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You know what i want to know? Where is my party? Where can I vote for a leader who will eschew my values: Pro Gay Rights. Pro Choice. Anti Gun....and fiscally moderate/conservative. Find me that person and I will vote for them. Obama has been such a disappointment. I look at what we spend in taxes--imagine the next hike--and it makes me not want to spend one red dolllar. Trickle down does work, to some extent and if you declare war on the people who infuse the most cash into the economy, you do stall growth.
i think you'd find you have a lot in common with the concept of these protests. i'm not even so much "anti-gun", i'm just not "pro gun".
and i'm not sure who you define as the people who infuse the most cash into the economy. that's typically middle and lower class, because the higher tiers park most of their money away.
and even if someone has "succeeded" by someone else's definition. if their goal is to still acquire even more wealth for themselves, they are producing more for the economy and workers. a guy making 500k wants to make $1 million. well he will likely have to hire more workers, produce more stuff, develop new products, etc. etc. so it doesnt matter how much any individual has, thats just class warfare/jealousy.
or he might get to $1 million by firing workers and making less workers do more. producing more stuff with less expensive, lower quality items. outsourcing producing existing stuff to lower wage, unregulated, unsafe workplaces overseas. etc.
if every guy did what you use as an example, then i think you'd find less people angry.
It's been reported that nearly 50% of American households don't pay Federal taxes but get benefits. I have no problem paying my fair share and then some. My real estate taxes are close to $8000, and I have no children in the school system (School tax is over $5000).
As far as your sister making $20,000 as a full time public school teacher, she's getting ripped off. The average starting salary in NJ is about $40,000.
the number, first of all, has been all over the spectrum, from 40%, to 50%. and it's not "no federal taxes". it's "no federal income taxes". there's a difference.
your school taxes benefit the community, which helps your community and state be more productive.
i'm not sure where you're getting the average starting salary in NJ. i'm giving you an actual example. and she's making less than $20,000.
i work, and i get a little more than 3 weeks vacation. so i actually know quite a lot of people. i also know people in the NYC metro area that work full time jobs that are not 8am-5pm. I also know people who work in industries that you might work 6 months, and then you're off 6 months, but it's an odd schedule. I also know people who are in between jobs for a variety of reasons. Think outside the box a little. You don't have to be an unemployed loaf on welfare to be able to attend a protest.
50% stat is incorrect, but keep spouting it.
Of course the protestors are being used by the President. The fact that many of the protestors are pissed off that the President isn't doing what he said they would do, and many of them may not support him in his re-election proves that.
Who do you believe the "average american" is? Hate to break it to you, but the teachers, laborers, professionals, students, professors, unemployed, employed, etc...that are attending these protests, now in cities across the country, is the average american. Not the lobbyists, lawyers, and executives that line the politicians' pockets.
i do agree though, if the Unions get involved to the point where they control the message, the true message will be lost. That's why much of the comments from the (dis)organized protestors is saying that union members are welcome to join, but they will not be shaping the message. hopefully they can keep it that way, but I fear that they cannot.
From what some consider the left leaning Yahoo:
Nearly half of US households escape fed income tax - Yahoo! Finance (http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Nearly-half-of-US-households-apf-1105567323.html - broken link)
A snippet:
About 47 percent will pay no federal income taxes at all for 2009. Either their incomes were too low, or they qualified for enough credits, deductions and exemptions to eliminate their liability. That's according to projections by the Tax Policy Center, a Washington research organization.
I don't get 3 weeks vacation a year, and I spend vacation time with family, as do most people, and I still say the overwhelming majority of those protesters are either unemployed and college students.
And those people protesting? they'll vote for the President they voted for in 2008, the same President who was elected with the help of Wall St. Please tell me how many signs at the protest are against George Soros? how did George make his money? and how much did George make when the market crashed in 08? funny how I can't find that info anywhere.
Who do I consider the average American? I think they're the ones who take care of themselves, they don't gouge the public for their cushy retirements and health benefits, they don't envy people who have more than them, they have the desire to strive to make their lives the best they can, and they don't sit there with their hands out to their fellow Americans. They're the ones who voted in 2010, and they'll vote in greater numbers in 2012.
Nearly half of US households escape fed income tax - Yahoo! Finance (http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Nearly-half-of-US-households-apf-1105567323.html - broken link)
A snippet:
About 47 percent will pay no federal income taxes at all for 2009. Either their incomes were too low, or they qualified for enough credits, deductions and exemptions to eliminate their liability. That's according to projections by the Tax Policy Center, a Washington research organization.
I don't get 3 weeks vacation a year, and I spend vacation time with family, as do most people, and I still say the overwhelming majority of those protesters are either unemployed and college students.
And those people protesting? they'll vote for the President they voted for in 2008, the same President who was elected with the help of Wall St. Please tell me how many signs at the protest are against George Soros? how did George make his money? and how much did George make when the market crashed in 08? funny how I can't find that info anywhere.
