Is it possible to escape hunters, ATVs and noise in a rural area? (Boston: organic, taxes)

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by Lampert

They could be feeding on landfills, they could be feeding on unknown contaminated sites of any sorts. They could be drinking polluted water, you have no idea of any of it and none of this is being tested because it wouldn't make any sense to test it. You only find exactly what you are testing for.
For instance studies show that eating hunted meat increases the level of lead in human bodies by 50%, the lead is leeching from the bullet. This is not something hunted animals are tested for on a routinely basis.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...mmunition-ban/

Most animals slaughtered in the US are not killed with a bolt. Neither pigs nor chickens are killed with a bolt in industrial slaughterhouses usually.

Second most small operations are carried out in an unprofessional way. Is not that the person doing the killing is evil is that they are not very good and they mess up very often. I have personally witnessed this countless times. In a slaughter house things work in a precise way and are much easier to fix, see the work of Temple Grandin.

Lots of hypotheticals there. And every hunter I know switched to steel shot years ago. It's been required for waterfowl for a long time. Tough to get lead poisoning from steel. That article is 12 years old and not based here.

If you don't want to eat wild fish or wild animals, don't, but lets not pretend the meat/poultry industry is more humane.

[Lampert]

Originally Posted by timberline742

Lots of hypotheticals there. And every hunter I know switched to steel shot years ago. It's been required for waterfowl for a long time. Tough to get lead poisoning from steel.

Nothing hypothetical. You are in a less controlled environment with all the consequences that come with it.

The lead is an example or something wasn't thought about or tested. And is still very much in use through the country.

The U.S. Geological Survey recently estimated that figure to be between 6,000 and 10,000 tons annually—that's 12 to 20 million pounds of lead that enters our nation’s uplands, wetlands and waterways each year.

https://mountainjournal.org/for-wild...s-to-be-banned


PS, the meat poultry industry is more human when done properly. Again, see Temple Grandin. This is simply by virtue of being able to implement certain protocols that is impossible to implement in small (single) settings.

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by Lampert

Nothing hypothetical. You are in a less controlled environment with all the consequences that come with it.

The lead is an example or something wasn't thought about or tested. And is still very much in use through the country.

https://mountainjournal.org/for-wild...s-to-be-banned

Lead has been banned in waterfowl hunting since the early 90s. It's been phased out by many entirely. Those still using it are obviously less concerned for their health.

And less controlled doesn't mean safer. No shortage of contaminated water on farms. Heck, that's the norm. Feces and pesticides abound in farm water supplies.

Poultry is more humane? You see what egg operations do to male chicks? They're suffocated in mass quanities.

[Lampert]

Originally Posted by timberline742

Lead has been banned in waterfowl hunting since the early 90s. It's been phased out by many entirely. Those still using it are obviously less concerned for their health.

And less controlled doesn't mean safer. No shortage of contaminated water on farms. Heck, that's the norm. Feces and pesticides abound in farm water supplies.

Poultry is more humane? You see what egg operations do to male chicks? They're suffocated in mass quanities.

Yeah, except hunting waterfowls isn't the only hunting out there. Is not phased out for anything else. And it's cheaper.

Less controlled means less safe, that's what I meant.

Maceration or Asphyxiation may look gruesome but are both considered humane ways of killing the appropriate type of animal.
In medical research asphyxiation is typically the only way to kill non-experimental rodents exactly because it's considered a humane way of doing it, based on what we know.

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by Lampert

Yeah, except hunting waterfowls isn't the only hunting out there. Is not phased out for anything else.

Not across the board, no, but it is phased out by many people, those worried about health. And phased out by many landowners as well. I believe even Joint Base Cape Cod has.

I dont agree that less controlled means less safe, not automatically, not by a long shot.




Trying to frame things like this:
-> male chick born - > automatic euthenasia is more humane and kinder than ->

-> male poult born -> very small chance percentage wise of being harvested by a hunter when they reach adulthood is just absolute insanity to me


I don't believe someone could argue that with a straight face

[BostonMike7]

Originally Posted by timberline742

Lots of hypotheticals there. And every hunter I know switched to steel shot years ago. It's been required for waterfowl for a long time. Tough to get lead poisoning from steel.

More of an issue with hunting bigger game like deer as the rifle rounds or shotgun slugs tend to commonly be made of lead. Copper soft-point rounds are available, but expensive and availability is something of an issue. I've never seen them on the shelf at gun stores, and tough to find in every caliber. You could order them online, but you can't really do that here in MA.

https://www.outdoorlife.com/is-game-...d-safe-to-eat/

Of course deer hunting with a (modern) rifle isn't legal in MA anyway.

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by BostonMike7

More of an issue with hunting bigger game like deer as the hunting rounds or shotgun slugs tend to commonly be made of lead. Copper soft-point rounds are available, but expensive and availability is something of an issue. I've never seen them on the shelf at gun stores, and tough to find in every caliber. You could order them online, but you can't really do that here in MA.

https://www.outdoorlife.com/is-game-...d-safe-to-eat/

I would hope they (copper point soft rounds) aren't being used, since you can't use a rifle to hunt in Massachusetts, at all. Steel shot shotgun shells are available all over. Non availability isn't an excuse.



And its not a great argument for Mass anyway since more deer were taken through archery last year than from shotgun and black powder combined.



If people don't want to eat game. That's fine. It just makes no logical sense to look down upon those that do while also eating meat from the mass livestock industry.

[Lampert]

Originally Posted by timberline742

Non availability isn't an excuse.

It's cheaper, what so weird about that? Many people prefer to save a few bucks than polluting the environment.
And again, there are data about how much lead is still used. I posted it (although it's national data, not directly MA data).

PS, it's not true that more deer where killed with archery than shotgun + primitive firearms.

https://www.mass.gov/service-details/deer-harvest-data

[Lampert]

Originally Posted by timberline742

Trying to frame things like this:
-> male chick born - > automatic euthenasia is more humane and kinder than ->

-> male poult born -> very small chance percentage wise of being harvested by a hunter when they reach adulthood is just absolute insanity to me

I don't think we mean the same thing about what is humane. It has to do with the way animals are killed. How do they suffer most? They suffer most by being killed by a hunter than being thrown into a giant meat grinder. That's why one is a humane way of killing an animal.

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by Lampert

It's cheaper, what so weird about that? Many people prefer to save a few bucks than polluting the environment.
And again, there are data about how much lead is still used. I posted it (although it's national data, not directly MA data).

PS, it's not true that more deer where killed with archery than shotgun + primitive firearms.

https://www.mass.gov/service-details/deer-harvest-data

So those stupid people that care more about a few bucks than their health made their personal choice. And? So?

Your grasping at straws. First it was personal health, now it's about polluting the environment.

First its about being more humane, and your pretending living wild and having the very small chance of being shot is more cruel than guaranteed death through a variety of means including suffocation. Incredible. You're really grasping.