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The Irish Catholic Community I referred to is the one here in the US. Lot of alcoholics. And as I said, there's a kernel of truth in many stereotypes. And I don't think it's anywhere near the same thing as making stereotypes about traditionally very highly persecuted ethnic groups, such as blacks or Hispanics. The "Irish" still enjoy white privilege.
Have you ever read Angela's Ashes by Frank McCourt?
It's a memoir by a NYC high school teacher and playwright about growing up poor in Ireland.
"On Sunday mornings in Limerick I watch them go to church, the Protestants,
and I feel sorry for them, especially the girls, who are so lovely, they
have such beautiful white teeth. I feel sorry for the beautiful Protestant
girls, they're doomed. That's what the priests tell us. Outside the Catholic
Church there is no salvation. Outside the Catholic Church there is nothing
but doom. And I want to save them. Protestant girl, come with me to the True
Church. You'll be saved and you won't have the doom.
After Mass on Sunday I go with my friend Billy Campbell to watch them play croquet on the lovely
lawn beside their church on Barrington Street. Croquet is a Protestant game.
They hit the ball with the mallet, pock and pock again, and laugh. I wonder
how they can laugh or don't they even know they're doomed? I feel sorry for
them and I say, Billy, what's the use of playing croquet when you're doomed?
He says, Frankie what's the use of not playing croquet when you're doomed?"
Sometimes I feel like if one more person tells me about their Irish, Scottish, Cherokee or "Descended from English royalty" heritage, I think I will scream.
Why can't some of these Americans just accept that they are broadly European descent, or mixed, and that their nationality is American? Why do they have to claim a culture or heritage that isn't rightly theirs? Elizabeth Warren is the worst example, there are many others.
Maybe you'll like this one better. My great-grandfather's wife died, leaving him with three teenage daughters. He then married an eighteen-year-old and they came to New Jersey to live. Had ten more kids with the second wife, one of whom was my grandfather.
But my sister, the family genealogist, could only find a record on the ship of the passage of my g-grandmother and her three stepdaughters. He wasn't on the boat.
Turns out that just before they left Holland, he assaulted a coworker and did six months in jail. His wife and daughters went ahead to America without him, and he caught up with them later.
Maybe you'll like this one better. My great-grandfather's wife died, leaving him with three teenage daughters. He then married an eighteen-year-old and they came to New Jersey to live. Had ten more kids with the second wife, one of whom was my grandfather.
But my sister, the family genealogist, could only find a record on the ship of the passage of my g-grandmother and her three stepdaughters. He wasn't on the boat.
Turns out that just before they left Holland, he assaulted a coworker and did six months in jail. His wife and daughters went ahead to America without him, and he caught up with them later.
We're proud Americans descended from a criminal!
Wow. That's quite a story. How did your sister find out that info?
I have a couple of friends who are always pointing out that they are Irish Catholic. I am not although I am a Christian.
I had a college roommate like this. He never set foot in a church during the school year (unlike me, who went and goes every Sunday)...yet he constantly pointed out his ethnic/religious background. I never would.
Maybe some people or some cultures just are into themselves more than others. Let it go.
Angela's Ashes. But I read a book about a poor family in the English county of Lancashire and it was very similar. Father was an alcoholic, mother kept the family together as well as she could, working in the mills, mending clothes, knitting mittens and hats for the kids. And as a treat they got broken bisquits (cookies) once in a while. The mother baked and sold the good bisquits.
My grandparents came from the mills in the north of England where people were worked like slaves, very sad stories from that era and place. They never spoke of it, that's how bad it was.
Yet I had an Irish American scream at me for how "I" treated her ancestors. And when I was a kid my "Irish" friend used to tell me that I would go to Hell because I wasn't Catholic and how it was too bad I couldn't get to wear medals and things that she did because I wasn't Catholic.
I don't even think people should mention their religion. Mention it at church to other church members but there are good reasons why we usually don't discuss politics and religion. It usually just breeds hurt and resentment.
Angela's Ashes. But I read a book about a poor family in the English county of Lancashire and it was very similar. Father was an alcoholic, mother kept the family together as well as she could, working in the mills, mending clothes, knitting mittens and hats for the kids. And as a treat they got broken bisquits (cookies) once in a while. The mother baked and sold the good bisquits.
My grandparents came from the mills in the north of England where people were worked like slaves, very sad stories from that era and place. They never spoke of it, that's how bad it was.
Yet I had an Irish American scream at me for how "I" treated her ancestors. And when I was a kid my "Irish" friend used to tell me that I would go to Hell because I wasn't Catholic and how it was too bad I couldn't get to wear medals and things that she did because I wasn't Catholic.
I don't even think people should mention their religion. Mention it at church to other church members but there are good reasons why we usually don't discuss politics and religion. It usually just breeds hurt and resentment.
I agree with all of that. My father's sister married an Irish-Scottish Catholic. My aunt had to sign something stating that she would raise her children Catholic, and my mother could not be her maid of honor because she was Protestant.
My cousins were raised in the Catholic church and went to Catholic elementary school and HS. They are nice people now - but as children, they constantly told us we were going to Hell. I mean all the time. They couldn't sleep over on a Saturday night because the next day was church. I mean Mass. They couldn't attend our church or Sunday school. even as visitors, because it wasn't "The True Church" or "Real Communion". They weren't bigoted. They were honestly afraid for our souls.
Today, I don't think there is one practicing Catholic among them.
Some of my people came from the North of England also. Not a nice place, I am told. I would be VERY interested in reading that book.
Could you tell me it's name, In New England? I would enjoy reading it.
Wow. That's quite a story. How did your sister find out that info?
She's a genealogy nut. She's already exhausted our entire family and done most of the in-laws, too. Plus the relatives on the other side of relatives; for example, she has traced my daughter's father's family, who go back to the 17th century in Maine.
In this case, she has made friends with a woman in the Netherlands who was once married to some distant relative of ours over there. They met via Ancestry, I guess, and started emailing. That woman knew this info about our great-grandfather from her own research.
She's a genealogy nut. She's already exhausted our entire family and done most of the in-laws, too. Plus the relatives on the other side of relatives; for example, she has traced my daughter's father's family, who go back to the 17th century in Maine.
In this case, she has made friends with a woman in the Netherlands who was once married to some distant relative of ours over there. They met via Ancestry, I guess, and started emailing. That woman knew this info about our great-grandfather from her own research.
Wow. That is amazing (the emailing with the person in the Netherlands who actually knew stuff.
I have tried a few times to do a little research and always come up short.
I think genealogy takes a certain talent. You are very lucky to have her as a resource.
I have some relatives I would like to do detective work on (illegitimate child, etc.)
Sometimes I feel like if one more person tells me about their Irish, Scottish, Cherokee or "Descended from English royalty" heritage, I think I will scream.
Why can't some of these Americans just accept that they are broadly European descent, or mixed, and that their nationality is American? Why do they have to claim a culture or heritage that isn't rightly theirs? Elizabeth Warren is the worst example, there are many others.
How is it you know what their heritage or culture is or isn't? I'll agree with you regarding Elizabeth Warren...it's pretty clear she doesn't actually have N/A blood. But she's a public figure, and that's how we know about HER. But how is it you know about all these other people? How do you know it's not rightly theirs?
Are you mixing up heritage and nationality?
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