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I'm not a doctor, but I do work in public health, and I can tell you that you don't go around "introducing" your child to E. coli, as was likely in that stream and pond water, or salmonella, like these 4H kids got. E.coli in particular can cause kidney failure and can kill young children. There are also different strains, so even if you build up some immunity to one, you can still get another. The flu virus mutates constantly, which is why we have to get the vaccine every year. Norovirus constantly mutates, so you are only immune for maybe 6 months after you get it.
I see a lot of, I'm guessing, grandparents on this thread making the mom out to be the bad guy helicopter parent. The truth is mom had a good reason to want to keep her kid out of that gross water. For kids who are big enough to follow directions and wade not swim, and not splash enough to ingest the water it is probably safe enough. For little kids who might fall, or put their face in the water, it might not be.
We all know how dangerous E coli, and the rest are. It shouldn't be news to anyone. No one is saying to forcibly expose anybody to anything like e coli, or salmonella??? That is just plain silly. Those outbreaks are not normally happening. That is why they are called OUTBREAKS. E coli is also a natural part of our body systems, but in tiny numbers. It's when those numbers are large, and overwhelm our defense system that we get in trouble. And don't forget that most of the outbreaks like that have been from items from the produce section like greens, and strawberries. If it was from e coli the other kids would have fallen ill, and they didn't. It may have been from an exposure that happened before he ever got to that place since it came on very quickly.
One very important fact is that our immune system is in our gut. It is built up with the beneficial bacteria found in the soil, and in foods that haven't been processed to death. Actually we have good bacteria all over, and inside our bodies. There are more good bacteria than human cells all living in a symbiotic relationship.
That is what being outdoors can do for you besides plenty of fresh air, and sunshine. Of course there are things that can hurt you. Does that mean you should hide inside the house forever? Of course not. It's just part of life.
No one has said that the water is gross. That is conjecture. The mom said to stay out of the POND since the kids can't swim. The creek was never mentioned. The hives were most likely from stinging nettle which is common around wet areas. The runs may have had nothing to do with the water, or candy unless the child ate a lot more than the one he admitted to.
We all know how dangerous E coli, and the rest are. It shouldn't be news to anyone. No one is saying to forcibly expose anybody to anything like e coli, or salmonella??? That is just plain silly. Those outbreaks are not normally happening. That is why they are called OUTBREAKS. E coli is also a natural part of our body systems, but in tiny numbers. It's when those numbers are large, and overwhelm our defense system that we get in trouble. And don't forget that most of the outbreaks like that have been from items from the produce section like greens, and strawberries. If it was from e coli the other kids would have fallen ill, and they didn't. It may have been from an exposure that happened before he ever got to that place since it came on very quickly.
One very important fact is that our immune system is in our gut. It is built up with the beneficial bacteria found in the soil, and in foods that haven't been processed to death. Actually we have good bacteria all over, and inside our bodies. There are more good bacteria than human cells all living in a symbiotic relationship.
That is what being outdoors can do for you besides plenty of fresh air, and sunshine. Of course there are things that can hurt you. Does that mean you should hide inside the house forever? Of course not. It's just part of life.
No one has said that the water is gross. That is conjecture. The mom said to stay out of the POND since the kids can't swim. The creek was never mentioned. The hives were most likely from stinging nettle which is common around wet areas. The runs may have had nothing to do with the water, or candy unless the child ate a lot more than the one he admitted to.
I said the water is gross. That's my opinion, not conjecture. As for the rest of it, maybe read what I was responding to before taking us off on a tangent. My point, since many seem to have missed it, is that there are actual reasons that mom may not have wanted him in the water, for example the farm upstream, and the poop runoff from it.
Last edited by Kibbiekat; 08-20-2018 at 07:02 AM..
To me, not letting your child eat his Halloween candy and then eating it yourself does not seem right. Don't the parents "practice what they preach" about healthy eating?
Do the parents "practice what they preach" about healthy eating? In a word, "NO". DD is a vegetarian who owns a health food business, takes organic supplements regularly, drinks daily frozen lattes, and can eat vast amounts of chocolate, Son in law has always been a junk food junky who eats fast food burgers and sausage pizza. I asked my grandson what he's going to say if a school friend offers him sweets at lunch. "No thank you." "What if a school friend offers you meat?" "No thank you, I'm a vegetarian".
