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The science says that you have the potential to get permanently disabled or die from this, but unless you are very old or have multiple comorbidies it’s not likely.
Yes, and since this applies to so many illnesses (and viruses) one cannot help noticing the peculiarity of this particular response. (And I'm not certain 'not likely' fully captures the infinitesimal degree of risk to a 25-year-old, for example.)
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Decisions have consequences, and there’s a huge budget gap to be filled now.
I agree. Of course the enormous negative consequences (academic, psychological , physical, etc.) of NY's peculiar reaction to Covid are by no means limited to budgetary. And NY, of course, was not alone.
Last edited by Quick Commenter; 01-15-2021 at 07:09 AM..
Yes, and since this applies to so many illnesses (and viruses) one cannot help noticing the peculiarity of this particular response. (And I'm not certain 'not likely' fully captures the infinitesimal degree of risk to a 25-year-old, for example.)
Three reasons in my view -
1) the novel nature of this virus, that it spread amongst asymptomatic people and the initial high disability and death rate as doctors didn’t know how to treat it. In the beginning people thought it could be transmitted on surfaces, packages, anything. So that also created panic buying for cleaning supplies and food.
2) we were in an election year, where partisan politics are at its worst, combined with a President whose nature tends to inflame rather than reassure. Trump says “A”, Democrats say “B”. The reality is probably part of each. But this didn’t help make people feel safe.
3) the media - including social media - who reports on and hangs on every word in order to get viewers and clicks, regardless of accuracy.
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I agree. Of course the enormous negative consequences (academic, psychological , physical, etc.) of NY's peculiar reaction to Covid are by no means limited to budgetary. And NY, of course, was not alone.
NY definitely wasn’t alone, although it took the initial brunt of the deaths and effects.
By June better treatments were in hand, supplies were back in stores for the most part, and the curve had definitely flattened.
It was NY who stood with a few other states in refusing to open up. That’s all on Cuomo.
There was a huge surge in people buying oxygen concentrator machines in March and April (I looked into one as well). Anyone still thinking of buying one now?
1) the novel nature of this virus, that it spread amongst asymptomatic people and the initial high disability and death rate as doctors didn’t know how to treat it. In the beginning people thought it could be transmitted on surfaces, packages, anything. So that also created panic buying for cleaning supplies and food. ?
The science told us quite early who the vulnerable folks were, told us quite early how the respiratory virus actually spreads, and told us quite early the meaningful measures vulnerable folks and officials could take to mitigate their risks with little societal harm.
Doing that makes the issue of asymptomatic spread a nonissue (the same steps that protect a vulnerable person from a symptomatic spreader protect them from an asymptomatic spreader).
Beyond that (and this may trigger folks), there is nothing novel about asymptomatic spread and respiratory viruses since that is a widely known factor in the transmission of the influenza virus each year here in NY and the US (and worldwide). Nobody has thought of widely, wildly, and repeatedly (before now) testing to confirm and reconfirm that obvious fact (CA, as I noted before has given over 37,000,000 Covid tests and could conceivably give a billion if somebody doesn't stop them). One of many peculiarities in response to this respiratory virus.
Finally, there has always been a weird and vociferous pushback against folks who make comparisons - no matter how apt - with influenza (another respiratory virus). Since it spreads essentially in the same manner (airborne droplets), produces many of the same symptoms, and spreads via symptomatic and asymptomatic carriers, there are many valuable lessons to learn in comparing/contrasting the two. This odd pushback from folks who ordinarily understand how comparisons work (i.e. they don't imply absolute sameness) is another peculiarity in response to this respiratory virus.
Last edited by Quick Commenter; 01-15-2021 at 08:46 AM..
I don't get the bipolar people around here... I mean I guess I do. But, the constant gaslighting is exhausting, isn't it?
"They", "Agenda", "<we didn't land on the moon>" - way too much credit is being given to certain people. They are making it up as they go along, they aren't in on some grandiose scheme. They are dealing with scared people, many of them are probably scared themselves. People in general act irrational when they get scared, they struggle with critical thinking. they create things to get mad at.
Consider for 1 crazy minute that they just don't know all the answers... mind blowing. They are trying to errr on the safe side and not getting it right. Maybe they don't know their arse from their elbow. Point is, they aren't following an official agenda and/or directive from the Klingons.
It makes logical sense to begin opening things when vaccines are being given and there is significant short term immunity around from those who contracted it already. ZOMG you can get it twice or strain Z$3#eE has been detected... ok, settle down tiger. Just saying that if the evil politicians are re-opening things, don't blast them for that, too. If more of us would just follow common sense and the simple "don't be a dick" mantra, we would be in much better shape right now. A good percentage of people tend to be selfish (and whiney)... it's unfortunate, but it's reality.
