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Old 01-13-2021, 09:27 AM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
5,490 posts, read 3,931,751 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 94nasupra View Post
Just like Nancy went with a lower stimulus days after Biden won the election after holding out for months. Follow the science? Cases are hitting all time highs and deaths are hitting daily records. But let’s open now. Can anyone take them serious ?

He was going to shut down with the new strand weeks ago saying it would take 40 weeks to hit Herd immunity with vaccines. Now we don’t care ?
When exactly was that said--any idea? I googled it and haven't found the quote.
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Old 01-13-2021, 09:29 AM
 
1,315 posts, read 1,666,381 times
Reputation: 1220
Quote:
Originally Posted by monstermagnet View Post
shhh, the deniers are thinking...why is Malaysia's response better than ours?! Must be the democrats. Meanwhile, Trump hasn't mentioned the word COVID in 2 months. Because leadership. Threw a bunch a deregulated taxpayer debt at big pharma to "warp speed" a vaccine while starving out the states of support and having ZERO POINT ZERO plan to actually produce and distribute them. That is Trump's MO. Dismantle the infrastructure that came before and replace with hacks and lemmings, ZERO.ZERO plan/strategy, then blame party x,y,z for the failure. Then spin and cover up the truth. When in doubt, blame libs or dems. Thank god this crap is almost over, depending on the talent/ambition level of the next insurrectionists.
"deregulated taxpayer debt"? What is that?
Why would you want the Fed gov involved in the production of vaccines? I sure don't and production of the vaccine is not the issue, even if you gave Pfizer and Moderna billions more it would not have changed how many doses they have been able to develop over the past six months.
The Fed did as much as they could with fast tracking the trials and investigating the safety and results of the trials. The Fed then bought $4B worth of doses from Pfizer and Moderna to be distributed to the states at no charge. The last mile distribution of the vaccine should be up to the states. No state, red or blue, stepped up.

Th CDC has a dashboard showing the state of the Feds distribution of the vaccine to the states and the states usage of the doses. As of today 28 million doses have been sent to the states and 10 million used.
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:09 AM
 
2,589 posts, read 1,826,920 times
Reputation: 3402
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClarkStreetKid View Post
Don't confuse availability and demand with the ability to actually administer the vaccine.

Of course the States are going to complain, especially if they didn't prepare for a vaccine to be developed and then produced. The Fed could have done better but many of the States have done a poor job dealing with the COVID.
It's the Fed of course. 7 million registered in NYS, less than 330,000 doses delivered. Do whatever math you like. Don't hurt yourself. Pfizer says they have shipments sitting and waiting that were cut by the Fed by 40%. Who knows why.
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:13 AM
 
2,589 posts, read 1,826,920 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markjames68 View Post
Trump aside, Malaysia has 1/10 of our population, their state governments are unicameral and weaker (as opposed to the US where powers not taken by the federal government are reserved for the states). Malaysians overall follow their government more. Only 17% of Malaysians are unsure of the vaccine compared with half or more Americans.

They’ve locked down again, implemented a state of emergency and blocked any attempts by other political parties to do anything. Imagine had the current Administration done this...

The sad reality is that Biden can’t really improve on Warp Speed. The optics might be better, inner city minorities might be attended to faster, but ultimately it depends on Americans wanting to get the vaccine. Maybe Biden can convince more people to do so.
ok, I'll defer to captain literal on this one but the analogy (obviously a little tongue in cheek) is that developing nations (far more than Malaysia, from Berundi to Botswana) are doing better simply becasue they are not in a protracted partisan civil cold war. That's fine. But why as you say are they able to follow basic directives without it being an affront to their perceived liberty? We can't get our best and brightest elected Repubs to even follow remedial instructions...even though every 3rd grader is managing without issue.
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:19 AM
 
1,315 posts, read 1,666,381 times
Reputation: 1220
Quote:
Originally Posted by monstermagnet View Post
It's the Fed of course. 7 million registered in NYS, less than 330,000 doses delivered. Do whatever math you like. Don't hurt yourself. Pfizer says they have shipments sitting and waiting that were cut by the Fed by 40%. Who knows why.
https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#vaccinations

Go here, click on NY. Fed distributed 1.6M, NY 600K used.

I work for a hospital system, it is NY state that is the logjam not the feds.
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:22 AM
 
2,589 posts, read 1,826,920 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kmrlongisland View Post
You are confusing who is responsible for what portions of the total debt that taxpayers are responsible, the Feds balance sheet is separate from the US gov. If you want to compare apples-to-apples you should look at the budget deficits that each President presents to Congress to be voted on (Congress needs to agree to the expenditures, so to suggest any President is wholly "responsible" is nonsense). Pulling out the pandemic related stimulus Trump's budget deficits are comparable to Obama's, when you look at deficit per overall size of budget and size of the economy.

The Fed has it's own balance sheet (~7T) of which it is not quite clear how much of that is the responsibility of the US taxpayer.

