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Listen teachers in NJ need to be paid high salaries only because the cost of living. Hell if houses and the rest were cheap we would have no need to pay teachers 50k+!
Other states pay less for their teachers but and this is one big BUTT! The cost of living is wayyy less. I am sure any teacher in NJ would be willing to accept 30 if the cost of living was say equal to North Carolina.
Regarding school funding I am sorry to break it to you but the majority of states fund their school systems and DO NOT pass on the cost to the municipalities. This is not a right or left issue. Its just the fact. I am not sure why people blast me on this. Has to be purely politics. Again other states do it and they pay their teacher a fair salary relative to the cost of living. WE ONLY pay high municipal taxes because Trenton has squandered away soo much of the revenue in the past and not used it properly. This in turn pits municipal employees vs taxpayers. We are all being taken advantage of and this system is just broke. Look past politics for a second and realize NJ's system is to blame for your high taxes, not teachers or abbott.
That's what I was saying. You're correct. The funding formula certainly needs to be reformed, among many other things.
Having just read this thread about school funding I decided to look at where I live now compared to NJ. Using a bankrate calculator cost of living comparison to where I live now versus where I lived in NJ is that it costs 42% more to live in NJ. However, the town I used to live in NJ costs aprox 70% more to educate a child than where I live now. About 70% of the funding for the school's where I live now is from local property taxes versus 100% in NJ. However, average property taxes and income taxes are substantially less where I live now.
Someone mentioned a Vat Tax: A VAT Tax and Sales Tax are Regressive Forms of Taxation that impact those with lower incomes much more than those with higher incomes.
And if I'm not mistaken there are plenty of towns getting quite a bit of money to fund education from the state. There are a number of communities according to NJ's 2009-2010 projected aid receiving more than 10K per pupil which includes equalized, transportation, special education, security and adjustment aid.
One more thing if I'm not mistaken the income tax was enacted to provide property tax relief to the citizens of NJ and its tax take is supposed to be used for that purpose. However, not only have property taxes increased so have income taxes.
CHL208 said "One more thing if I'm not mistaken the income tax was enacted to provide property tax relief to the citizens of NJ and its tax take is supposed to be used for that purpose. However, not only have property taxes increased so have income taxes."
That is what is wrong with our gov't. When a tax or fee is added to the expense of the taxpayer by the gov't intended to be used for a particular thing, it should be used for just that. No switching I'll collect pension money but I'll use it to start property tax rebates. Pension money goes to pension. I watched NJ legislature discuss Christie's budget with the Lt. Gov. A Paterson assembly women asked about fees that were being collected for an application were suppose to be used to archive information. The Lt. Gov stated she liked the program but she just couldn't fund it the money isn't there. The money is there, the Paterson assembly woman said, the fees are still being collected and the taxpayer is being mislead into believing the money is going towards what it is suppose to. Collect the fees, collect the taxes, if you started income tax and money was suppose to be used for schools that is the place it goes, same with casinos wasn't that suppose to help education. Collect the money put it into appropriate account. When things are good there is a surplus to pay for when things are not good. If a new program needs to be started you have to find a way to fund it and that funding stays and is only used for that fund. No more jiggling money around.
CHL208 said "One more thing if I'm not mistaken the income tax was enacted to provide property tax relief to the citizens of NJ and its tax take is supposed to be used for that purpose. However, not only have property taxes increased so have income taxes."
That is what is wrong with our gov't. When a tax or fee is added to the expense of the taxpayer by the gov't intended to be used for a particular thing, it should be used for just that. No switching I'll collect pension money but I'll use it to start property tax rebates. Pension money goes to pension. I watched NJ legislature discuss Christie's budget with the Lt. Gov. A Paterson assembly women asked about fees that were being collected for an application were suppose to be used to archive information. The Lt. Gov stated she liked the program but she just couldn't fund it the money isn't there. The money is there, the Paterson assembly woman said, the fees are still being collected and the taxpayer is being mislead into believing the money is going towards what it is suppose to. Collect the fees, collect the taxes, if you started income tax and money was suppose to be used for schools that is the place it goes, same with casinos wasn't that suppose to help education. Collect the money put it into appropriate account. When things are good there is a surplus to pay for when things are not good. If a new program needs to be started you have to find a way to fund it and that funding stays and is only used for that fund. No more jiggling money around.
