[JimmyInGreatLakes]

Originally Posted by canudigit

If someone uses my paycheck to buy their groceries, then yeah, I feel that I have the right to see what they are buying. To assume that I haven't witnessed this behavior first hand is presumptuous and arrogant. I don't watch or listen to any talk shows. I am too busy working and taking care of my family. I happen to live in a small town with a disproportionate number of irresponsible, lazy people, and YES, I witnessed just last week at our local Kroger a couple of women buying a bunch of two liters of Mountain Dew and a couple of boxes of popsicles with their Bridge Card and then proceeding to get out cash to buy brand name cigarettes at over $6 a pack. As a hardworking, taxpaying citizen, I have a problem with that, and rightfully so. Just when did it become my responsibility to provide for everyone who feels that work is beneath them and having babies out of wedlock and on the public dole is their birthright? There's nothing lacking in my compassion, what's lacking is a work ethic and a standard of right and wrong in people like this. I have compassion for people who can't work because they are TRULY disabled in some way and have no problem contributing to their support, but being lazy and depending on the government to be a daddy to your children and provide you with junk food and cigarettes has become a lifestyle for far too many people. Sorry if you don't like dealing in the truth, which judging by your posts, you probably don't, since it sounds like you've been drinking the Kool-aid of the far left for a while now.

I'm done here. I have better, more productive things to do than sit here and bicker with you. Hopefully you do too.

Aloha, Huey.

I see it too CUDIGIT and AH will call it "judgemental" all the way to eternity but, so what? We judge people all the time. If I have skin in the game (taxes) you bet I'm going to judge. The more we subsidize it, the more we're going to get of it, whether it be wealth or entitlements. Where has that glorious "War on Poverty" from LBJ got us? Oh yeah, more poverty, more births out of wedlock (40% and rising now and a leading predictor of poverty) and an incredible amount of debt. Our "compassion" has been hijacked by the government and they simply spend our money and tell everyone how compassionate they are (as if an entity can have feelings). Some people need to put down the liberal playbook and open their eyes a little. Fortunately, enough did last November and, if they keep their backbone, will stop most of this crap in its' tracks.

[Coldjensens]

Originally Posted by AlohaHuey

My diagnoisis: Cranial-rectal fusion. You clearly have reading comprehension issues.

We ARE a Christian nation. Over 75% identify themselves as such. effin' DUH.

I said EVERYONE HAS TO PAY MORE and expect less to reduce the deficit, and the wealthy should pay more because they have more. "Takeover of America's wealth" is so laughably wrong, it shows you have zero ability to stay on topic.

When people digress to name calling and personal insults in an argument it demonstrates that they are immature and not confident in their position. The same people love ot make up facts, play word games and scream their positions (i.e. using caps lock in CD).

Not intersted in discussions with such folk. I am all done here.

[AlohaHuey]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

When people digress to name calling and personal insults in an argument it demonstrates that they are immature and not confident in their position. The same people love ot make up facts, play word games and scream their positions (i.e. using caps lock in CD).

Not intersted in discussions with such folk. I am all done here.

We're not missing anything in your absence.

I admit to little patience with people who either are too dull to understand english, or deliberately mischaracterize words to fuel their screed. I use caps, and would use crayon if I could, because some people are too ADHD to converse and need some medication, or points of emphasis. Lacking the former, I resort to the latter.

Make up facts? Wrong. Word games? Wrong again. Post a link disproving my "facts"...you can't.

Same diagnosis applies.

[AlohaHuey]

Originally Posted by JimmyInGreatLakes

I see it too CUDIGIT and AH will call it "judgemental" all the way to eternity but, so what? We judge people all the time. If I have skin in the game (taxes) you bet I'm going to judge. The more we subsidize it, the more we're going to get of it, whether it be wealth or entitlements. Where has that glorious "War on Poverty" from LBJ got us? Oh yeah, more poverty, more births out of wedlock (40% and rising now and a leading predictor of poverty) and an incredible amount of debt. Our "compassion" has been hijacked by the government and they simply spend our money and tell everyone how compassionate they are (as if an entity can have feelings). Some people need to put down the liberal playbook and open their eyes a little. Fortunately, enough did last November and, if they keep their backbone, will stop most of this crap in its' tracks.

Elections are cyclical, and judging from the reception many Republicans have already received, quite a lot of people regret their votes already.

To judge this past election as a repudiation of the last 40 years (more or less dominated by Republicans, by the way), is utter nonsense.

[michigan83]

Originally Posted by scolls

I'm curious what freedoms do we lose if we are socialists? What freedoms do Americans have that Canadians don't? What freedoms have the Germans, French, British lost?

Really? Wow. This is such a sad statement that I don't even know where to begin.

