NJ Minimum Wage Bill (Tenafly, Alpine: middle-class, apartment, health insurance)
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Let me start since I started the thread. As a progressively-minded individual, I definitely support higher wages for low income workers. I feel that more should be done to lift greater numbers of people out of poverty. The growing gap between the haves and have-nots concerns me...this will led to even greater polarization than we have now should this be allowed to continue over time. You do not have to agree with me, but history has shown such societies to be much less stable than more egalitarian ones.
Since I am wheelchair-bound, I have a home health care worker providing me assistance. Yes, it is a job that does not require much skill. However, she works on 9 dollars an hour, above what the minimum wage is and could be raised to. However, supporting a teenage daughter has forced her to work two jobs without health insurance for herself! I do not know if this labels her below the poverty line; I did not do the calculations. However, I do know she is run-down from long hours, can not afford proper medical care or an apartment in a safe neighborhood. Hence, I would ideally like to see the minimum wage of at least 12 dollars an hour.
Now...I may be able to see the other side. If businesses are subject to such labor restrictions, I could see how many will not want to be created in New Jersey; if NJ has a higher minimum wage than other states. Isn't that what has happened to our heavy industries? If I could hire 15 workers in India for less than the price of 1 American worker, why not set up shop in India? I know the whole issue of globalization and US jobs going overseas is not that simple. I did read Thomas Friedman's bestseller "The World is Flat." There are many other factors involved than just minimum wage policies. However, let's just try to apply part of that theory on a state-by-state (NJ versus other states) basis. Would minimum wage laws really discourage companies from setting up shop here and expanding if we jacked up the minimum wage more (or perhaps much more)? These companies may not go overseas but they could go to other states. I am not an Economist, so I do not know. I think with something as complicated as economics, multitudes of factors need to be take into consideration. However, if the minimum wage bill goes to a referendum next year, the average voter will not be going through multitudes of potential factors in making a decision. So what am I trying to say? I just do not know what else to say or how else to approach the issue...economists is just not my field, but it is a very important issue for so many workers and the greater good of our society. People like my home health worker are indeed better off now than being homeless on the street! However, it does not mean that this is still not an acceptable standard of living for her. So obviously, we have a problem that has to be raised, but is this a correct way (minimum wage legislation) to even become at least marginally helpful?
The government has no business setting wages, minimum or otherwise. There is no such thing as a "living wage". Nor should there be. Wages should be set by private consensual agreement between the job provider and the potential employee. Freedom, as usual, is the best option, and the moral option. Government imposed minimum wages are a constructive confiscation of private property.
Let me start since I started the thread. As a progressively-minded individual, I definitely support higher wages for low income workers. I feel that more should be done to lift greater numbers of people out of poverty. The growing gap between the haves and have-nots concerns me...this will led to even greater polarization than we have now should this be allowed to continue over time. You do not have to agree with me, but history has shown such societies to be much less stable than more egalitarian ones.
Since I am wheelchair-bound, I have a home health care worker providing me assistance. Yes, it is a job that does not require much skill. However, she works on 9 dollars an hour, above what the minimum wage is and could be raised to. However, supporting a teenage daughter has forced her to work two jobs without health insurance for herself! I do not know if this labels her below the poverty line; I did not do the calculations. However, I do know she is run-down from long hours, can not afford proper medical care or an apartment in a safe neighborhood. Hence, I would ideally like to see the minimum wage of at least 12 dollars an hour.
Now...I may be able to see the other side. If businesses are subject to such labor restrictions, I could see how many will not want to be created in New Jersey; if NJ has a higher minimum wage than other states. Isn't that what has happened to our heavy industries? If I could hire 15 workers in India for less than the price of 1 American worker, why not set up shop in India? I know the whole issue of globalization and US jobs going overseas is not that simple. I did read Thomas Friedman's bestseller "The World is Flat." There are many other factors involved than just minimum wage policies. However, let's just try to apply part of that theory on a state-by-state (NJ versus other states) basis. Would minimum wage laws really discourage companies from setting up shop here and expanding if we jacked up the minimum wage more (or perhaps much more)? These companies may not go overseas but they could go to other states. I am not an Economist, so I do not know. I think with something as complicated as economics, multitudes of factors need to be take into consideration. However, if the minimum wage bill goes to a referendum next year, the average voter will not be going through multitudes of potential factors in making a decision. So what am I trying to say? I just do not know what else to say or how else to approach the issue...economists is just not my field, but it is a very important issue for so many workers and the greater good of our society. People like my home health worker are indeed better off now than being homeless on the street! However, it does not mean that this is still not an acceptable standard of living for her. So obviously, we have a problem that has to be raised, but is this a correct way (minimum wage legislation) to even become at least marginally helpful?
There is no gap between the haves and the have-nots. There are no haves and have-nots. This is not an intelligent concept. There is you. And there is what you have. If what you have is not enough for you, it is YOUR PROBLEM and will require YOUR SOLUTION, depending upon your talent, energy, and drive.
Keep it simple. Keep it free. Poverty is a personal problem. Society should do NOTHING for the poor. Being poor is a personal choice. It should be easily remedied by making intelligent personal decisions to make oneself more valuable to other people. By being more valuable, you will have more stuff. By being less valuable, you should have less stuff. It's a simple, rational, and moral equation. Without victims, and without compulsion.
I'm not in favor of the higher minimum wage because it'll be counterproductive, but that comment was just some straight-up, asinine Randian bull****. Everyone gets dealt a different hand in life, and there are quite a few folks who play there cards wrong; but some were just dealt a 7 and 2.
