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You should spend some time on redfin before you make such blanket statements...
Watch out everyone, we have a baller over here.
Hahaha, 13500 a month = rich now? Based on that stupid super zip study thats the median income of my zip code. Keep it classy Westchester. PS if you actually had money you would have moved into the city where real estate values have been retained as they have in NOVA because the job markets are strong and have been strong for college educated people (those who purchase homes).
When other areas were dipping 30 or 40%, all of my friends and family in Fairfax who had purchased in the mid-2000s retained their value within 10% of peak. So your idea that there is no value retained is ignorant of the reality that land value is directly correlated to job market.
PS don't make me post the list of major companies that have nothing to do with federal anything that also call fairfax, and not Winchester, Goochland, Danville, or any other "tax haven county of the GOP" home in this state.
Mars? Hilton? Capital One? Amazon Web? AOL before they reconciled to NYC (which last I checked has far greater tax rates), do you really want me to keep going because just looking at the top 1000 largest list there are dozens of examples.
For every Booz or Northrup, there is a Microstrategy, Custom Ink, and VW
Well, this seems to have devoled into a pissing contest, but I will say that in my limited experience, I think the reverse is more likely true. I did my undergrad work at Longwood University, in good old Farmville, VA, and the differences can be pretty stark. Folks were generally nice, and I made good friends from all parts of the state...but yeah, definite differences.
You know the whole joke about women going to college for their MRS degree? Well, I first heard that joke at Longwood, and I have to tell you, of all the women I met, the more acheivement driven, careerist types almost always were from NOVA, the greater Va Beach area, or another city like Richmond or Roanoke. The MRS types were usually from the more rural areas.
Also, the whole thing about putting your car up on massive tires so you could go off-roading or "muddin" as they called it...yeah, didn't see any of that where I grew up.
Last, and a personal point of amusement, I had a variety of clothing, including khakis, nice shirts, even a sweater or two for the winter. This is not the usual style of dress, although in fairness, college kids in general tend to be a bit more slovenly than the general population. Several guys I knew from rural areas was convinced I was gay because I occasionally dressed nicely, had close female friends I wasn't actively looking to get into the sack, and preferred to drink nicer beers than Milwaukee's Best. It wasn't until they discovered I was dating women that they were pining over before they realized that was just who I was.
And for what it's worth, my wife is from the Va. Beach area. I dated women from different areas of the state, but the worldview of rural girls was just too narrow for me. I'm using just one as an example, but her idea of a perfect life was a small house and with a white picket fence, kids, and growing plants and making homemade curative stuff; being a housewife. I did not meet one single woman from more urbanized areas who had such small goals.
I'm kind of going off the rails here with what this thread was supposed to be about, but that's my take. I have generally found that it isnt' really NOVA vs. ROVA, it's NOVA + the I-95-I-64 corridors vs. the rest of the state. Richmond may consider themselves southern but they have more in common with us than they do with Lynchburg, whether they like it or not. Va. Beach would fit right in up here.
I may not have the same vitriol as TysonsEngineer, but he's right to a degree. If the state was split in two along generally accepted economic/social lines, one state would thrive economically, the other would be broke. Maybe some of ROVA's vitriol (and it does exist) is because they hate being dependant on NOVA's taxes. I've certainly heard NOVA folks say what TysonsEngineer has said, and they've put it even less nicely, so it isn't like we're saints up here.
Hahaha, 13500 a month = rich now? Based on that stupid super zip study thats the median income of my zip code.
I think it's the top 8% of the country, so, not too shabby. Plus I work from home in my pajamas.
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Keep it classy Westchester. PS if you actually had money you would have moved into the city where real estate values have been retained as they have in NOVA because the job markets are strong and have been strong for college educated people (those who purchase homes).
When I used to work in Manhattan on site (thus necessitating living close by) I made more than I do now. I accepted slightly lower pay for a chance to move away from NY and settle down as I wasn't keen on shelling out 800k for a starter home in Westchester. I was drooling over the low prices in NoVa on Zillow, and the property tax rates? Some were only like 6k a year! They start at 13k in Westchester.
