Same-sex marriage recognized in Oregon (public schools, colleges, camps)

[FVWinters]

Originally Posted by rdickers

I think "gay" marriage will ulitmately drive down the number of hetero marriages, possibly ending them.

Nah. There are too many of us who are straight for any significant decrease in heterosexual marriages and there is no chance whatever they will ultimately end. I simply do not see any impact allowing "gay" marriages will have on straight ones.

Originally Posted by rdickers

I don't have to prove anything. I said ultimately, not right now. Culturally, it will change society as clearly as did awarding welfare benefits only to single moms.

You demonstrate the difficulty of conducting a rational discussion of the subject.

There has been little if any cultural change regarding awarding welfare bennies to single moms. The number of single mommies on welfare is small enough in proportion to the general population of those receiving welfare benefits that there has been little - if any - real impact.
Likewise, I do not think an across the board legalization of homosexual marriage will change our basic culture enough to notice. Not when you consider that only about 3 to 12 percent of us (depending on which source you want to reference) are gay.

[BLAZER PROPHET]

I wonder the next steps....

Already legal scholars have stated that poly relationships now have legal authority to marry. That's pretty erotic, actually. But what about marrying animals or objects?

[rdickers]

I do not have to furnish evidence for what I think. You are just looking for an argument.

[tijlover]

I believe in equal opportunity for everyone, the equal opportunity to mess up one's life, irretrievably, with marriage!

Congrats to Oregon!

Originally Posted by BLAZER PROPHET

I wonder the next steps....

Already legal scholars have stated that poly relationships now have legal authority to marry. That's pretty erotic, actually. But what about marrying animals or objects?

If you can find an animal or object that is capable of giving consent to enter into a contract, then knock yourself out. Until then, that argument is a completely ridiculous non-starter.

Originally Posted by rdickers

I do not have to furnish evidence for what I think. You are just looking for an argument.

Of course you don't have to provide evidence. The fact that people who oppose equal rights can't come up with a reality-based argument against it is why you lose in the courts and are losing in the court of public opinion, too. Ridiculous speculation without any evidence, it turns out, does not make for a very compelling argument for denying people equal rights.

Why not just say that you don't think gay people should have access to the same civil institutions as straight people and be done with it? Making up absurd arguments about how straight marriage will collapse or people will be lining up to marry their cars and pet goats does nothing but make the anti-equality side look desperate and absurd.

[rdickers]

Homosexuality is abnormal! Now that is a statement that ought to excite some of you. It is a statement that is based on a life of experiences that is now approaching 80 years. Responses from the "Gay" community only serve to reinforce the credibility of the statement.
Many years ago, psychiatrists ruled that homosexuality was not a medical disorder. We've also learned it is not a genetic disorder. However, it is a behavior and character abnormality, and as diffcult as it is for those impacted by the abnormality to accept, the fact remains nonetheless. If those who possess the abnormality want to get married, I really don't care. If they want to claim their relationship is equal to a heterosexual marriage that is okay too. However to flaunt the lifestyle in bizarre fashions such as parades seen in San Francisco and elsewhere I find objectionable. They only reinforce my initial statement, as do the highly charged responses to any words that may question the lifestyle, which many call a deathstyle. No such discussions are permitted in the extended media because of attacks from within the gay community which advertisers, businesses and individuals cannot withstand or are unwilling to take the heat. While demanding one right, you intimidate and shut out the rights of others. It is shameful conduct to say the least.
To further claim that homosexual marriage will not diminish the sanctity of heterosexual marriage is to not understand human behavior, or to deliberately not understand the obvious for the sake of attacking someone who disagrees with you. For every action there is a reaction; for every consequence there is an unintended consequence. Time will ultimately show that truth is on my side, and claiming otherwise without facts is pointless. I'm merely making a prediction and only time can prove me wrong or you right.
I'm sure I will be ableto add to this as differing views are presented.

[Silverfall]

Originally Posted by rdickers

I think "gay" marriage will ulitmately drive down the number of hetero marriages, possibly ending them.

Naw...gay marriage won't drive down hetero marriages. A changing culture that doesn't see or value marriage will drive it down. Many kids grew up with divorces. I think the cultural acceptance of living together while not married will become much more the norm. I think eventually, those that get married will be in the minority.

There is no sanctity in marriage when people cheat or divorce and remarry constantly. Hetereos ruined the sanctity of marriage all on their own. Gays just want equal rights to do the same.

I feel sad for anyone that brings up marrying a dog or a couch in the same thought process as equal rights. I always feel bad for people that are passionate about an issue but unable to create a coherent argument to present their side.

Originally Posted by rdickers

However to flaunt the lifestyle in bizarre fashions such as parades seen in San Francisco and elsewhere I find objectionable.

Eh...I find it objectionable that a few men wear sheets with eye cutouts and pointy hats. They still get to do it.

I find it objectionable that Lady Gaga wore a meat dress. She still got to do it.

I find it objectionable that Bjork wears some freaky clothes, but she still gets to do it.