Yesterday, we took grandson to Penney's to shop for his school clothes. They have the uniform pants and polo shirts required at his school, but he doesn't like them (neither would I). His mom already ordered the shirts, and I thought, "This is going to be easy, just have him try on a pair of khaki pants, and a pair of navy pants that fit, and buy three of each." Like most four-year-olds, he hates trying on pants, it was hard to find his size, his little brother was screaming to get out of the stroller, and the dressing rooms were chaos. We got away with two pairs of khakis, three pairs of navy, and a pair of navy uniform shorts. After this, I needed sustenance, and headed to Annie's for a soft pretzel and Pepsi. He was curious about what I was eating, but didn't ask for a taste. He just ate the banana his mom packed for him.
DD finally got the results from grandson's pediatrician on Friday, all "Negative". She's not satisfied with this, she wants clarification. She also wants to know how long the lab sat with the samples before testing them...it took them almost TWO WEEKS to get back to the doctor.
Last edited by Mrs. Skeffington; 08-20-2018 at 07:56 AM..
DD finally got the results from grandson's pediatrician on Friday, all "Negative". She's not satisfied with this, she wants clarification. She also wants to know how long the lab sat with the samples before testing them...it took them almost TWO WEEKS to get back to the doctor.
Most of the time when a kid gets diarrhea, the doctor doesn't even test. I'm amazed she got that far.
Do the parents "practice what they preach" about healthy eating? In a word, "NO". DD is a vegetarian who owns a health food business, takes organic supplements regularly, drinks daily frozen lattes, and can eat vast amounts of chocolate, Son in law has always been a junk food junky who eats fast food burgers and sausage pizza. I asked my grandson what he's going to say if a school friend offers him sweets at lunch. "No thank you." "What if a school friend offers you meat?" "No thank you, I'm a vegetarian".
Yesterday, we took grandson to Penney's to shop for his school clothes. They have the uniform pants and polo shirts required at his school, but he doesn't like them (neither would I). His mom already ordered the shirts, and I thought, "This is going to be easy, just have him try on a pair of khaki pants, and a pair of navy pants that fit, and buy three of each." Like most four-year-olds, he hates trying on pants, it was hard to find his size, his little brother was screaming to get out of the stroller, and the dressing rooms were chaos. We got away with two pairs of khakis, three pairs of navy, and a pair of navy uniform shorts. After this, I needed sustenance, and headed to Annie's for a soft pretzel and Pepsi. He was curious about what I was eating, but didn't ask for a taste. He just ate the banana his mom packed for him.
DD finally got the results from grandson's pediatrician on Friday, all "Negative". She's not satisfied with this, she wants clarification. She also wants to know how long the lab sat with the samples before testing them...it took them almost TWO WEEKS to get back to the doctor.
What will grandson do when the class is celebrating a classmates birthday and the birthday child shows up with cupcakes or cookies? Not eat one because while the parents enjoy treats the son can't? That is ridiculous.
We all know how dangerous E coli, and the rest are. It shouldn't be news to anyone. No one is saying to forcibly expose anybody to anything like e coli, or salmonella??? That is just plain silly. Those outbreaks are not normally happening. That is why they are called OUTBREAKS. E coli is also a natural part of our body systems, but in tiny numbers. It's when those numbers are large, and overwhelm our defense system that we get in trouble. And don't forget that most of the outbreaks like that have been from items from the produce section like greens, and strawberries. If it was from e coli the other kids would have fallen ill, and they didn't. It may have been from an exposure that happened before he ever got to that place since it came on very quickly.
One very important fact is that our immune system is in our gut. It is built up with the beneficial bacteria found in the soil, and in foods that haven't been processed to death. Actually we have good bacteria all over, and inside our bodies. There are more good bacteria than human cells all living in a symbiotic relationship.
That is what being outdoors can do for you besides plenty of fresh air, and sunshine. Of course there are things that can hurt you. Does that mean you should hide inside the house forever? Of course not. It's just part of life.
No one has said that the water is gross. That is conjecture. The mom said to stay out of the POND since the kids can't swim. The creek was never mentioned. The hives were most likely from stinging nettle which is common around wet areas. The runs may have had nothing to do with the water, or candy unless the child ate a lot more than the one he admitted to.
I had an answer all typed out when the system went down yesterday, and my post disappeared into cyberspace.
