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I've been in both of those situations, and I just didn't go out to group dinners at that time.
That is fine if you choose how to do it. Life has a funny way of being unpredictable, sometimes that refrigerator breaks after you've already accepted an invite.
For the most part I really haven't had very many issues with check splitting. I did tell my sister once ahead of time that I was planning to get separate checks after her boyfriend, in my opinion, had been quite piggish with ordering more than what he ended up paying for on a couple of occasions.
I think it is silly to think that every time I accept a dinner invite that I should hypothetically be ready to shell out $20 more than what the actual price of my dinner is.
hahahaha! I won't get into it here. Let's just say people were VERY defensive of their pooping in public.
I should publish my own "TracySam's Book of Etiquette." Not so much to tell people how to do things, just to show how many of us are raised with odd "rules" drummed into our heads.
Examples:
ALWAYS offer to pick up the check at a restaurant.
ALWAYS say "no, don't be silly" if the other person tries to pick up the check.
ALWAYS offer gas money.
NEVER accept offered gas money.
NEVER poop in public bathrooms, or in other people's homes (acute intestinal distress due to food poisoning or dysentery is the exception).
NEVER show up at someone's gathering empty-handed.
If you are the one throwing a party, ALWAYS insist that people take some extras or leftovers home.
NEVER agree to take leftovers home after a party, even if the person insists.
If someone invites you to a party, ALWAYS ask, "can I bring anything?"
If you are throwing a party, and a guest asks "can I bring anything?" ALWAYS say "Of course not, just bring yourself."
If you are to be a guest at a party and you asked if you can bring anything, and the host said "of course not, just bring yourself" you'd BETTER bring something anyway. Never show up empty-handed.
If you are giving a host/hostess wine as a gift, not to be served at the party, wrap it in a gift bag, with ribbon, etc.
If you are bringing wine to a party and you'd like it to be opend and served, don't put it in a gift bag.
If you are throwing a party and a guest brings an unwrapped bottle of wine, make sure it gets opened to be served at the party.
If you bring wine to a party and you wanted it to be served, and the host doesn't open it, you can feel resentful and complain about it on anonymous message boards, but don't say anything to the host. Pooping in their bathroom is not an appropriate expression of your dissatisfaction.
You are a gracious lady and I'm sure a friend I would appreciate, because I abide by those same rules. It's called common courtesies, manners, and class.
hahahaha! I won't get into it here. Let's just say people were VERY defensive of their pooping in public.
I should publish my own "TracySam's Book of Etiquette." Not so much to tell people how to do things, just to show how many of us are raised with odd "rules" drummed into our heads.
Examples:
ALWAYS offer to pick up the check at a restaurant.
ALWAYS say "no, don't be silly" if the other person tries to pick up the check.
Sorry, but if I'm out with 8-12 people, which is usually the case if I'm eating in a restaurant, I'm not picking up a tab for that many people. No way in hell. I'm paying my potion and that's it.
Quote:
ALWAYS offer gas money.
NEVER accept offered gas money.
I've never experienced any kind of dispute or even discussion over gas money among friends. I've never offered it and it has never been offered to me.
Quote:
NEVER poop in public bathrooms, or in other people's homes (acute intestinal distress due to food poisoning or dysentery is the exception).
Oh please. That's what bathrooms are for.
Quote:
NEVER show up at someone's gathering empty-handed.
Even when their culture takes offense at you bringing something?
Quote:
If you are the one throwing a party, ALWAYS insist that people take some extras or leftovers home.
Oh gawd, I HATE that. I hate people trying to cram their stupid leftovers down my throat because they don't want to take up all the fridge space with them. No thank you, and I mean it.
Quote:
NEVER agree to take leftovers home after a party, even if the person insists.
Then what's the point of insisting? It's utterly absurd and a stupid waste of time. If you know you're going to insist and they're going to refuse, why bother? Just throw the leftovers out and shut up about it.