That is the part that makes the US great, right? Someone gets to be free to be themselves and dress in any way they so desire, as long as they are not nude, and have that be okay. You sound like you need to learn to make peace with the fact that people have the right to not be like you, and maintain the right to exist and be equal in our country.

It is why God gave you the ability to roll your eyes...for such situations. I suggest you practice your eye roll, and just move on and let people be whom they want to be.

Originally Posted by rdickers

by demanding one right, you intimidate and shut out the rights of others.

No, your rights aren't shut out. Any church is welcome to set restrictions on marriage. The Catholic church does. Equal rights for gays doesn't impact the Catholic church's restrictions or policies. Once the US made civil marriage a legal act, and not just a religious act it became an issue of equality. So what you need to do is to petition your congress representatives and ask them to repeal civil marriage as a legal act for everyone. Tell them it is all Massachusetts fault because they started requiring marriage licenses in 1639.

See? Easy peasy.

[Minervah]

Well, now, there are those who think that monogamous marriage as we know it is not the "norm." These are scientists. So who's to say what is, what isn't? So maybe the end of the institution of marriage as we know it today is a good thing and Oregon is right there as usual on the cutting edge.

Monogamy: Who needs it? - CNN.com

[rdickers]

Lefties have an agenda. Getting acceptance of same sex-marriages is but a fingernail in a hand full of agenda items aimed at ending capitalism, destroying Christianity, usurping the US Constitution and installing a Socialist or Communist government, with government being the new religion and Washington DC the new church. They, as a group, deny any of the former, and claim they only want to redistribuite the fruits from the land of the plenty that are held by so few. As an old combatant in this war, I've seen and heard all the arguments from the left, many on display in this forum, other news media and from many products out of the public schools. I like to call it "Gramscification" of America because it makes people who care a bit about what I'm saying to look up Antonio Gramsci on their computer. It is his philosophy that was adoped by the Communist Party USA as a way to revolutionize America without a civil war. In the simplest of term, it aims to destroy the Judeo/Christian moral structure of America from within. Among other things, it calls into question what is right and wrong and what is good and bad about America. It muddles black and white to create gray. It is the geneses of the common word "whatever" used by so many younger people today. It is either, I don't know enough to have an opinion, or I may offend someone if I do. The psychologists call it creating "cognitive dissonance". So far, the left has been very successful with one of their own now occupying the highest office in the land. Denigrate all that once was and promise a better and greater future with more free stuff; food, medicine, drugs, housing, education and more to come. Paint a Utopian future that is difficult to argue against when the foundation has been carefully laid for generations by the lefties controlling the schools, colleges, Hollywood and the media and by governmnet itself. It's also not ironic that what is going on almost exactly matches the agenda of the NEA. It is online as well. Remember DARE, the drug awareness program? A thirty year old program, now mostly discredited. It taught the young people how to safely use drugs. The result today, leagalized Marijuana. Not the end game by any means. The left will not stop until many more drugs are legalized, and punishment for non-compliance with other drug rules will be legislated away. No problem, be happy!Sex education? Same thing. Teach all the little kids how because the educators said, they're going to do it anyway. Now 20 million cases a year of STD's and climbing. Over 10 million cases are among young teenagers. Don't worry about getting pregnant. We have condoms with school colors on them, mouth dams for those who chose Clinton sex, free to anyone in grade 8 or above. Make a mistake and get pregnant, we have a plan for that too: Just abort them; mommy and daddy don't even need to know. Homosexual sex? Why not? Not a problem! But do watch out for those STD's and AIDS, though. Send those who disagree to the re-education camps. What are those? Public schools, of course! Bullying? Don't worry about that. We will make all speech offensive to someone in order to silence those evil people who want to control our thoughts and actions. Porn? You want porn? Just turn on the TV, or get a movie on demand. No problem. Damaging to the youth? Nah! Heck, the're already educated on all that stuff, including the drugs, brought to you by public education. History of America? Make it all bad. Destroy pride in the country; just look at what the old White Men did to the Indians, and Slavery, Wars, Atom Bombs. Make the kids ashamed of their heritage. Make "under God" an offensive phrase. Education? Add on to both ends of traditional school because schools need more indoctrination time. There is no time left for STEM after all those other agenda items. Make education so confusing and divided that every kid needs a separate plan and teacher. Cost? Don't worry about cost, there is enough money if only the government would confiscate it. Make education free for everyone. Bankrupt the country, it is evil anyway! Yeah! What about fossil fuels? Destroy them before they destroy the earth! How will you heat your home? The government will do it because they said they would and we trust them. Earth is sacred, stop anyone who want to scratch it. It is much more that just same sex marriage. That is but one fingernail that has become a fist in my lifetime, that is being used to pound out the traditions that made America great, and to gag or label those who oppose them as Tea Baggers, racists, homphobes, right wing extremists, terrorists and pick your own. Think I'm wrong? You say you don't see it in your local schools? Check on Common Core, brought to you by the US DOE; one curriculum for all from the Central Church of DC, with the religion enforced by tests. If not fully implemented it will be, because generations have been prepped by the Gramsci followers through public education, the factory of change in America.

[jjpop]

Ho hum. Same diatribes, different day.