Washington (Spokane) or MN (St. Paul) (Minneapolis, Ely: rentals, home, neighborhoods)

[Swede in CA]

Hello everyone,

Forgive me for a new thread, but this question seems to be the most important for us at the moment. We have to decide between two states and two cities. The decison is a big one bc we also decide between probably different life styles, people, weather, opportunities for us and our children. I understand it is MN forum here, but hope you could give some advise for us: cost of living, opportunities, education, people, weather, long time prospects. WA does not have state income tax, but property taxes are high. Many things could be compared. I need to decide soon, at the end of this month. :0(((( We are from cold climate, but used to live in Cali. What would be with the cost of heating over the years? I guess stupid question.....HELP HELP

[golfgal]

I haven't lived in Washington but I lived in South Dakota for a while and they do not have state income tax there but high property taxes. When we sat down and did the math, it was pretty much a break even proposition for our bank account but you could really tell the difference in the city/state bank account and the services offered there. Something to think about.

MN schools are going to trump WA any day. Coming from California the cost of living in the metro area isn't going to seem high to you at all-even if you aren't coming from and expensive area of California like San Diego. I think you will find that the cost of living is comparable or better then what you have.

You can swap out the cost of air conditioning in California for the cost of utilities in MN--heat in the winter/air in the summer. When I hear what people pay in California for AC in the summer it is . I doubt your highest gas bill in the winter ever will be even close to a typical summer AC bill in CA--unless of course you buy a home with no insulation but that won't be an issue. I think my highest gas bill EVER was $300 and that was a VERY cold month. Usually they are in the $150/range. So far this 'winter' we have spent an extra $15 on gas--but then we have only had our heat on for a handful of days so far.

[Swede in CA]

Golfgal,

We do not use the AC in my home at all. We do have it, but we do not need it. I believe that we will use it more and more here because summers are getting hotter here and very dry. We have not seen rain since last December. Our water bill is higher than electricity. We will have to live w/o water in San Diego next year. Governor proposed that water will not be available 24/7 in the city. Farmers are getting only 15 % of needed supply and forced to cut crops. Last summer was very hot and humid, now it is in 80F and dry Santa Ana condition. I have to put on gallons of lotion and water plants every day. I have many fruit trees and flowers. It is not even high bills what kills us here. It is lifestyle, weather, rat race, traffic, low quality of education. Golfgal, you have my private e-mail. If you could give us your phone we could call you... I can give you mine

[SassyBelle]

Hello Swede in CA,

Here are a couple of independent sources that may help you figure out your budget. I am certain that your cost of living will be a lot lower in the Twin Cities. I strongly agree with Golfgal that our schools are far superior. Also, Twin Cities have a lot to offer for entertainment and recreation year around.

Cost of living: Compare prices in two cities - CNNMoney.com
Cost of Living comparison calculator

The Best of the Twin Cities | Mpls.St.Paul Magazine + mspmag.com

Oh, another thing: you will enjoy more sunny days in MN than in WA

[kuan]

We have ski racing here Swede. Minnesota has the highest high school nordic ski participation in the US.

[Clifford63]

Cost of living calculator posted earlier says cost of living in Metro MN vs Spokane is 20% higher. That sounds in line with reality to me, although I think income potential in metro MN is likely more than 20% higher depending on what you do for a living.

Spokane is in eastern washington, and is actually fairly sunny. MSP is not all that sunny, but sunny enough for me.

MSP is somewhat isolated, spokane is really isolated.
Spokane is a regional provider, but still small compared to a major metro
Both areas offer a lot of outdoor activities
MSP has a lot more entertainment options in terms of arts, sports, etc.
MSP has a diverse economy with many types of jobs, Spokane is more limmited.

I don't know how taxes shake out in Washington but you can ballpark MN as such
Income tax - 6.5%
Property tax - 1% of home value per year (varies by county and city)
Sales tax - 6.5%, but risint to 6.875 soon and some counties add another fraction on top of that, such as hennepin.

Schools - hard to say for sure, but I feel like anybody that takes an active role with learning in the family will do fine most anywhere.

I did a similar exercise a few years back. If I could live wherever I wanted, where would I go?? Very hard question for me.
My short list:
Yakima Valley in Washington State
Marin County in California
Costal South Carolina
Boise Idaho
Whitefish, Montana
Ely, MN

Ended up moving from Hennepin county to washington county and I like that decision so far. You can probably surmise from my list that I am a person that loves to spend time outside, and that does not need much in terms of entertainment venues.

[GIbornNBred]

I live in Spokane WA and we are out of here ! I meet allot of people here that feel the same way. The schools for my kids suck. Everyone here allot of the time seem too focus on cost of living which is great BUT the people here for the most part are mean , self centered and wannabees. And the Christian belief if any is gone. I have had my 3 elementary kids tortured because they don't have the right clothes or MP3 players. I pulled my oldest out of one middle school it was so bad. I love the scenery hands down. I hate the the fact we only get water in winter so gardening is out . I watered all summer long too no avail. And we are moving ourselves too southern MN. Don't just look at cost, look at the people and what you have too endure here. And I meet ALLOT of people here that feel the same way about Spokane.
We are outa here..............

[Aylalou]

I don't know much about Spokane but I love Seattle; however, I couldn't afford to live there and, after many trips to Seattle, I think the grass is not greener. Cost of heating depends on size of your house. I can't say enough about the Twin Cities which I have posted many times here. I live in St. Paul so let me say this: You already know the weather is cold in winter and winter lasts from November until April, though we have had only a dusting of snow and at the moment it's raining. St. Paul is a cozy city made up of individual neighborhoods. There is no urban sprawl, and both old and new suburbs are only minutes away The area is lush with foliage, lots of culture and very quiet and made for families. The Twin Cities have many beautiful lakes and parks. I would suggest you go online to see what you can get for your money in rentals or purchase of property.

[Haakon]

Originally Posted by Clifford63

Spokane is in eastern washington, and is actually fairly sunny. MSP is not all that sunny, but sunny enough for me.

Minneapolis has more sun than Spokane does. The entire pacific NW is very cloudy, especially in the winter which usually lasts from Oct - May.

Spokane Number of cloudy days / year
Clear: 86
Partly cloudy: 88
Cloudy: 191

Minneapolis Number of cloudy days / year
Clear: 95
Partly cloudy: 101
Cloudy: 169



Spokane:
https://pics2.city-data.com/w7/cld23316.png (broken link)

Minneapolis:
https://pics2.city-data.com/w7/cld11064.png (broken link)

[Clifford63]

Originally Posted by Haakon

Minneapolis has more sun than Spokane does. The entire pacific NW is very cloudy, especially in the winter which usually lasts from Oct - May.

Spokane Number of cloudy days / year
Clear: 86
Partly cloudy: 88
Cloudy: 191

Minneapolis Number of cloudy days / year
Clear: 95
Partly cloudy: 101
Cloudy: 169



Spokane:


Minneapolis:

OK, slight edge to MSP on sunny days per your chart, but they are pretty close overall. Point really was don't get Spokane mixed up with Seattle.