidently still had my contact info, she never bothered to contact me about continuing to be a reference.
If someone legitimately needed a reference from 10 years ago, like the situation you describe, they should definitely contact the reference and make sure it's still okay to use them, remind them of who they are, and the work they did together.
I had someone recently call me who worked under me about 7 years ago. She thought that I would be a good reference for a particular job she was going for, even though she had more recent references. So she reached out to me and actually talked about the position she was going for, reminded of the dates we worked together, the things she had accomplished when working for me, and tied that experiences to the position she was currently going for. I really appreciated that, and I was more than happy to give her a glowing reference (even though she was maybe a solid "B" employee at best.)
Oddly, I gave the glowing reference and she got the job, but she never thanked me.
My opinion is that someone should get a negative reference if they willfully behaved badly. If they didn't show up, were insubordinate, stole, committed a crime, mouthed off etc I have no sympathy for them.
If there was just a poor personality match between the boss and employee (majority of cases), or the company wasn't satisfied with the person's performance despite their best efforts, or the employee accidently broke a company policy then I think giving a bad reference is being a d-bag.
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That got the message across without saying a thing.