After some research and drive downs though we decided Roanoke was for us and I live like a king here.
I'm glad I passed on Loudon and Fairfax because the higher cost of living and stress does not confer any real net compensation for it....Westchester taught me that real quick.
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When other areas were dipping 30 or 40%, all of my friends and family in Fairfax who had purchased in the mid-2000s retained their value within 10% of peak. So your idea that there is no value retained is ignorant of the reality that land value is directly correlated to job market.
And if the federal government ever stops growing at the rate of a malignant tumor, that retained value will plummet like a stone in the ocean and you know it. Because when that goes, well...why live there?
"Your" (since it relies on redistribution of tax dollars it's not really yours) municipal prosperity is directly tied to the federal government. Hence all that bitching about the big scawwy "shutdown" that meant two weeks paid vacation...the horror.
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PS don't make me post the list of major companies that have nothing to do with federal anything that also call fairfax, and not Winchester, Goochland, Danville, or any other "tax haven county of the GOP" home in this state.
Washington is eventually gonna run out of other peoples money and when it does see how long they stick around. I've moved around a lot (military, college, work and some adventuring) and there is nothing unique about NOVA except its proximity to DC.
You could plop NoVa into Long Island or Bergen county NJ and it wouldn't stand out a bit. Just the way it is.
I think it's the top 8% of the country, so, not too shabby. Plus I work from home in my pajamas.
When I used to work in Manhattan on site (thus necessitating living close by) I made more than I do now. I accepted slightly lower pay for a chance to move away from NY and settle down as I wasn't keen on shelling out 800k for a starter home in Westchester. I was drooling over the low prices in NoVa on Zillow, and the property tax rates? Some were only like 6k a year! They start at 13k in Westchester.
After some research and drive downs though we decided Roanoke was for us and I live like a king here.
I'm glad I passed on Loudon and Fairfax because the higher cost of living and stress does not confer any real net compensation for it....Westchester taught me that real quick.
And if the federal government ever stops growing at the rate of a malignant tumor, that retained value will plummet like a stone in the ocean and you know it. Because when that goes, well...why live there?
"Your" (since it relies on redistribution of tax dollars it's not really yours) municipal prosperity is directly tied to the federal government. Hence all that bitching about the big scawwy "shutdown" that meant two weeks paid vacation...the horror.
Washington is eventually gonna run out of other peoples money and when it does see how long they stick around. I've moved around a lot (military, college, work and some adventuring) and there is nothing unique about NOVA except its proximity to DC.
You could plop NoVa into Long Island or Bergen county NJ and it wouldn't stand out a bit. Just the way it is.
And Roanoke is really a strong business center.
Head:Sand
200,000 post-graduates seem to disagree with you. And if there was industry I'd like as the center point of a city, it'd be the government that leads the free world... as opposed to ya know... coal. Either way, you still ignore the several billion dollar companies that have chosen Fairfax as their home, instead of North Carolina, or Central VA (the tax havens)
Agree to disagree, or rather, agree that you are completely wrong. Your arguments depend on GOP talking points disproven by empirical evidence. Your own comments about places in Long Island or NJ point to the fact that BLUE states are where companies are.
PS your 800K starter home in Westchester is the exact same price as a standard starter home around the beltway in good school districts in Fairfax.
To create price range by lumping Loudoun and Fairfax together is like saying I'm looking for a home between a 2br condo and a 6br mcmansion.
Enjoy Roanoke; don't you have your own subforum to pester?
I suggest you worry more about the placement of your own head; it must make it very difficult to sit down.
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200,000 post-graduates seem to disagree with you. And if there was industry I'd like as the center point of a city, it'd be the government that leads the free world... as opposed to ya know... coal. Either way, you still ignore the several billion dollar companies that have chosen Fairfax as their home, instead of North Carolina, or Central VA (the tax havens)
Coal? Healthcare and education are the biggest thing here. Coal is further west. And the government that leads the free world does so on how many borrowed dollars? NOVA was a backwater until massive government spending started during the Cold War. Again, you cannot separate the two nor deny that NOVA is utterly dependent on federal spending.