Money is fungible. Operations that can be self funded by user fees or payments should be divested into non profits (like the post office) so that the government can't use them as a source of funds when they want extra revenue.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHL208
Having just read this thread about school funding I decided to look at where I live now compared to NJ. Using a bankrate calculator cost of living comparison to where I live now versus where I lived in NJ is that it costs 42% more to live in NJ. However, the town I used to live in NJ costs aprox 70% more to educate a child than where I live now. About 70% of the funding for the school's where I live now is from local property taxes versus 100% in NJ. However, average property taxes and income taxes are substantially less where I live now.
Someone mentioned a Vat Tax: A VAT Tax and Sales Tax are Regressive Forms of Taxation that impact those with lower incomes much more than those with higher incomes.
And if I'm not mistaken there are plenty of towns getting quite a bit of money to fund education from the state. There are a number of communities according to NJ's 2009-2010 projected aid receiving more than 10K per pupil which includes equalized, transportation, special education, security and adjustment aid.
One more thing if I'm not mistaken the income tax was enacted to provide property tax relief to the citizens of NJ and its tax take is supposed to be used for that purpose. However, not only have property taxes increased so have income taxes.
While I agree that a VAT tax is not a good thing, I remember when the sales tax was enacted & when the income tax was enacted. Both had a specific purpose. As a result of a series of, in my opinion, bad decisions by the state supreme court, culminating with the creation of the Abbott districts, the money goes into a pot & gets doled out for purposes other than the reason that the taxes were intended. This has resulted in towns continuing to rely on property taxes, as if the other taxes were never enacted.
By the 1980s, people in the southern counties were so fed up with their taxes being redirected to the northern counties that a movement started to withdrawl from New Jersey & form a 51st state, South Jersey. A question was on the ballot to that effect & when the polititians in Trenton realized what was going on, they got the state supreme court to declare it illegal based on the US law (enacted after the Civil War) that is is illegal for a state to withdraw from the union. The question was removed from the ballots. There seemed to be a lull for a while, but since the Abbott decision, & Christie Whitman's tax cut, which primarily benefitted the wealthy, it seems to be out of control. Blaming the problems on the unions or people working as civil servants or teachers is simply misdirecting people's attention. The system of collecting & dispersing taxes is the problem.
While I agree that a VAT tax is not a good thing, I remember when the sales tax was enacted & when the income tax was enacted. Both had a specific purpose. As a result of a series of, in my opinion, bad decisions by the state supreme court, culminating with the creation of the Abbott districts, the money goes into a pot & gets doled out for purposes other than the reason that the taxes were intended. This has resulted in towns continuing to rely on property taxes, as if the other taxes were never enacted.
By the 1980s, people in the southern counties were so fed up with their taxes being redirected to the northern counties that a movement started to withdrawl from New Jersey & form a 51st state, South Jersey. A question was on the ballot to that effect & when the polititians in Trenton realized what was going on, they got the state supreme court to declare it illegal based on the US law (enacted after the Civil War) that is is illegal for a state to withdraw from the union. The question was removed from the ballots. There seemed to be a lull for a while, but since the Abbott decision, & Christie Whitman's tax cut, which primarily benefitted the wealthy, it seems to be out of control. Blaming the problems on the unions or people working as civil servants or teachers is simply misdirecting people's attention. The system of collecting & dispersing taxes is the problem.
Again, money is fungible.
Suppose you give Iran 2 million to build a hospital. Iran then cuts its health budget by 2 million and diverts money to their nuclear program. Not only did you just fund their nuclear program, you're also the bad guy if you pull the funding, because you're blamed for taking away that money (they're not going to pull that money back from their nuclear program -- they've got political cover to let their hospitals suffer, and blame you for it)
Much the same applies here. When the aid became available, it was horribly misallocated (to the most poorly run districts, who bloated up their payrolls). When the money is pulled, those districts have political cover to keep their corrupt and bloated payrolls and pull it from where it will hurt.
One can't truly claim the income tax isn't going to state aid -- the two numbers -- income tax revenue and state aid -- are about the same (both around 10B). What happens is that the recipients of that aid kept their property taxes at the same level and spend the aid as they saw fit.
Taxes always generally have always been enacted for a specific purpose, yet the funds are always diverted. That's the way government works unfortunately. Everyone in NJ is getting nailed with taxes. There has been no incentive for the government to tighten its purse strings and to get rid of the excess in the system.
I can only remember 1 superintendent for 2 high schools and 12 elementary schools when I was in school( NJ school).How do I become a superintendent? I really want this job.
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