Solid post, Mikey!
Frustrates the hell out me all the whiners about "destroying the economy with lockdowns" yet won't distance or mask or follow any reasonable guidelines that DIRECTLY counter the need to lockdown or close businesses. 2+2=derp to these nitwit anti-patriots.
Trump says “A”, Democrats say “B”. The reality is probably part of each. But this didn’t help make people feel safe.
Back in February, privately to Bob Woodward, Trump was saying "B." It was only in public that he said "A." And you're trying to both sides this one, come on.
I remain open to the possibility that politicians can make decisions and regulations for political purposes.
No doubt fear and a desire to 'err on the safe side' can be invoked to explain all sorts of conduct and decisions. From rational thru outrageous.
At the same time there is science and relative risk.
The science told us quite early who the vulnerable folks were, told us quite early how the respiratory virus actually spreads, and told us quite early the meaningful measures vulnerable folks and officials could take to mitigate their risks with little societal harm.
As state and local governments shut schools, shuttered businesses, furiously cleaned and recleaned surfaces, closed playgrounds and beaches, banned youth sports, etc there were voices saying this was wrong, ignoring clear science and relative risk, and doing great economic, intellectual, physical, and psychological damage. And suggested there might be more at play here than honest fear and 'erring on the safe side'. (I haven't heard the Klingon explanation till just now.)
Well, clearly there is a good chunk of people who believe all of this is about "control" or an "agenda"... I'm just helping them along because it could be Klingon as much as it could be Qanon. amirite?
"Clear science"... giggle. If you're listening outside your own echo chamber (not you specifically, but people in general), there are plenty who want what those voices would consider dystopian level lockdowns again. They're scared.
The concept of "societal harm" isn't clear, just as the science around the virus isn't clear. There needs to be a balance and we the people in general are not helping ourselves. For instance, when a subset of the same people hyping the non-direct virus damage that these lockdowns are doing (economic, intellectual, pysch, etc) are saying that masks don't work, that there is a hoax, the numbers are wrong, deaths are not happening, hospitals are empty... blasting the health agencies, doctors, and scientists... "something doesn't add up"... you know who I am talking about. Those people are not helping the situation because they don't allow any balance... like politics these days, no middle ground... it's just not possible.
So, in the end you seem to think you have it figured out and what should or could be done... I think that's a crock of poop to be honest. I don't see an easy answer because remember who you are talking about here. Use Average Joe LIer as an example... you really think they will listen to reason? I don't.
Frustrates the hell out me all the whiners about "destroying the economy with lockdowns" yet won't distance or mask or follow any reasonable guidelines that DIRECTLY counter the need to lockdown or close businesses. 2+2=derp to these nitwit anti-patriots.
Thanks... that's exactly what I was trying to get at! They won't listen to any reasonable ideas, has to be all or nothing!
The science told us quite early who the vulnerable folks were, told us quite early how the respiratory virus actually spreads, and told us quite early the meaningful measures vulnerable folks and officials could take to mitigate their risks with little societal harm.
Doing that makes the issue of asymptomatic spread a nonissue (the same steps that protect a vulnerable person from a symptomatic spreader protect them from an asymptomatic spreader).
Beyond that (and this may trigger folks), there is nothing novel about asymptomatic spread and respiratory viruses since that is a widely known factor in the transmission of the influenza virus each year here in NY and the US (and worldwide). Nobody has thought of widely, wildly, and repeatedly (before now) testing to confirm and reconfirm that obvious fact (CA, as I noted before has given over 37,000,000 Covid tests and could conceivably give a billion if somebody doesn't stop them). One of many peculiarities in response to this respiratory virus.
Finally, there has always been a weird and vociferous pushback against folks who make comparisons - no matter how apt - with influenza (another respiratory virus). Since it spreads essentially in the same manner (airborne droplets), produces many of the same symptoms, and spreads via symptomatic and asymptomatic carriers, there are many valuable lessons to learn in comparing/contrasting the two. This odd pushback from folks who ordinarily understand how comparisons work (i.e. they don't imply absolute sameness) is another peculiarity in response to this respiratory virus.
Don’t forget initially there was a comparison with SARS and MERS. In fact COVID is called SARS-CoV-2.
Both SARS and MERS had significantly higher mortality rates. And the science for COVID and treatments wasn’t fully understood back in March.
Back in February, privately to Bob Woodward, Trump was saying "B." It was only in public that he said "A." And you're trying to both sides this one, come on.
As we weren’t privy to what was being shared with Woodward I can only go on what was said at the time. I also seem to remember various politicians including De Blasio telling people in February and March to essentially “go about your lives” including eating out in restaurants, unless you’re sick.
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