2011 NoVa SAT Scores (Damascus: houses, schools, universities)

[brooklynborndad]

[quote=JEB77;20908454]I don't think there's any proven correlation between SAT scores and whether a school has an IB program. It's actually the other argument that is typically made here - namely, that IB schools in NoVa tend to have lower SAT scores. The scores are correlated more strongly with the income levels of the families whose students attend these schools than with IB/AP programs per se.

[quote]

er, that was my point. Many of the IB schools have lower income levels than neighboring FCPS schools (I dont know how it works in other NoVa jurisdictions with IB). That may be to encourage diversity of variety kinds. I've heard in the GT center context (where its sols at issue, not sats) that its an attempt also to raise average test scores at the lower performing schools.

[JD984]

er, that was my point. Many of the IB schools have lower income levels than neighboring FCPS schools (I dont know how it works in other NoVa jurisdictions with IB). That may be to encourage diversity of variety kinds. I've heard in the GT center context (where its sols at issue, not sats) that its an attempt also to raise average test scores at the lower performing schools.

Well, if that's your point, I'm skeptical that it makes much of an impact. Schools with IB programs may pull in some high-scoring students from neighboring schools who want to pursue that program (programme?), but they also lose students who prefer AP courses to other schools. Maybe it keeps some in-boundary kids at the schools who otherwise would have gone private or moved.

[brooklynborndad]

Originally Posted by JEB77

Well, if that's your point, I'm skeptical that it makes much of an impact. Schools with IB programs may pull in some high-scoring students from neighboring schools who want to pursue that program (programme?), but they also lose students who prefer AP courses to other schools.

mebbe. I know we thought of the IB program as an alternative to _____ if DD had not wanted STEM, more than as an alternative to AP, but I am sure others view it differently.

[JD984]

Originally Posted by brooklynborndad

well duh. The college board is the org that administers the tests. Its their business.

You are correct some schools dont pay much attention to the writing portion. In fact some schools say that they pay ZERO attention to it. They use the essay, and grades in classes that involve writing instead, as they did before the writing portion was instituted. There are real, and good, questions, about the ability of the conditions of the SAT test to say anything valid about writing ability.

The more selective colleges generally only look at the SAT in general as one portion of the application.

The point was, and is, not lost on me that the College Board has a vested interest in touting the significance of SATs, just as it does with the AP tests that it administers and the IB organization in Geneva does with the IB examinations and diploma.

Different schools may or may not view these scores as significant. Some schools don't even require the submission of SAT scores. Others require the submission of SAT scores, but don't pay attention to the Writing component or the results of some AP examinations.

You began your post with the polite expression "well, duh." That made me think that you must have misplaced your thoughtful post (could it have only been yesterday?) in another thread encouraging posters not to be excessively argumentative with one another. To borrow a favored acronym ("IMHO"), some of your posts might be received more cordially if a higher percentage of your Os were indeed H.

[brooklynborndad]

Originally Posted by JEB77

You began your post with the polite expression "well, duh."

While I dont think of "well duh" as particularly argumentative, I can see where on the net, and without emoticons to soften it, it could be seen as condescending. I have therefore edited that post to be more gracious. Thank you for pointing out a tone that in retrospect, I did not intend.


You are of course correct that there are a wide range of college policies with respect to scores. However IIUC (and I have been knee deep in this recently) the selective colleges that do not require submission of SAT or ACT at all are few and far between, the ones that disregard the writing portion of the SAT are many (possibly the majority).

[looktowindward]

Originally Posted by JEB77

The College Board ascribes significance to all three tests and suggests that a combined score of 1550 serves as a benchmark of college readiness. However, some schools don't pay much attention to the writing portion.

There is skepticism of the writing portion due to the subjective grading, and some studies indicating that there are some ways to "game" that portion of the exam (i.e. write a longer essay)

[khuntrevor]

JMU does not use the writing part, nor the SAT II. They also say you better be qualified before the extracurriculars matter, at all.

BTW, doesn't it seem odd that the easiest way to boost a school's score, would be to discourage certain students from taking it? And then there are schools where every student takes it.

[hilsmom]

Huh, I always wished I could have combined my SAT II (I think they were called something else when I took them) scores, as my English and Math SAT II scores were higher than my SAT I (just called SAT then) scores were.

I do know that my college looked at my SAT II scores for class placement. I placed into some higher level classes for English, Math and French based on those.

It is so obvious that the socioeconomics of these districts are at play here. We don't have Langley money, so we can't live in Langley district. Such is life. I think it is telling how many of the Fairfax County HS's (sorry, didn't look at the rest - I'm sure it applies across NoVA) consistently score well above the national average. I'm not going to stress that we can't afford to live in the highest scoring HS district in this County. We still get to live in an area where we are both gainfully employed and our daughter has access to wonderful educational resources.

[CAVA1990]

Originally Posted by hilsmom

It is so obvious that the socioeconomics of these districts are at play here. We don't have Langley money, so we can't live in Langley district. Such is life. I think it is telling how many of the Fairfax County HS's (sorry, didn't look at the rest - I'm sure it applies across NoVA) consistently score well above the national average. I'm not going to stress that we can't afford to live in the highest scoring HS district in this County. We still get to live in an area where we are both gainfully employed and our daughter has access to wonderful educational resources.

Well considering colleges admit you based on how you score and not all the other kids in the school, it's somewhat irrelevant what the average score is as far as a child's chances of getting into college. I doubt a given child would have scored any higher had they gone to Langley versus any other FFX high school. My kids went to relatively low scoring high schools and did very well on the SATs, one outscoring the TJ average. Many of their friend's did the same. The average score of a school relative to others within the same district is more a reflection of the mix of kids there than the quality of education offered.

[hilsmom]

Originally Posted by CAVA1990

Well considering colleges admit you based on how you score and not all the other kids in the school, it's somewhat irrelevant what the average score is as far as a child's chances of getting into college. I doubt a given child would have scored any higher had they gone to Langley versus any other FFX high school. My kids went to relatively low scoring high schools and did very well on the SATs, one outscoring the TJ average. Many of their friend's did the same. The average score of a school relative to others within the same district is more a reflection of the mix of kids there than the quality of education offered.

this was kind of MY point. The average score of a particular HS really doesn't matter when the entire district (and area) does quite well. It is all a reflection of the wealth of this area in general. And in the end, how YOUR child does is all that matters.

SAT scores are really just bragging rights in the end - but sadly, people use these as a reason why NOT to buy in a particular HS district.