Coronavirus in Massachusetts (university, high income, live)

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by htfdcolt

And looks like they extended it by 2 weeks (?!). What a cop-out!

https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/04/...ement-2-weeks/

A fence sitter move. It's important to be decisive about these things, otherwise it leads to additional confusion/frustration. If they believe that there's enough to support pushing it back two weeks (or if they're uncertain about lifting it), then just extend it the full month.

Originally Posted by porterhouse

Some foreign flag carriers (KLM, Virgin, BA) have already discarding or relaxing the mask requirement, though you still need to wear one on the UK carriers for US flights due to the regulations here.

I've seen very lax enforcement on domestic carriers the past 2 weeks.

I flew BA two weeks ago and it was surreal to be on a plane again where they weren't required. The messaging on the return was a bit muddled and confusing and they didn't enforce it much at all during the flight. Though they did make an announcement prior to arrival and again as we were taxiing that masks would be required in order to deplane. My next domestic flight is in mid-May, so we'll see where we are then.

[rach5]

Originally Posted by lrfox

Yep. The places where masks might be reinstated are generally going to be the places that are more tolerant of them (Boston, Somerville, Cambridge, etc.) anyway. But I'm not convinced we'll see much reinstatement of any previous measures at all. The Federal guidance is essentially "assess your own risk." Between that guidance, vaccine availability, N-95 (or similar) availability, testing access and availability, the milder variant, the improving weather, and the hindsight perspective of the last Omicron spike, it's pretty easy for local governments to parrot the "assess your own risk" line.

Interestingly, there's been no announcement yet on the Federal public transit mask mandate which is set to expire in 5 days (4/18).

What is the "hindsight perspective of the last Omicron spike"? Last I heard, 41% of the dead in January were fully vaccinated...Looks like it's not that easy to just "protect yourself" and assess your own risk (let alone put on a mask tightly - my relatives in their 80s and 90s can't manage).

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by rach5

What is the "hindsight perspective of the last Omicron spike"? Last I heard, 41% of the dead in January were fully vaccinated...Looks like it's not that easy to just "protect yourself" and assess your own risk (let alone put on a mask tightly - my relatives in their 80s and 90s can't manage).

You have to adjust for age and boosting. Boosted is 95% effective against death using Brit Omicron data. Two jabs is 59%. The other day when I was looking at my local data, hospitalizations are around 8 per 100,000 per day for age 70+. It drops significantly for younger ages. If you’re 40, in good health, and are boosted, your risk profile is really low. Have at it. If you’re 70, you should be doing your 4th jab, using at least a KN-95 ear loop mask, and watching local infection rates to call your shots on indoor dining.

I think we need to change our view on masks. Initially, masks were to protect others and limit the transmission rate. We didn’t have N95 masks so masks didn’t protect yourself very well. Now, it’s easy to buy N95 masks or the Chinese/Korean version that works pretty much as well. The mask is to protect yourself, not others. 40 and boosted doesn’t need a mask. A 70 year old can decide for themselves if they want to protect themselves.

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by rach5

What is the "hindsight perspective of the last Omicron spike"? Last I heard, 41% of the dead in January were fully vaccinated...Looks like it's not that easy to just "protect yourself" and assess your own risk (let alone put on a mask tightly - my relatives in their 80s and 90s can't manage).

I mean that as literally as it's written. We have the benefit of knowing how it progresses through the population, what vaccine efficacy looks like against Omicron, how it impacts hospitals, etc. We didn't know any of that in November 2021. "Fully Vaccinated" isn't the same thing as "Boosted." The risk of death for fully vaccinated + boosted individuals is low and there are clear trends that correlate with age and comorbidities. N95s, when properly worn, are very effective at protecting the wearer. The idea of assessing one's own risk is pretty simple and effective. If you are older, have comorbidities, aren't boosted, and can't wear a mask properly, you should consider taking additional precautions like avoiding crowds. If you're 30, boosted, and otherwise healthy, your risk level is low and hanging with your friends or going to a crowded bar is very unlikely to land you in the hospital or get you killed.

[jbgusa]

Originally Posted by GeoffD

I think we need to change our view on masks. Initially, masks were to protect others and limit the transmission rate. We didn’t have N95 masks so masks didn’t protect yourself very well. Now, it’s easy to buy N95 masks or the Chinese/Korean version that works pretty much as well. The mask is to protect yourself, not others. 40 and boosted doesn’t need a mask. A 70 year old can decide for themselves if they want to protect themselves.

Very good synopsis on masking.