You can find people in all of those countries who understand that Americans have sense of freedom that they do not. But people who don't have freedom have a hard time grasping what they are missing, for the most part. The biggest difference between the U.S. and those places is the enormous sense of opportunity and limitless potential that many people "feel". This is not a feeling that you can get when everything is provided for you by government programs. There is a very basic part of human nature that yearns to provide for him/herself. Capitalism harnesses this innate desire to work and earn a living. European socialism can provide a nice sense of security, but it is also a form of imprisonment for the most basic aspects of human nature. Deep down inside, people WANT to live off the fruits of their own labor, and not a gift from someone else.

This guy is a good example of someone from "across the pond" that understands the difference between Europe and the U.S. (a difference that is slowly disappearing).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1IbP...eature=related

[AlohaHuey]

Originally Posted by michigan83

Really? Wow. This is such a sad statement that I don't even know where to begin.

You can find people in all of those countries who understand that Americans have sense of freedom that they do not. But people who don't have freedom have a hard time grasping what they are missing, for the most part. The biggest difference between the U.S. and those places is the enormous sense of opportunity and limitless potential that many people "feel". This is not a feeling that you can get when everything is provided for you by government programs. There is a very basic part of human nature that yearns to provide for him/herself. Capitalism harnesses this innate desire to work and earn a living. European socialism can provide a nice sense of security, but it is also a form of imprisonment for the most basic aspects of human nature. Deep down inside, people WANT to live off the fruits of their own labor, and not a gift from someone else.

This guy is a good example of someone from "across the pond" that understands the difference between Europe and the U.S. (a difference that is slowly disappearing).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1IbP...eature=related

People also have that "feel" in other countries. I believe Scolls was asking for something tangible. You're way out of date on European socialism...it's actually a socialism/capitalism mix that in a lot of ways, is a better system for more of the people.

[Wingnatic]

At this point , all this is just a proposal . One film production '' The Wannabes '' has stated with 2 years left on their lease , will pull up stakes and leave early if the tax incentives are messed with . I'm sure many more would follow .

[TaylorRothschild]

The European way is not to be tried here. I recently spent 5 years there, so I saw these differences first hand.

1. Taxed 50% of your income or more to support social programs. That's less opportunity they have to invest or start their own business.
2. The burden placed by retirement incomes on the young working class is overwhelming. In some places the unemployment for 20-somethings is 40% plus. Employment costs are too high. 6 weeks mandatory weeks of vacation? Free health care? Can't fire someone after 2 months without giving them a pension? 3 year maternity leave? Yeah, how's that for opportunity aloha?!
3. Europeans can get by with very low public service costs. You want to see what happens in USA when you have 1 policeman per 10,000 citizens? Not me.

We need to cut first, raise taxes where needed. And as Jensen pointed out, only the most basic should be provided by the gov't going forward.

[JimmyInGreatLakes]

Originally Posted by michigan83

Really? Wow. This is such a sad statement that I don't even know where to begin.

You can find people in all of those countries who understand that Americans have sense of freedom that they do not. But people who don't have freedom have a hard time grasping what they are missing, for the most part. The biggest difference between the U.S. and those places is the enormous sense of opportunity and limitless potential that many people "feel". This is not a feeling that you can get when everything is provided for you by government programs. There is a very basic part of human nature that yearns to provide for him/herself. Capitalism harnesses this innate desire to work and earn a living. European socialism can provide a nice sense of security, but it is also a form of imprisonment for the most basic aspects of human nature. Deep down inside, people WANT to live off the fruits of their own labor, and not a gift from someone else.

This guy is a good example of someone from "across the pond" that understands the difference between Europe and the U.S. (a difference that is slowly disappearing).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1IbP...eature=related

Great stuff M83! 21 of 22 countries (Egypt being the exception, ironically) say "lower spending" will carve the deficit. I think people in general understand that less government means more freedom. George W. and the crew that ran the country from '00 to '06 are not off the hook either. They did very little to help!

[AlohaHuey]

Originally Posted by JimmyInGreatLakes

Great stuff M83! 21 of 22 countries (Egypt being the exception, ironically) say "lower spending" will carve the deficit. I think people in general understand that less government means more freedom. George W. and the crew that ran the country from '00 to '06 are not off the hook either. They did very little to help!

"Carve" and "eliminate" are very different concepts.

To truly cut the deficit in a meaningful way (not in a political rhetorical way) you have to raise taxes and reduce spending. Back to my original argument: EVERYONE has to pay more and do with less, particularly the wealthy, who can afford it. Welfare recipients have to do with less and the rich have to pay the 35.x% in the tax bracket in which they reside, instead of Warren Buffett and his 12% annual tax levy.