Who do I consider the average American? I think they're the ones who take care of themselves, they don't gouge the public for their cushy retirements and health benefits, they don't envy people who have more than them, they have the desire to strive to make their lives the best they can, and they don't sit there with their hands out to their fellow Americans. They're the ones who voted in 2010, and they'll vote in greater numbers in 2012.
Yahoo wrote the article. The Tax Policy Center created the substance for the article.
I'm sorry you don't get 3 weeks. And some people would love to spend the time with their family, and I do, but I also use some of my free time for greater causes than just spending time with my family. Ever think some people may sacrafice what they want to do, so that they can improve things for their next generation? I sure as heck will do it if it means saving the future of our country so that my children can have a better life.
i don't think you understand that Obama got the support of a lot of people because of what he said he would do. Many of those people might stay home because he's not doing it. Many might vote for someone else, not Rick Perry, but a 3rd party candidate. Some may vote for the Republican candidate if he/she is centrist (think John Huntsman).
why do protestors have to protest Soros because he made money off financial trading? Any of us that have a 401k have made money, so we can't protest greed? what is Soros doing with his money?
the average americans you just described voted in 2008 too, and are out protesting right now. sorry to tell you.
or he might get to $1 million by firing workers and making less workers do more. producing more stuff with less expensive, lower quality items. outsourcing producing existing stuff to lower wage, unregulated, unsafe workplaces overseas. etc.
if every guy did what you use as an example, then i think you'd find less people angry.
and no, it's not class welfare.
class warfare and jealousy is exactly what it is. people are jealous of what some people have, so they want it taken from them.
or he might get to $1 million by firing workers and making less workers do more. producing more stuff with less expensive, lower quality items. outsourcing producing existing stuff to lower wage, unregulated, unsafe workplaces overseas. etc.
if every guy did what you use as an example, then i think you'd find less people angry.
and no, it's not class welfare.
Spoken like someone who has never been around that environment....
How about this real life example:
I know a lower middle class boy who studied hard, went to a top Ivy, and works super hard and has produced oodles of money for his company.......
.....and that someone pays so much in taxes, that the specter of more tax raises have absolutely impeded spending habits on things such as hired help, a new home, new cars and general goods and service.....
.....and I will tell you what he says, which I am sure you will agree with--- which is he doesn't need the crap....and he doesn't. There is a wide separation between want and need.
....but you multiply his actions by X, and you see part of the economic problem we are having because his money is going to taxes, and the bank and not back into the economy.....
The kicker is the other day this uber intelligent, productive guy started thinking it may be better if he retired, moved to a lower cost state, bought a small home and lived off his savings.....
This brilliant guy thinks he may be better served by a less stressful (and read productive) lifestyle because of the inherent bias that he sees against success---bias that is evident in the economic policies and current socio economic climate. That...and he is tired. It's hard to be self motivating and draining to be on the go---and if we don't reward, folks won't do it!
High earners are top producers and they are the very people who fuel our economic engine. They are the CEOS and they are the small business owners..... Redistributing the fruits of their labors is no way to drive GROWTH.
Tax the guys living off their savings who have a gazillion tax shelters and no work income but let's stop demonizing the people whose ideas, instincts and leadership produce.
class warfare and jealousy is exactly what it is. people are jealous of what some people have, so they want it taken from them.
no. that might be true for some people. but for the most part, people want a tax code that is followed, not one that is manipulated to benefit some people. wanting people to pay the rates that were paid in 1999 instead of in 2011 is not class warfare and it's not jealousy. it's not about taking it from them. sorry.
wanting people to pay the rates that were paid in 1999 instead of in 2011 is not class warfare and it's not jealousy.
even if i agreed with that, we know that if we just made that change it wont be nearly enough. so those people who theoreticallty want that, they will want a lot more than that.
Yahoo wrote the article. The Tax Policy Center created the substance for the article.
I'm sorry you don't get 3 weeks. And some people would love to spend the time with their family, and I do, but I also use some of my free time for greater causes than just spending time with my family. Ever think some people may sacrafice what they want to do, so that they can improve things for their next generation? I sure as heck will do it if it means saving the future of our country so that my children can have a better life.
i don't think you understand that Obama got the support of a lot of people because of what he said he would do. Many of those people might stay home because he's not doing it. Many might vote for someone else, not Rick Perry, but a 3rd party candidate. Some may vote for the Republican candidate if he/she is centrist (think John Huntsman).
why do protestors have to protest Soros because he made money off financial trading? Any of us that have a 401k have made money, so we can't protest greed? what is Soros doing with his money?
the average americans you just described voted in 2008 too, and are out protesting right now. sorry to tell you.
also, i've posted this elsewhere already, and don't remember the #s off the top of my head, but some of the people in that "47%" number quoted include people that make over $1m, and people that make over $500,000, and other high income people that have paid no income taxes.
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