[rach5]

Originally Posted by jbgusa

Very good synopsis on masking.

That is what is being promoted - but it is wishful thinking. This article https://slate.com/technology/2022/02...ulnerable.html
links to studies showing that N95 masks that are not fit tested usually don't do what they claim to do in terms of protection (how many of you have officially been fit tested?), and that two-way masking with FFP2 (the European equivalent of N95) provides orders of magnitude more protection than one-way masking by the healthy individual:

"It looked at infection risk in a situation where a person who has the virus is speaking to someone who isn’t infected. When the person who wasn’t infected wore a well-fitting mask (an FFP2—a European counterpart to the N95), the risk of infection was 20 percent after an hour of talking. If both parties wear surgical masks, the risk of infection increases a bit, to just under 30 percent. But when both are wearing well-fitting masks, it drops to 0.4 percent."

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by rach5

That is what is being promoted - but it is wishful thinking. This article https://slate.com/technology/2022/02...ulnerable.html
links to studies showing that N95 masks that are not fit tested usually don't do what they claim to do in terms of protection (how many of you have officially been fit tested?), and that two-way masking with FFP2 (the European equivalent of N95) provides orders of magnitude more protection than one-way masking by the healthy individual:

"It looked at infection risk in a situation where a person who has the virus is speaking to someone who isn’t infected. When the person who wasn’t infected wore a well-fitting mask (an FFP2—a European counterpart to the N95), the risk of infection was 20 percent after an hour of talking. If both parties wear surgical masks, the risk of infection increases a bit, to just under 30 percent. But when both are wearing well-fitting masks, it drops to 0.4 percent."

You keep complaining, but, I've not seen yet what you propose to have done. What would you like to have happen? Anything that people would actually do? Anything that wouldn't put people out of work?

[OutdoorLover]

It's a good point. The reason that omicron subsided so sharply (after a big wave) was that between those already vaccinated, and those already infected, there weren't that many naive hosts left anymore within a few months of omicron takeoff. While BA.2 and co are new variants, what we seem to have seen is that there is still useful residual immunity left from prior exposure to Covid-19 antigens, whether they came from vaccines or viruses. It's an educated guess, but I'll take that over the fevered delusions of the conspiracy mongerers.

"Most scientists expect the surge by BA.2 – including all its different versions – will be much smaller than that observed with BA.1, Luban says. That's because many Americans have some immunity to these variants, given the massive number of people exposed to the virus during the first omicron surge. Nearly 50% of Americans could have been infected over the winter"
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsan...s-what-we-know

[rach5]

Originally Posted by timberline742

You keep complaining, but, I've not seen yet what you propose to have done. What would you like to have happen? Anything that people would actually do? Anything that wouldn't put people out of work?

You only need to look at some of the very hard hit European countries that have had more protections, higher vaccination and booster rates and a fraction of deaths. We are literally terrible - just look at the life expectancy drop in the US compared to other high income countries. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-...-year-in-a-row

Biden had a decent plan but abandoned it far too early in May 2021, relying on a vaccinations-only message, which also failed, while he celebrated victory over the virus again and again and again. And we can't even get together as a country to fund tests, treatments and updated vaccinations for all, not just the rich and famous (of course, why would politicians want to fund something when the nation has celebrated victory for the better part of the year, they can get Paxlovid to pop after large scale events, and life is back to "normal" for the working class - except of course for hundreds of thousands of deaths and who knows how many millions of cases of long covid disability?). We suck, and when I think we can't suck any more - we do. I can't believe we are arguing over wearing masks on public transportation during a pandemic - that surely doesn't put people out of work (and neither does masking in grocery stores!)!

In the meantime, Howard University is moving classes and finals online due to covid in the hopes of being able to hold in-person commencement. https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/c...lowTwt_DCBrand

And "among those working in government, personal concern about infection is mounting alongside efforts to blunt the worst outcomes of it. Among the dozens infected in the administration and on Capitol Hill, Pfizer’s antiviral pill — which sharply cuts the risk of serious illness — has been in widespread demand, according to two people with knowledge of the matter." Tell us the truth. When you tell us to "live with covid" and show off the mask and care-free lifestyle, we all deserve the same treatment. They are allocating 175,000 courses of Paxlovid and 30,000 Bebtelovimab a week - how long will that last with a significant BA2 spike? https://www.politico.com/news/2022/0...fight-00025201

The idea of test and treat when they announced the change in mask guidance was great in principle - but another lie to mislead the public, as they knew they didn't have the funding.

[timberline742]

So, once again, you didn't or couldn't answer a fairly straightforward question. Great.