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I do know some states are removing philosophical exemptions, only religious or health are options in certain states and I think this will become more widespread. Good.
There is no scientific evidence that vaccines are inherently dangerous. Sure it is overwhelming for parents who have little knowledge or education in the fields of science or medicine, but there is much information out there, people just need to learn how to differentiate science from bunk.
There are over 19,000 scientific articles available on PubMed related to vaccines written by scientists from all over the world. They are written by scientists, pharmacologists, virologists, immunologists, pediatricians, etc, etc.
There really are too few peer-reviewed papers, articles, or research from people with domain knowledge to give any scientific legitimacy to the notion that vaccines are inherently harmful. The most outspoken have little to no direct experience. Why should one believe a handful of persons with no domain knowledge over hundreds of thousands of scientists from over 150 countries?
There really are too few peer-reviewed papers, articles, or research from people with domain knowledge to give any scientific legitimacy to the notion that vaccines are inherently harmful. The most outspoken have little to no direct experience. Why should one believe a handful of persons with no domain knowledge over hundreds of thousands of scientists from over 150 countries?
Even if they are inherently harmful, over 100 years of experience has demonstrated that any potential -- still unproven -- harmful effects from vaccines are nowhere near as harmful as the diseases they are preventing.
The chickenpox vaccine was recommended in Japan in 1987. I kept hoping my kids, born 1984 and 1987, would avoid the disease until the vaccine was approved in the US. Unfortunately, a few years prior to US approval they got chickenpox back to back and were both very sick with it. It's not really something you want your kids to get.
Mine were born in 1979 and 1984. In 1990 when older daughter was 11, her doctor said she was getting old to not have had chicken pox. He said there was a new vax out for it, but he did not recommend the kids getting that until a lot more testing was done.
He said to find a pox party and let her catch it. Then her 6 year old sister would catch it too. Remember, this was not back in the stone age, but 1990, and a DOCTOR advising a pox party. They both got it together.. While my younger did not like it at all, my older daughter LOVED being off from school, and the Oatmeal baths. At 11 years old, she was old enough to listen when told not to scratch.
I do not remember my own experiences with measles or chicken pox since I was only 6 and 7 months when I got them. Ah, maybe THAT makes the case for getting these very, VERY young.
And if vaccines didn't exist for pertussis, how rapidly would it have spread throughout the entire school? The vaccination for pertussis is and always has been only 85% effective. But it is more effective against the more severe strains of the virus, which means even if a vaccinated child gets the disease his likelihood of dying from it -- or suffering long term effects -- is much less.
If anything is making vaccines "less effective", it is the anti-vaxxers that are refusing to get their children vaccinated and allowing the diseases to get a stronger foothold among the population.
I worked for a public school district. Do you know they never asked staff if THEY were vaccinated, or even more relevant, up-to-date on boosters? Show us you vax record? lol I would have had to dig up my Ped. out of his grave and ask him? While I was born before 1957 and it was assumed I had these diseases myself and immune from that, I have never gotten a DPT (now DTaP) boosters, let alone Flu or Shingles shots.
So, with all of this I suppose I am walking around as an "unvaccinated" adult. I am sure there are lot more adults walking around today in the same situation. Do you think the parents not vaccinating their children are vaccinating THEMSELVES?
I worked for a public school district. Do you know they never asked staff if THEY were vaccinated, or even more relevant, up-to-date on boosters? Show us you vax record? lol I would have had to dig up my Ped. out of his grave and ask him? While I was born before 1957 and it was assumed I had these diseases myself and immune from that, I have never gotten a DPT (now DTaP) boosters, let alone Flu or Shingles shots.
So, with all of this I suppose I am walking around as an "unvaccinated" adult. I am sure there are lot more adults walking around today in the same situation. Do you think the parents not vaccinating their children are vaccinating THEMSELVES?
Our ped certainly asked us about our vaccinations and offered boosters to parents at the same time....and I recently had a pertussis booster at my regular doctor....because it was going around the community and that is something I never want to get.
Ino the early 70s I had a classmate die of measeles.....but since you had them and lived you think it's not dangerous....which is just false. And I hope you never get the shingkes....because it's a pain like no other and cause massive complications.....but you'll find yourself wishing you had gotten the vaccine then.
Mine were born in 1979 and 1984. In 1990 when older daughter was 11, her doctor said she was getting old to not have had chicken pox. He said there was a new vax out for it, but he did not recommend the kids getting that until a lot more testing was done.
He said to find a pox party and let her catch it. Then her 6 year old sister would catch it too. Remember, this was not back in the stone age, but 1990, and a DOCTOR advising a pox party. They both got it together.. While my younger did not like it at all, my older daughter LOVED being off from school, and the Oatmeal baths. At 11 years old, she was old enough to listen when told not to scratch.
I do not remember my own experiences with measles or chicken pox since I was only 6 and 7 months when I got them. Ah, maybe THAT makes the case for getting these very, VERY young.