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Agree to disagree, or rather, agree that you are completely wrong. Your arguments depend on GOP talking points disproven by empirical evidence. Your own comments about places in Long Island or NJ point to the fact that BLUE states are where companies are.
Oh sweet baby Republican Jesus.
I meant the blandness and rat race mentality of NOVA would let it fit right in in NY or NJ. Seriously, plop Fairfax into Nassau county, Rockland county or Bergen county and the locals would not notice.
It wasn't praise; it was an insult. Excellent reading comprehension being taught in your schools I see (disclaimer: also not praise).
Check that head location again.
NY and NJ hemorrhaged jobs like a blown femoral artery; the middle class is on deaths door there.
Very typical blue state economics indeed.
Even the "Wall Street" companies have largely decamped for those evil red states.
Technology made NYC and its myriad expenses and regulations redundant.
Due to crippling taxation and cost of living not commensurate with quality of life many people have been moving south and west.
I remember when I got my moving estimate one morning the guy said we were his 11th young couple that day (all the others were going to Florida or the Carolinas).
You can wax poetic about "blue states" as much as you like but trying operating a business, owning a home, or raising a family in one. God help you should you dare for all three.
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PS your 800K starter home in Westchester is the exact same price as a standard starter home around the beltway in good school districts in Fairfax.
That's not even remotely close to what I saw. And this was at the bottom of the crash in 2010. Many decent Loudoun/Fairfax homes were in the 350k range with an avg yearly tax burden of around 6k while Westchester never dipped much below 800k.
I know this must be very distressing for you, since you apparently place the entire worth of an area on how much money it has, but Fairfax is still the minor leagues kiddo.
Now Fairfax CT? Thats a ritzy place.
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To create price range by lumping Loudoun and Fairfax together is like saying I'm looking for a home between a 2br condo and a 6br mcmansion.
They seemed similar in demographics, cost, and infrastructure to me.
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Enjoy Roanoke; don't you have your own subforum to pester?
But I enjoy your completely warranted sense of superiority washing over my shoeless bumpkin inbred self.
Your impeccable reading comprehension alone reminds me of my woefully inferior New York education where I majored in sister-humping and meth lab maintenance.
I know this must be very distressing for you, since you apparently place the entire worth of an area on how much money it has, but Fairfax is still the minor leagues kiddo.
Now Fairfax CT? Thats a ritzy place.
I don't really have a dog in this fight, I stated my observations earlier and let it go. I'll say this much though, there are plenty of ritzy mansions around here, though the inner burbs do tend more towards clustered McMansions. Still, I'm fairly certain that those Forbes articles about wealthy zip codes routinely include more of the addresses around here than they do around New York City.
However, I'm seen pictures of some of the stately, centuries old homes up in New York, and I'll admit those look pretty freaking awesome.
I'm still wondering why this is a fight. This reminds me, in hindsight, of all the various fights, prank wars, occasional fist fights, and the like that went on between McLean and Langley when I was going to McLean for high school. It's really just a fight between who is really well off, and who is really, REALLY, well off.
I thought the argument was supposed to be NOVA vs. ROVA. I'm pretty sure Westchester kicks ROVA's ass too
I suggest you worry more about the placement of your own head; it must make it very difficult to sit down.
Coal? Healthcare and education are the biggest thing here. Coal is further west. And the government that leads the free world does so on how many borrowed dollars? NOVA was a backwater until massive government spending started during the Cold War. Again, you cannot separate the two nor deny that NOVA is utterly dependent on federal spending.
Oh sweet baby Republican Jesus.
I meant the blandness and rat race mentality of NOVA would let it fit right in in NY or NJ. Seriously, plop Fairfax into Nassau county, Rockland county or Bergen county and the locals would not notice.
It wasn't praise; it was an insult. Excellent reading comprehension being taught in your schools I see (disclaimer: also not praise).
Check that head location again.
NY and NJ hemorrhaged jobs like a blown femoral artery; the middle class is on deaths door there.
