Why Is Philly Cheaper Than Other East Coast Cities? (Philadelphia: how much, lawyer)

[BajanYankee]

Originally Posted by OleSchoolFool

i already addressed this, but u keep on believing the nyc hype so i ma say this again, unless u got some kinda big shot unique to nyc type job, as a regular, middle-upper middle class person, yo pay is gon be comparable in nyc and philly, median income is almost the same while philly area is at least 40% cheaper than nyc area
now dc and boston pay even more than nyc, but philly is still at least 30% cheaper than them so the higher salaries in dc and boston are still behind their COL so in the end ur still better off in philly

That's not looking at the complete picture. NYC has a much larger immigrant (as well as Orthodox Jewish population) that brings the median income for the region way down. If you were to look at the same job in both regions, you would see that it pays more in NYC. That's the better apples-to-apples comparison after all, right?

The issue of "who's better off" is not within the purview of this thread. The thread is about why Philly is cheaper than other East Coast cities. And the short answer is that those cities have more money than Philly. It's pretty simple.

[Clark Park]

Originally Posted by rotodome

And Baltimore, which has had similar fortunes as Philly, has generally been cheaper than Philly.

Is it? Really? It was my impression that cost of living was about the same, or even slightly higher in Charm City.

[OleSchoolFool]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

That's not looking at the complete picture. NYC has a much larger immigrant (as well as Orthodox Jewish population) that brings the median income for the region way down. If you were to look at the same job in both regions, you see that it pays more in NYC. That's the better apples-to-apples comparison after all, right?

The issue of "who's better off" is not within the purview of this thread. The thread is about why Philly is cheaper than other East Coast cities. And the short answer is that those cities have more money than Philly. It's pretty simple.

i looked at the jobs
nyc jobs pay more, but not 40% more

[BajanYankee]

Originally Posted by OleSchoolFool

i looked at the jobs
nyc jobs pay more, but not 40% more

Higher salaries is only part of it. You also have a lot of people who are independently wealthy living in NYC.

And some jobs are paying 40% more once bonus is accounted for. A lot of firms still give out 100% bonuses.

[Clark Park]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Well, Philadelphia is a bigger city than Boston, so I would expect that. But Boston has more cutting edge industry that attracts a wider range of professionals.

Hope I'm not off topic, but I love conversations comparing Philly and Boston. In some ways so similar, in others - so different.

Boston - the Puritan City ... Philadelphia - the Quaker City.

Philly is more blue collar, working class, has more immigrants than Boston. Philly is bigger than Boston. We have more minorities - more African-Americans, more Hispanics, more Jews, more Muslims.

I think Boston is expensive, not only because it has the old money and the family dynasties, but because it is a more "European-style" city that is far more elegant and refined than Philly. Boston has Ivy-League Harvard, which has something like an 18 Billion dollar endowment, compared to our Ivy-League University of Pennsylvania which has an endowment of less than half of that.

On the other hand, as an Arts capital, Philly overtakes Boston. Boston has an excellent art museum, but ours is better. Our art schools like the Pennsylvania Academy of Fine Art, the University of the Arts, Hussian, Moore College, etc. make Philly a #1 city in the realm of fine arts.

[OleSchoolFool]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Higher salaries is only part of it. You also have a lot of people who are independently wealthy living in NYC.

And some jobs are paying 40% more once bonus is accounted for. A lot of firms still give out 100% bonuses.

u said people in general are paid better and not just the big shot lawyers
so like i said, nyc jobs that pay 40% and 100% more are not considered "in general", its only a few % of the total work force so you cant say things like: "in general people get paid much better in nyc", when its so few that do
u CAN say tho that in general, philly people are way better off than nyc people cuz in general philly pay is only slightly lower while COL is way lower, this is what its like for the majority of people
wall st goons with 100% bonuses are not the majority

[OleSchoolFool]

i do agree tho bout the independent wealthy people tryin to live in nyc from all ova the world raising prices for eryone else, esp since there is so little land

[drive carephilly]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Ed Rendell and Arlen Specter are not the equivalent of Ted Kennedy whose family has generations of wealth and power and is considered American royalty. John Kerry also has tons of dough and came from a family that had tons of dough. Rendell and Specter are both the sons of immigrants and do not have the aristocratic pedigree of an Ed Kennedy. Not to mention that John Kerry probably has 300 times as much money as both of those guys combined.

So what's your point? Famous politicians? We have those. Rich people? We have those. Dead Kennedys? No, no one else has those . . . so who cares?

Do you have a link to support this?

why would i need a link to support it when I can count. Draw your radius wherever you'd like - Philly has more schools.

universities - Google Maps

Well, Philadelphia is a bigger city than Boston, so I would expect that. But Boston has more cutting edge industry that attracts a wider range of professionals.

No. Boston offers a(n arguably) better quality of life. Boston has some industries that are stronger. Philly has some that are stronger. Overall, Philly is the stronger metro in terms of economic output.

[scosm]

Originally Posted by BajanYankee

Not at all. Boston is home to Ropes & Gray and WilmerHale, which are perennial Top 10-15 AmLaw powerhouse firms. Then it has major satellite offices for firms such as Skadden Arps, Weil Gotshal, and Latham & Watkins (none of these firms have offices in Philly). Morgan Lewis and Dechert are the two biggest shops in Philly and those are really national firms, not global law firms. There's a heavy focus on traditional commercial litigation and employment in the Philly market rather than the complex transactional stuff they have going on in Boston. And the Boston market pays significantly more than the Philly market. Boston, I believe, matches DC and NYC with starting associate salaries at $160K. Philly comes in around $115K to $125K and the gap widens tremendously as you move up the ladder.

I'm not sure your info is right. Dechert and Morgan are very global firms for one thing. And there is a lot of "complex" work, transactional and litigation, in Philadelphia. You should also take into consideration that the Philly metro officially includes Wilmington, which is another major legal market. I don't know if Boston or Philadelphia is stronger, but regardless they are both big players and I don't think it is a point one city is going to make over the other.

[BajanYankee]

Originally Posted by scosm

I'm not sure your info is right. Dechert and Morgan are very global firms for one thing. And there is a lot of "complex" work, transactional and litigation, in Philadelphia. You should also take into consideration that the Philly metro officially includes Wilmington, which is another major legal market. I don't know if Boston or Philadelphia is stronger, but regardless they are both big players and I don't think it is a point one city is going to make over the other.

I'm sure my info is right.

Dechert and Morgan are not "very global firms." Skadden is "very global." Cleary is "very global." Having a Beijing office with five attorneys does not make a firm "very global," particularly when labor and employment litigation is its bread and butter.

Boston's legal market is more on par with San Francisco's or Chicago's with Morrison & Foerster ("MoFo") and Kirkland & Ellis leading the pack in those cities, respectively. Wilmer Hale (which used to be two separate firms - Wilmer Cutler in DC and Hale and Dorr in Boston) and Ropes & Gray are peers of Kirkland and MoFo. Morgan Lewis, which is Philly's most prestigious law firm, is ranked a good ways down from those firms. It has more regional attorneys rather than the deep ranks of Ivy League plus attorneys you find at Wilmer and Ropes (with the exception of Penn). And in the legal market, pedigree (i.e., law school, class ranking, clerkship, firm prestige) more often than not determines the trajectory of your entire career.

Wilmington is a completely different market.