I'm not in favor of the higher minimum wage because it'll be counterproductive, but that comment was just some straight-up, asinine Randian bull****. Everyone gets dealt a different hand in life, and there are quite a few folks who play there cards wrong; but some were just dealt a 7 and 2.
And many times I have taken down a nice pot with 72o. It's not the hand your dealt, it's how you play it.
In any case, no matter what hand you are dealt, you never have a right to steal the pot and run out of the casino.
Living in Bergen County, NJ- Anything under 40k, for a single person, is struggling ... it's a tough state. I'm in college, and can't wait to graduate. I couldn't do it without the help from my family - I'd be homeless.
My #1 focus is to move far away from here once I graduate college. It's outrageously expensive. I work hard. I'm a Certified Nursing Assistant by day, taking care of mentally insane, and sick, and a college student by night, 4x a week night. 2 more years, and I'm done. Every time I feel like I'm getting down, and losing inspiration, or I have to dig deep for gas money, I remind myself, "2 more years and I'm out of this damn state- the struggle is making me succeed".
I'm lucky, I have no kids, and I have no debt~ other than school loans beginning 6-months after I graduate. I see girls with 4 kids/4 men who live on government assistance. And, the only good thing is, they get schooling free because of their situation.
I'm going into healthcare so in 2 more years I'll be able to get a job anywhere I want, and again, it will NOT be here. Never. Ever. Not even a 2nd thought.
I was an Executive Assistant for almost 20 years for a military command manufacturing company and was downsized 3 years ago. I vowed never to return to corporate and instead, return to college for nursing. It has not been an easy road, but I refuse to give up. I'm far from lazy. I work at a giant hospital in Bergen County and took over a 50% paycut - I struggle. And, the hospital I work at has a great reputation, however, they're cheap to their low-level employees. I'm loyal. I'm focused. I'm devoted. I've been told, "I wish I could give you a raise, but if anyone found out, it wouldn't sit well". I go above and beyond, in patient care, and customer service, and it doesn't matter. I'm a smart girl, but working where I work looks good on my resume so I stay till I graduate.
People shouldn't be so harsh and judgmental. They should turn that harsh eye on themselves. It speaks volumes, really. And, far from a good way .... alarming.
Every situation is different ... the minimum wage in NJ is far from fair- far. It's painfully, alarmingly shocking, and unsettling. I am confident middle-class|wealthy NJ'ians could not live on a minimum wage salary for 2 months if they tried. And, this would have to mean giving up that big bank account/atm withdrawls.
No one should have to struggle, and stress where their next meal will come from.
I have a friend who owns a body shop in Tenafly. He cries struggling all the time - he has a customer who tries to negotiate a discount every month and drives a 'Bently'. I tell him everytime the discussion comes up, "You own a business in Tenafly, you live in Alpine, and you're complaing. Your customer drives a Bently and wants a discount". What's wrong with this picture ???
Pathetic. Painfully sickening pathetic. Get a clue ! Sorry, my liberal side is surfacing.
Last edited by ImCurlybelle; 12-08-2012 at 09:58 PM..
I was an Executive Assistant for almost 20 years for a military command manufacturing company and was downsized 3 years ago. I vowed never to return to corporate and instead, return to college for nursing. It has not been an easy road, but I refuse to give up. I'm far from lazy. I work at a giant hospital in Bergen County and took over a 50% paycut - I struggle. And, the hospital I work at has a great reputation, however, they're cheap to their low-level employees. I'm loyal. I'm focused. I'm devoted. I've been told, "I wish I could give you a raise, but if anyone found out, it wouldn't sit well". I go above and beyond, in patient care, and customer service, and it doesn't matter. I'm a smart girl, but working where I work looks good on my resume so I stay till I graduate.
People shouldn't be so harsh and judgmental. They should turn that harsh eye on themselves. It speaks volumes, really. And, far from a good way .... alarming.
Every situation is different ... the minimum wage in NJ is far from fair- far. It's painfully, alarmingly shocking, and unsettling. I am confident middle-class|wealthy NJ'ians could not live on a minimum wage salary for 2 months if they tried. And, this would have to mean giving up that big bank account/atm withdrawls.
No one should have to struggle, and stress where their next meal will come from.
I have a friend who owns a body shop in Tenafly. He cries struggling all the time - he has a customer who tries to negotiate a discount every month and drives a 'Bently'. I tell him everytime the discussion comes up, "You own a business in Tenafly, you live in Alpine, and you're complaing. Your customer drives a Bently and wants a discount". What's wrong with this picture ???
Pathetic. Painfully sickening pathetic. Get a clue ! Sorry, my liberal side is surfacing.
Rubbish. Struggling for your next meal makes the world go round, and drives us to excellence. Every animal on the face of the Earth faces this struggle. It is the Natural Order.
And what, your solution to eliminating this "struggle" is enslaving everyone around you? Telling them they have to pay others enough for people to live comfortably, whatever that means, or go to jail?
What is "harsh" is you telling someone else what to be paid and what to pay others. Not only harsh, but also tyrannical, unjust, and evil. So if you ask your government to do that for you, you are making a huge mistake.
If you don't like your circumstances, change them. If you can't change them, endure them. But never seek to circumvent them by victimizing others. That can never be right.
this is a tough one ,i agree with both marc and curly
one thing is for certain ,not everyone gets the same opportunities at well paid jobs even though they both have the same qualifications
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