Quote:
If someone invites you to a party, ALWAYS ask, "can I bring anything?"
If you are throwing a party, and a guest asks "can I bring anything?" ALWAYS say "Of course not, just bring yourself."
Oh please. I tell people "sure, bring something if you don't like what's being served." I also encourage people with dietary restrictions or food allergies to bring their own if that's what they're comfortable with.
Quote:
If you are to be a guest at a party and you asked if you can bring anything, and the host said "of course not, just bring yourself" you'd BETTER bring something anyway. Never show up empty-handed.
And what happens if someone shows up at your door empty-handed? Do you show them this printed list of rules for being TracySam's friend?
Quote:
If you are giving a host/hostess wine as a gift, not to be served at the party, wrap it in a gift bag, with ribbon, etc.
Oh gawd. Not all of us have a Martha Stewart-esque gift wrapping station in our houses, and a lot of us consider wine bags to be wasteful both financially and in terms of environmental damage. Just take the bottle of wine, say thank you, and shut up.
Quote:
If you are bringing wine to a party and you'd like it to be opend and served, don't put it in a gift bag.
Geez, your rules are so complicated...is there an app for them?
Quote:
If you are throwing a party and a guest brings an unwrapped bottle of wine, make sure it gets opened to be served at the party.
Yes, drunk-driving laws be damned! Let's open it just to open it even if everyone's already had as much as they can handle, then be stupidly wasteful and pour it down the drain because nobody wanted any but the rules said you HAD to open it because it didn't come with a ribbon tied around it.
Quote:
If you bring wine to a party and you wanted it to be served, and the host doesn't open it, you can feel resentful and complain about it on anonymous message boards, but don't say anything to the host. Pooping in their bathroom is not an appropriate expression of your dissatisfaction.
Yes it is. I'd love to poop in your bathroom.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Debsi
That's too many unwritten rules for me, Tracy.
Me too. I wonder if she prints off this list and distributes it to her friends, tucked into her Christmas cards?
It's not a list of rules for being my friend. It's the list of rules of etiquette that I was raised with, and that I follow. Sure I recognize that others have different "rules," but I just feel that be be "proper" I abide by these rules, and whether I speak up or not, inside, I feel people are improper when they do the opposite of these rules.
If someone I know belongs to some culture in which bringing something to the host is "offensive" and I bring something, not knowing that, then they should be as understanding of my beliefs as you are saying I need to be of their beliefs.
I did not mean I'd offer to pick up a check for a whole bunch of people all this time, but if it's me and a friend, I always offer, and if it's my partner and me, and another couple, we always offer. If I'm out with co-workers of an equal level, then I expect we will split evenly, or I get it this time, you get it next time, etc. If I'm out with my subordinates, or people not in my dept by at a lower level in the company, I always try to pick up the whole check. I don't want some person earning 30,000, or whose job might depend on my decisions to feel like the need to follow a "rule" with a person at my level who might have power over them.
Regarding the gas money thing, it usually doesn't some up among my friends & me wither. But with co-workers driving together to a big meeting or a conference 30 miles away, it certainly will be an issue. It also came up with my good friend and I when we took a road trip together and used my car. I was putting 200 miles on my car, so of course, I thought it appropriate that she offer to chip in for gas. But of course, I politely refused.
I still could never bring myself to poop in someone's house where I am a dinner guest! I'm surprised more people don't find this offensive and uncouth. It's akin to picking one's nose at the dinner table.
You are a gracious lady and I'm sure a friend I would appreciate, because I abide by those same rules. It's called common courtesies, manners, and class.
What's it called when you imply that people raised with different values and etiquette rules than yours are classless and rude?
With some things, I would not label a prson totally classless and rude, but just recognize that they are different, or maybe their parents didn't know any better, so could not teach them any better. Inside I might determine a person is rude or has poor manners, but I would not be likely to say anything. But some things, like the doing #2 in a person's home, are just downright disgusting, and to me, "rude" is the only conclusion I can draw (unless they have a disease of course, but in such a case, that person would have perfected the double-flush-followed-by-air-freshener techniques).