Very typical blue state economics indeed.
Even the "Wall Street" companies have largely decamped for those evil red states.
Technology made NYC and its myriad expenses and regulations redundant.
Due to crippling taxation and cost of living not commensurate with quality of life many people have been moving south and west.
I remember when I got my moving estimate one morning the guy said we were his 11th young couple that day (all the others were going to Florida or the Carolinas).
You can wax poetic about "blue states" as much as you like but trying operating a business, owning a home, or raising a family in one. God help you should you dare for all three.
That's not even remotely close to what I saw. And this was at the bottom of the crash in 2010. Many decent Loudoun/Fairfax homes were in the 350k range with an avg yearly tax burden of around 6k while Westchester never dipped much below 800k.
I know this must be very distressing for you, since you apparently place the entire worth of an area on how much money it has, but Fairfax is still the minor leagues kiddo.
Now Fairfax CT? Thats a ritzy place.
They seemed similar in demographics, cost, and infrastructure to me.
But I enjoy your completely warranted sense of superiority washing over my shoeless bumpkin inbred self.
Your impeccable reading comprehension alone reminds me of my woefully inferior New York education where I majored in sister-humping and meth lab maintenance.
I don't really have a dog in this fight, I stated my observations earlier and let it go. I'll say this much though, there are plenty of ritzy mansions around here, though the inner burbs do tend more towards clustered McMansions. Still, I'm fairly certain that those Forbes articles about wealthy zip codes routinely include more of the addresses around here than they do around New York City.
However, I'm seen pictures of some of the stately, centuries old homes up in New York, and I'll admit those look pretty freaking awesome.
I'm still wondering why this is a fight. This reminds me, in hindsight, of all the various fights, prank wars, occasional fist fights, and the like that went on between McLean and Langley when I was going to McLean for high school. It's really just a fight between who is really well off, and who is really, REALLY, well off.
I thought the argument was supposed to be NOVA vs. ROVA. I'm pretty sure Westchester kicks ROVA's ass too
I don't disagree, but this guy is plain old mislead when he says things like real estate in Loudoun is comparable to real estate in Fairfax in price; to the point I wonder if he could spot the two on a map. Not to mention he thinks that cities in the Northeast are becoming weaker economically, which is so laughable it hurts. Perhaps he should check out the starting price for a 1br in NYC, Boston, or Washington DC. Seems like people are paying significant amounts of money to live in a place that is hurting economically.
At its heart is the problem in the ROVA to NOVA comparison
No matter what statistics, facts, and evidence shows that NOVA is economically better off (or cities are doing better than exurban areas) the contrarians make excuses like "well if this was like this then". If NYC wasn't on prime real estate with so many major corporations located within it, then it would totally be worthless. Hell if Palo Alto wasn't full of smart people, it'd just be a hill in the middle of a fault line right? Whats anything worth, unless it has commodities underneath it right? Cause tangible goods are the only measure of a locations economic capability.
Kotkin go home.
Last edited by tysonsengineer; 11-12-2013 at 02:48 PM..
Whether you call NoVa a tumor or an 800-pound gorilla, we're calling the shots in elections these days. If the urban and urbanizing parts of the state joined forces, it would make for a very interesting change in state politics (and the NoVa/RoVa distinction might get even less attention).
I don't want respect, I want my tax money back and for ROVA to stop calling NOVA the "socialists". Conservative parts of this state could make a lot of headway with me if they did the conservative thing and ended the archaic, overarching, and blanket tax laws of our commonwealth
Oh please, if you want to talk about carpetbaggery, NOVA takes the cake. While states that actually produce things (Illinois, New York, Texas) get less than what they put in for federal income taxes, Virginia gets a whooping $1.51 per $1 paid in Federal incomes. No one is shedding a tear when the citizens of Fairfax cry poor mouth.
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Originally Posted by tysonsengineer
When other areas were dipping 30 or 40%, all of my friends and family in Fairfax who had purchased in the mid-2000s retained their value within 10% of peak.
So you're still 10% underwater on an overpriced house. Congratulations.
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