Also, the last President to run a surplus was Ike.
Clinton 's tenure saw lower budget deficits but he benefited from a historic stable and prosperous economy.
GW, Obama and Trump were blowing the budget out irregardless of any external issues (sub-prime, pandemic).
But only Trump and GW ran as fiscal conservatives. The ONES who spent the most. Who demands "stimulus" while screaming "great economy?" Only one. How soon we forget. And it's funny you dismiss Clinton's success as "benefitting from an historic economy" but he gets no credit. Clinton did the right, bipartisan things (thx Tip Oneill) and was unafraid to be labeled a centrist. No one has since. lol Despite the country being predominantly slightly center right. All the wingnuts on both extremes represent no one, but Trump enjoys that notion that they are his invincible base. That is why he lost. And why the Dems kept a heavy thumb on Bernie in 2016.
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:30 AM
 
2,589 posts, read 1,826,920 times
Reputation: 3402
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmrlongisland View Post
"deregulated taxpayer debt"? What is that?
Why would you want the Fed gov involved in the production of vaccines? I sure don't and production of the vaccine is not the issue, even if you gave Pfizer and Moderna billions more it would not have changed how many doses they have been able to develop over the past six months.
The Fed did as much as they could with fast tracking the trials and investigating the safety and results of the trials. The Fed then bought $4B worth of doses from Pfizer and Moderna to be distributed to the states at no charge. The last mile distribution of the vaccine should be up to the states. No state, red or blue, stepped up.

Th CDC has a dashboard showing the state of the Feds distribution of the vaccine to the states and the states usage of the doses. As of today 28 million doses have been sent to the states and 10 million used.
Everything in this post is inaccurate. The govt DID push production of the vaccines and CDC heavily involved. It did free up loads of play money to do it. Pfizer and Moderna are sitting on doses the Fed is not taking (why oh why). Show me where the states have not stepped up. Besides them being broke and having no coordination with the fed govt due to complete Fed abdication of leadership on COVID.

"deregulated taxpayer debt"? What is that? = The govt printed play money to throw at "deregulated" big pharma to rush a vaccine. Not appropriated in any way. Not actually money in existence. Just printing press debt. Of course we're all ok with it because that's what the Fed has done to keep this house of cards up since 2017, long before COVID. Problem: Printing dough = Wall St rejoices, Main St dies, the dollar weakens, inflation goes up. Our grandkids get the bill. Not exactly fiscal conservatism. Not exactly fiscal anything except malpractice. If you're going to do it, AT LEAST GET IT RIGHT on distribution.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/30/trum...e-rollout.html

https://time.com/5923311/covid-19-va...llotments-cut/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...vaccine-delay/
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:31 AM
 
1,315 posts, read 1,666,381 times
Reputation: 1220
Quote:
Originally Posted by monstermagnet View Post
But only Trump and GW ran as fiscal conservatives. The ONES who spent the most. Who demands "stimulus" while screaming "great economy?" Only one. How soon we forget. And it's funny you dismiss Clinton's success as "benefitting from an historic economy" but he gets no credit. Clinton did the right, bipartisan things (thx Tip Oneill) and was unafraid to be labeled a centrist. No one has since. lol Despite the country being predominantly slightly center right. All the wingnuts on both extremes represent no one, but Trump enjoys that notion that they are his invincible base. That is why he lost. And why the Dems kept a heavy thumb on Bernie in 2016.
There's no shortage of hypocrisy on both sides of the aisles now is there? So using it as a way to delineate the righteous is not insightful.

You are right, I don't give Clinton credit as I didn't give any of the other President's credit for "their" economy. The US gov spending is ~2/3 of the economy, every President has the same game plan - spend more. There's nothing new under the sun when managing the economy.
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:35 AM
 
1,315 posts, read 1,666,381 times
Reputation: 1220
Quote:
Originally Posted by monstermagnet View Post
Everything in this post is inaccurate. The govt DID push production of the vaccines and CDC heavily involved. It did free up loads of play money to do it. Pfizer and Moderna are sitting on doses the Fed is not taking (why oh why). Show me where the states have not stepped up. Besides them being broke and having no coordination with the fed govt due to complete Fed abdication of leadership on COVID.


https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/30/trum...e-rollout.html

https://time.com/5923311/covid-19-va...llotments-cut/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...vaccine-delay/
My post has two questions (left unanswered), two opinions and two facts (the $4B to PFE and MDRNA is commonly known and the dosage distribution is taken from the CDC).

So, exactly, what is inaccurate?
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Old 01-13-2021, 10:38 AM
 
2,589 posts, read 1,826,920 times
Reputation: 3402
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmrlongisland View Post
There's no shortage of hypocrisy on both sides of the aisles now is there? So using it as a way to delineate the righteous is not insightful.

You are right, I don't give Clinton credit as I didn't give any of the other President's credit for "their" economy. The US gov spending is ~2/3 of the economy, every President has the same game plan - spend more. There's nothing new under the sun when managing the economy.
And everything in this post is spot on accurate!
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