You have no idea why this child got sick and the other didn't. Maybe he swallowed more water than they did; maybe something else entirely. e. coli does take several days to develop, and we now know that the stool samples did not show e. coli.
Currently people are fascinated with the gut bacteria. I think it's like the "hygiene hypothesis" with much misinformation going around.
We don't know why the mom didn't want the kid in the pond, if it was that he can't swim or the dirty water, or some other reason.
The OP did say the child has a pretty normal lifestyle of playing outside and getting dirty. It's not like this kid is normally kept in a bubble. No one is recommending keeping him in a bubble, either.
Going to take these two together, as they both deal with food (among other things).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs. Skeffington
Do the parents "practice what they preach" about healthy eating? In a word, "NO". DD is a vegetarian who owns a health food business, takes organic supplements regularly, drinks daily frozen lattes, and can eat vast amounts of chocolate, Son in law has always been a junk food junky who eats fast food burgers and sausage pizza. I asked my grandson what he's going to say if a school friend offers him sweets at lunch. "No thank you." "What if a school friend offers you meat?" "No thank you, I'm a vegetarian".
Yesterday, we took grandson to Penney's to shop for his school clothes. They have the uniform pants and polo shirts required at his school, but he doesn't like them (neither would I). His mom already ordered the shirts, and I thought, "This is going to be easy, just have him try on a pair of khaki pants, and a pair of navy pants that fit, and buy three of each." Like most four-year-olds, he hates trying on pants, it was hard to find his size, his little brother was screaming to get out of the stroller, and the dressing rooms were chaos. We got away with two pairs of khakis, three pairs of navy, and a pair of navy uniform shorts. After this, I needed sustenance, and headed to Annie's for a soft pretzel and Pepsi. He was curious about what I was eating, but didn't ask for a taste. He just ate the banana his mom packed for him.
DD finally got the results from grandson's pediatrician on Friday, all "Negative". She's not satisfied with this, she wants clarification. She also wants to know how long the lab sat with the samples before testing them...it took them almost TWO WEEKS to get back to the doctor.
The shopping trip sounds typical. WRT food, the child has been taught what to say. Whether he will have the willpower to do this in the classroom with lots of other kids remains to be seen.
I don't know what "clarification" your daughter wants on the labs. When I worked in a peds office, we often had parents collect stool samples for "ova and parasites" if the child had prolonged diarrhea. (First step in treatment was just diet changes ([BRAT plus protein foods, fluids]) and watchful waiting. DD can ask the doc why it took so long. As far as the lab, they probably started the samples when they got them. Just my experience.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riley09swb
What will grandson do when the class is celebrating a classmates birthday and the birthday child shows up with cupcakes or cookies? Not eat one because while the parents enjoy treats the son can't? That is ridiculous.
A lot of classrooms have rules about acceptable foods these days. I would hate to be a teacher these days, with all these families having crazy rules.
Last edited by Katarina Witt; 08-20-2018 at 10:31 AM..
Reason: punctuation
A lot of classrooms have rules about acceptable foods these days. I would hate to be a teacher these days, with all these families having crazy rules.[/QUOTE]
I'm well aware as my kids are in elementary school. They only want the mini cupcakes instead of the large ones (which I agree with as the large ones go to waste).
Some parents send in munchkins from Dunkin Donuts. It's all the same at the class parties as well. I can guarantee I've never seen a kid bring in dried fruit or whatever else this kid is eating while his parents eat his candy. I am almost 6 years in with elementary.
I said the water is gross. That's my opinion, not conjecture. As for the rest of it, maybe read what I was responding to before taking us off on a tangent. My point, since many seem to have missed it, is that there are actual reasons that mom may not have wanted him in the water, for example the farm upstream, and the poop runoff from it.
How can you have such an opinion not having seen the creek.
Because there are Amish upstream doesn't mean there is poop runoff. You don't know that they have cattle, how many head or if they fence them from the stream which most farmers do.
I'd bet if it were an issue at least one of the neighbors who have the creek running through their property would be raising a stink. You wouldn't believe some of the call I have gotten from very upset folks. Just the other day someone concerned about someone else piling brush next to a creek. There was almost a shooting once over an algal bloom when the owner of the pond believed someone poured oil into their pond.
Mom said the pond, not the creek.
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