Well, your doctor was ignorant. The vaccine was out in Japan in the late 70s, and started being part of their recommended schedule in 1987. The US waited so long (1995) to license it b/c it was being tested. (So much for the claptrap that the US is the first to jump on any immunization bandwagon while other countries are more cautious!) When it came out in the US, many doctors were skeptical of the need. In my area, sadly, a child died from chickenpox at Children's Hospital in Denver just about that time, and the docs in the area quickly got on the vaccine bandwagon. Any doctor that was advising a pox party in 1990 was foolish indeed. Perhaps he had incipient Alzheimer's. It happens.
Kids who get diseases under a year are usually very, very sick. It's dumb enough to deliberately infect an older child; it's child abuse to do that to a baby.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48
I worked for a public school district. Do you know they never asked staff if THEY were vaccinated, or even more relevant, up-to-date on boosters? Show us you vax record? lol I would have had to dig up my Ped. out of his grave and ask him? While I was born before 1957 and it was assumed I had these diseases myself and immune from that, I have never gotten a DPT (now DTaP) boosters, let alone Flu or Shingles shots.
So, with all of this I suppose I am walking around as an "unvaccinated" adult. I am sure there are lot more adults walking around today in the same situation. Do you think the parents not vaccinating their children are vaccinating THEMSELVES?
The TdaP vaccine for adults was approved in 2005. At first, it was just recommended for adolescents, then recommendations expanded. So if you worked for the school district prior to that, there was no pertussis vaccine you could have received. DTP is only approved for kids up to the 7th birthday. It would be helpful if schools, like health care facilities required immunizations of their staffs, but so far that hasn't happened. And you are a perfect example of what happens with "voluntary compliance".
BTW, the chickenpox vaccine was not licensed in the US until 1995, so your memory is a bit faulty.
Last edited by Katarina Witt; 01-18-2015 at 08:28 AM..
Our ped certainly asked us about our vaccinations and offered boosters to parents at the same time....and I recently had a pertussis booster at my regular doctor....because it was going around the community and that is something I never want to get.
Ino the early 70s I had a classmate die of measeles.....but since you had them and lived you think it's not dangerous....which is just false. And I hope you never get the shingkes....because it's a pain like no other and cause massive complications.....but you'll find yourself wishing you had gotten the vaccine then.
Darn right its false.
I had chicken pox, mumps, and rubella. Fortunately, in my situation none of these diseases were severe. Even so, I remember I had to miss a week of school because of the mumps. This may sound like a minor point. However, when you realize that probably every child in the school missed an entire week due to a disease, there are significant economic and other costs to these diseases that need to be considered.
My friend whom I will call "Rod" got mumps about the same time I did. Rod ended up in the hospital with his disease before he got better. There can be significant "morbidity" from catching a disease like the mumps. Some men become sterile because they catch the mumps. Mumps can also cause inflammation of the pancreas or brain.
Some days, I think back and compare my childhood to that of my own children. I remember immunizations for polio, diphtheria, whooping cough, and tetanus, but not anything else. We rode around in cars without seat belts and certainly without child safety seats. I had a friend who was badly burned when she pulled the heating element out a steamer in her bedroom and poured hot water all over herself causing huge burns. Fortunately, that particular product has long since been relegated to the scrap heap. Over the years, we have suffered. We have learned. The modern world is a safer and more child-friendly world as a result of our experiences and those of the generations that came before us.
We build a better world by immunizing. We stop a small number of children from dying. We keep a larger number of children out of the hospitals. We reduce the number of children who miss out on parts of their education and we let the teachers do their jobs.
The benefits of giving these vaccinations far outweigh any risks involved.
Last edited by markg91359; 01-18-2015 at 09:25 AM..
I do not remember my own experiences with measles or chicken pox since I was only 6 and 7 months when I got them. Ah, maybe THAT makes the case for getting these very, VERY young.
That's just crazy talk. Measles has an extremely high incidence of severe complications and death in the under 5 year-old population. 1 in 20 children get serious measles pneumonia, the most common cause of death in measles. And 1 in 1000 get measles encephalitis which frequently results in death, permanent hearing loss or long-term neurological damage.
Mine were born in 1979 and 1984. In 1990 when older daughter was 11, her doctor said she was getting old to not have had chicken pox. He said there was a new vax out for it, but he did not recommend the kids getting that until a lot more testing was done.
He said to find a pox party and let her catch it. Then her 6 year old sister would catch it too. Remember, this was not back in the stone age, but 1990, and a DOCTOR advising a pox party. They both got it together.. While my younger did not like it at all, my older daughter LOVED being off from school, and the Oatmeal baths. At 11 years old, she was old enough to listen when told not to scratch.
I do not remember my own experiences with measles or chicken pox since I was only 6 and 7 months when I got them. Ah, maybe THAT makes the case for getting these very, VERY young.
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