It's not a list of rules for being my friend. It's the list of rules of etiquette that I was raised with, and that I follow. Sure I recognize that others have different "rules," but I just feel that be be "proper" I abide by these rules, and whether I speak up or not, inside, I feel people are improper when they do the opposite of these rules.
If someone I know belongs to some culture in which bringing something to the host is "offensive" and I bring something, not knowing that, then they should be as understanding of my beliefs as you are saying I need to be of their beliefs.
Personally I think you need to ease up. You seem really tightly wound and hung up on rules that you think everyone else knows...then you allow yourself to get upset when other people don't follow them.
Quote:
I did not mean I'd offer to pick up a check for a whole bunch of people all this time, but if it's me and a friend, I always offer, and if it's my partner and me, and another couple, we always offer. If I'm out with co-workers of an equal level, then I expect we will split evenly, or I get it this time, you get it next time, etc. If I'm out with my subordinates, or people not in my dept by at a lower level in the company, I always try to pick up the whole check. I don't want some person earning 30,000, or whose job might depend on my decisions to feel like the need to follow a "rule" with a person at my level who might have power over them.
In my office unless it's a corporate event (which is made clear beforehand), we always pick up our own tabs. I don't do even splits with anyone unless we ordered something of an equal price. "Halvsies" is stupid, someone always ends up losing, and that person is usually me. So I don't do that. If you have a problem with it, that's your hangup...not mine.
Quote:
Regarding the gas money thing, it usually doesn't some up among my friends & me wither. But with co-workers driving together to a big meeting or a conference 30 miles away, it certainly will be an issue. It also came up with my good friend and I when we took a road trip together and used my car. I was putting 200 miles on my car, so of course, I thought it appropriate that she offer to chip in for gas. But of course, I politely refused.
Oh, but of COURSE...we wouldn't want to appear less than perfect at any time, would we? When I drive somewhere for my job, I'm compensated by the company for the gas/mileage used, so I don't have to pass the hat for gas money.
Quote:
I still could never bring myself to poop in someone's house where I am a dinner guest! I'm surprised more people don't find this offensive and uncouth. It's akin to picking one's nose at the dinner table.
That's your opinion. Personally as a host I think it's rude and uncouth to expect someone to hold a deucer just because I think it's inappropriate for them to take a dump in the only room in the house designated specifically for that activity. But that's just me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TracySam
With some things, I would not label a prson totally classless and rude, but just recognize that they are different, or maybe their parents didn't know any better, so could not teach them any better. Inside I might determine a person is rude or has poor manners, but I would not be likely to say anything. But some things, like the doing #2 in a person's home, are just downright disgusting, and to me, "rude" is the only conclusion I can draw (unless they have a disease of course, but in such a case, that person would have perfected the double-flush-followed-by-air-freshener techniques).
Wow...IMHO that is pretty condescending. Speaking personally, I was raised to find such condescending snobbery to be rude and unattractive.
You know what would solve this? Inviting people over at a time AFTER dinner, for coffee and croissants and pastry and some wine (very European) and a movie. That's a little cheaper than a restaurant. Or maybe even inviting people over for a huge pot of homemade soup or stew with bread and butter (again, very European), and they bring dessert. I'm thinking of trying that again. I used to do that when I lived in Europe, where it is done routinely (people inviting people over for anything and everything, I mean). Then the others would also invite you over.
Well, we'll just have to agree to not eat out together, or invite each other over! No worries, we can't all agree on everything.
(Regarding the travel reimbursement for work, we work for a non-profit, so those of us at Director level and above don't put in for mileage reimbursement, so there will be more inteh bucket for the lower level staff. I just throw it into my unreimbursed work expenses when I do my tax return.)
Last edited by Tracysherm; 06-20-2012 at 12:05 PM..
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